it times by the then cumbria county council. it was times by the then cumbria county council . mbria county council. it was then called in. and the government, i think it was the 7th of december 2022. then agreed it again. but it's tied up currently in a legal tangle, which is, i think, why so much of our infrastructure does get held up. but you know, despite being an environment minister, despite being a decarbonised ocean minister in transport and the chair of the environment appg, i am fully behind extracting this critical raw material in the cleanest, greenest way possible. not to mention the amount of private sector investment. and i think that's often lost on people. this is all private sector. >> it's all well and good to say that. >> but you know, the government is pushing for net zero, right? net zero means pushing up the price of electricity for these people in this room by subsidising wind energy, perhaps being the, you know, the clearest example of that. and by deindustrialising we close down manufacturing plant, we say, hooray , we're producing less hooray, we're pr

council areas relating to the county. so, for example, penrith is in westmorland council, but cumberland county, but above all that you've still got these some of these 1974 creations like cumbriad are still going to be for the moment, the ultimate reference points for our county identity. you must have thought about this a lot. >> how did it happen, particularly , i think in the particularly, i think in the 19705, particularly, i think in the 1970s, by the way, under a conservative government that whitehall knew best, that ministers decided that they really could make these changes, apparently without much consultation. obviously, certainly without a referendum or anything like that. >> well, you could ask mr heseltine about that. it will be great to get him on the program. i wanted get him here with i wanted to get him here with pam talk about it. but henry pam to talk about it. but henry smith mp , who's one of our smith mp, who's one of our champion mps, i think probably the best way the devil makes work idle hands to do . and work for idle hands to do. and if you have the feeling that you've got sort make your you've got to sort of make your mark in life, that's mark someh