. >> glenn, i wonder if you agree with that analysis, that this is about getting folks to flip? >> i do. let me follow up on cynthia's point. when you hear other witnesses like don junior, -- playing the i don't remember card, wow, all we need to do is look at what that lawyer, whiteout ethics lawyer, that want to find -- who is representing cassidy hutchinson, was telling her to do. it doesn't matter if you recall something, just say you don't, and you're gonna get away with the. that kind of exposes the ammo that was being run out of, at least a passed in teen office. so, people will say, wow, it's hard to prove somebody recall something, if they say they don't condone tell you if i don't recall was a perjury proof answer, i would have successfully prosecuted very few people over the years. it's not a perjury proof ounce. you investigate all the people around, the witness who claims not to recall, you know how many times that kind of investigation produces a witness who says, yeah that guy said he was going to the grand jury, and say that he didn't recall because he didn't want to give up his friend, his family, hi