so what is in d.c. at this point? 108 men and invalids we have here and you can defend washington and scarcely baltimore. so what do we have in washington, d.c.? we have elements of the u.s. treasury department guard. [ laughter ] not the most elite force and this is a cool image. you have elements of the federal reserve corps. they'll see pretty heavy action during the battle, and here's another image of the invalid corps wearing their famous uniforms and you can see the officer there is missing his arm. and they see them unattached and there will be a couple of regiments in defense of the capital. you have 100 day national guard troops organized in 1864 to fill quotas. these men men if they sign up they'll avoid the draft and the soldiers from port stephens are the 150th ohio national guard and they're normally college students. the earliest veterans. so we'll speed this up a little bit. we'll talk about the battle now and you'll see the route that they'll take to washington d.c. that will be coming from frederick m

it's a big, big deal in washington, d.c. in 1851. the same result, the jury finds for susan armstead, that robert was not of sound mind and the will -- the deed is not valid. eleanor bell does not win -- she is not liberated until the summer of 1862 in the civil war. great question. let's turn finally to the -- let's step back. as we wrap up here, let's think about the significance of freedom suits broadly as an avenue of anti-slavery constitutionalism. when we step back and we think about what we learned today, what the story of james ash tells us and daniel bell and ann bell, let's consider what are the sources of anti-slavery constitutionalism? well, one source that scholars have looked at, one dimension of anti-slavery constitutionalism are the lawyers like joseph bradley. we talked about his argument. lawyers who, to be sure, helped enslaved families bring these cases and made arguments that were anti-slavery and clearly aimed at laying down a track of argument, right, that is -- that slavery is not guaranteed by the constitutio

[applause] washington, d.c.s more than just the capitol and the white house, but because we host them we hear about all the partisan bickering all the time, from the white house we hear fear mongering and indecisiveness. but let me tell you why i am hopeful about the future of our nation. we can solve our nation's most pressing problems, if we have the right leader in place to turn innovative ideas, or as i intoto say, fresh ideas, reality. and mike bloomberg is the only candidate who will unify our country and defeat donald trump! [applause] and has a blueprint to rebuild america and improve the quality of life for all americans. he is committed to giving every american a fair shot through his housing affordability and all-in economy plan, putting an end to gun violence with common sense gun reform, and mitigating the causes of climate change. years,own mike for many and i know firsthand his long-standing commitment to making cities stronger, more prosperous and more inclusive, and that's why today i'm endorsin

i'm the mayor of washington, d.c. my hometown, the greatest city in the world, and soon to be the 51st state. [ cheers and applause ] today we're here to talk about the future of d.c. and the future of our nation. whenever washingtonians engage in that conversation, we must start with writing a wrong. 700,000 washingtonians do everything the rest of the people in the country do every day. we pay our taxes, we serve in the military, we run our city well, yet we do not have a vote in congress. and as i said before, i was born without representation, but i will not die without representation. [ cheers and applause ] so we will march on until we achieve full voting rights in d.c. and statehood for washington's 700,000 residents. now, are you with me with that? washington, d.c. is more than just the capital in the white house. but because we host them, we hear about all the partisan bickering all the time, from the white house we hear fearmongering and we hear indecisivene indecisiveness. we can solve our nation's pressing

washington, d.c., as you know is the nation's capital.es on here affects the entire nation and potentially the world. you as potential president of the united states, how would you work with mayor bowser in making sure that washington, as dr. king talked about, it's the light in darkness, and actually reflects the ideals this country really should value? mr. bloomberg: the first thing i'd do is try to change the name from mayor bowser to governor bowser. seriously. i think washington, d.c. has 700,000 people and it represents this country. i think if you take a look at what mayor bowser has done to this city in terms of improving schools and improving -- reducing crime and working on the homeless problem, which all cities have, a whole bunch of other things, she's as much a model for what a mayor should be as anybody that i have ever met and i don't say that lightly. i have lots of friends who are mayors and a lot of them are really great people but she's one of the top -- you have to put her in the top five or 10 in the whole country and

specially inside the administrative state but i think in d.c. there are there are obviously a part of the whole system that find democracy wildly inconvenient that it's one of these inconveniences where you know the elections come and go but that doesn't change administrative state and they look at that as a date of kind of a quaint little notion of what we used to be quaint guess what they are what we're going to be here long after every. a little appointee comes and goes we will still be here and decade or 2 or 3 from now we're the ones that decide this is the ultimate question are we going to be able to break the administrative state and i remind people trump came to drain the swamp the very foundation of the swamp is the administrative state break the state you drain the swamp and you want to jump in and orlando go ahead i got i got i got to i've got to push back here on this. first narrative me right now you have julianna songe in belmarsh being extradited by the trump administration to the u.s. you know i think they could they could easily

[cheers and applause] it is time for d.c. to become a state with full roting -- the unfinished business is the vote oning rights and as president i will work with congress to make -- with full voting rights and as president i will work with congress to make that happen. but first, we have to win a primary. so today i'm asking for your help, your support and your vote and i'm asking to you join our campaign for change, for sanity, for honesty, for inclusion, for compassion, and for human decency. thank you. this is a campaign to build an america to be proud of. an america for all people. black, brown, white, urban, rural, suburban, gay, lesbian and transgender. so let me leave you with it final thought. -- with this final thought. if you want quality in health insurance for everyone, if you want to make college for ad moreable and relieving the crushing burden of student loans, if you support my commitment to quality public education no matter what zip code you live in, if you share my belief in opportunity for all and not jus

no one here in d.c.going to do anything about this because fundamentally this is a town of followers, not leaders. and the only way we would do something about it is if you were to create a wave in other parts of the country and bring that wave crashing down on our heads. and i said challenge accepted. i'll be back in two years. and that's how i came to run for president. that's why i'm here with you today. we have to rewrite the rules of this economy so you're not getting sucked dry by these megacorps that are laughing all the way to the bank. we have to see that that value actually comes back to you. now, you know i want to give every american $1,000 a month from the ads or whatnot. raise your hand if you thought that was too good to be true, a gimmick, not possible. i understand. but it's not my idea, and it's not a new idea. thomas payne was for it in the founding of our country. martin luther king fought for it in the '60s. a thousand economists including milton freeman endorsed it. it passed the ho

hundreds of lawsuits in washington, d.c. hundreds in st. louis, missouri. lawsuits in new orleans, in baltimore, in various parts of maryland and virginia. there were thousands of these lawsuits. some of the same concepts we see in dred scott, which we will talk about in a minute, come up in earlier cases. notably, one case you have looked into, mcqueen against john hepburn. what were the central elements of that case in 1813? anybody? >> her grandmother or great-grandmother was free, that she was free. they overruled most of the testimony she presented. >> right, good. excellent. the queen mcqueen case was based on the claim she made that her ancestor had been taken to england and resided on free soil for three years before coming to the maryland colony. instead of being sold as an indentured servant for seven years, she was effectively enslaved upon her arrival in the maryland colony. this ancestor had been from new spain, ecuador, present-day ecuador. she was perhaps african, perhaps indigenous native american from that area of south america, and had bee

>> you mean the folks in d.c.? >> yes. there's an organization. it's for d.c. statehood. i know it's a push going across the country. >> i'm for a statehood for d.c. >> thank you. >> they pay taxes. if you pay taxes you should have a representative representing you. i like that question too. this are good questions here. >> last question. >> what's your plan to distribute the money and within in that, how do you plan on combatting fraud so people not taking other people's $1200 a month? >> i'm going to quote a friend of mine, somebody you will appreciate it. andy stern said our government is not great at my things but it's exceptional of sending large numbers of checks to large numbers of people promptly and reliably. if fact is our government is pretty good at this. all you would need to do is verify who you were, social security number, have an account we could transfer it in and you'd be good to go. the toughest part is a lot of people won't have the wherewithal to plug into these resources because they are out on the street, addicted to drugs or in some other state of

we had a very successful hearing on d.c. statehood, but we know there is so much more that we can do. we know that achieving statehood ,ould more than honor dr. king it is a way to fight back against cruel policies coming out of our current administration, like the one we are very concerned about, where thousands of americans would be kicked off of their snap benefits. instead, we need to focus on making bigger investments. i am very honored that we're here together to fight. we know the big issues, housing, protecting our communities against gun violence, fighting climate change and increasing opportunities for all americans. and we look forward to the residents of washington, d.c., with our two senators, to be right with you. god bless you all. [applause] mr. sharpton: give the mayor another hand. [applause] let me acknowledge several of our partners in civil rights that we're honored to have joining with us. certainly we're honored that christine clark is here. stand up, ms. clark. lawyers, committee. spencer overton is h

washington, d.c. mayor murial bowser yesterday endorsed former new york city mayor michael bloomberg for president. after she spoke to mr. bloomberg delivered or marks on affordable housing. >> thank you. good afternoon, everybody. >> good afternoon, everybody. he is super humble. of makinghe forefront sure the transformation of h street northeast includes everybody. everybody. i'm muriel bowser, the mayor of washington, d.c., my hometown. the greatest city in the world. and soon to be the 51st state. aboutwe are here to talk the future of d.c. in the future of our nation. whenever washingtonians engage in that conversation, we must start with righting the wrongs. washingtonians do everything that americans in the 50 states do every day. we pay taxes, actually more than our fair share of taxes, we serve in the military, we run our city well. it we do not have a vote in congress. i was bornid before, without representation, but i will not die without representation. wewe will march on until d.c.ve voti

wanted to send a message to the enslaved across washington, d.c. and maryland that -- to teach the enslaved a lesson not to run away, not to escape. so they would be sold. they were sold south as a deterre deterrent. mary and most of the children were taken to baltimore for sale to be sold. this is the scene you just saw in the short film. they were taken from the b and o railroad station in washington, d.c. to baltimore. daniel is desperate trying to intervene and possibly stop the sale of mary and the children south. at that moment daniel is sort of bludgeoned by the train conductors. the train pulls away.

memorial in washington, d.c. interior secretary david , virginia lieutenant governor and others offer remarks. good morning, everyone. great to see you all here today. i'm here from 93.9 with dominique and it is very much an honor to be here today on behalf of radio one to celebrate the life and legacy of reverend dr. martin luther king jr. and i want to welcome each and every one of you to the nint

what do you think the folks in d.c. said to me? on, nevada..at number one, we cannot talk about this. that is verbatim. number two, we should study this. number three, we must educate and retrain all americans for the jobs of the future. we have all heard that. it sounds all right, but i'm a numbers guy. do you want to guess how effective the government-funded retraining programs were for workers who lost their manufacturing jobs in the midwest? you know it is low because you know people. if you have hundreds of thousands of manufacturing workers who lose their job, they don't say i am here for my coding program. to --ccess rates wer 0% were 0% to 15%. almost half workforce and never worked again. -- left the workforce and never worked again. we have seen drug overdoses and suicides. america'she last time life expectancy declined three years in a row? world war ii is a good guess. great depression is a good guess. it is the spanish flu that killed millions. you have to go back that far because it is unusual for life expectancy to go down in a d

life in d.c. was not lived in a vacuum.as impacted by by the events overseas, especially the on slight of the war machines. as the drumbeats of war grew louder, america was sharply divided between the interventionists, ready to confront fascism and totalitarian threats and the isolationists led by anyone know the group that led the isolationists? america first. america first whom detractors called that not see transition belts. maybe today we could call the latest incarnation of american first the russian transition belt. [laughter] i will stick with history. hans and bb are the first of five main characters to whom i've tried to tell the story. so i would like to briefly tell you about the other three. meets mosso cotto he was a pure he was born in japan, came to the u.s. for college, later covered the league of nations in geneva and london. as a fully accredited member of the press, he can go places and hear things that is diplomats can't. which is perhaps why he was rumored to be a spy. and the fbi bugged his apartment.

when my grandfather did pass and the d.c. ceremony began, the night before president-- i'm sorry, melania, first lady trump invited the family out to the white house to check out the christmas tree i was an incredible gesture and my uncle invited the president to come over to the blair house. i didn't have a chance to witness that. i think a few members. audience were and looking to one of my grandfather's former aides and they exchanged a few jokes here and there and he could probably share some of those jokes, but all to say that there's much made about the politics out there, but behind the scenes, i think there was a moment and it's a shame that it requires a death to make that happen, but that's what i loved about the d.c. part of it, really just tune out the white noise. now it started back up after, but it's good for the country to have that for 72 hours, it's good for the soul. >> do we have any more or-- >> oh, okay. i'm sorry, we're out of time. thank you so much for being with us today and not going to pieces -- [a

from the city of washington, d.c., would you welcome on behalf of mayor washington, d.c., secretary oforial former mayor and current city councilman, vincent gray. is he here? ok. he will be here a little later. how about some remarks from today's partner for the city's program, joan mooney, president and politics. let's give her a round of applause. good morning. [applause] joan: thank you, thank you harry johnson for your leadership in making the vision of the king memorial a reality. and thank you, likewise, to vickers, the board of directors, and the staff at the memorial fund to gather as here each january -- gather as here each january in the shadow an image of our nation's nonviolent revolutionary, a bold leader who changed the world with a force more powerful than any military won. an audacious love for all mankind, that have the power to take down the mightiest walls of oppression and alienation. it is humbling to be with you all to honor dr. king today, who called on each of us to imagine the best of ourselves and the best of one another. at the very heart of the movement, he

side and from washington d.c. you ought to night the nation all the general solomonic the administration is also it shifting rationales for that strike i mean saying that it was about an attack against american individuals which was imminent embassies potentially about be attacked and then we have to penton refusing to confirm any and all we any closer to knowing the facts or. i don't think so as one of the senators put it he said we're not seeing evidence of this and then attack because i suspect that the evidence doesn't even exist and this is not only democratic senators and members of congress some republicans also from congress have been coming out against the administration basically asking for the justification of this massive aggression now they're warning might have retaliated once in a way to not as delayed this one specific at result but the proxy war is not going to go away and but now. we're hearing all of these contradictory reports and statements from the administration that don't really match the i

. -- no, he following proceedings in washington, d.c.y, good to have you with us. you have been watching these proceedings, incredibly long hours. they get 24 hours. what are we down to with the countdown? ake these opening cases? >> when the prosecution, the democrats, began again at 1:00 today, that is about two hours ago, a little over, they still had 16 hours and 42 minutes left . effectively, they're going too another eight hours today and another tomorrow. and then thent pres's defense, they will get their allotted 24 hours over three days. they may not take all of that time, we are their case is straightforward, if you like. there is nothing to see here. it certainly does not contain the vasts quantit of details on text messages and emails you are seeing from the prosecution. >> thank you. i imagine we will be watching over the next few hours, and t's see what it brings forth. we will be checking in ain in the next hour. let's move on instead to australia. three american firefighters have been killed while helping to battle the bu

no one here in d.c.l do anything about this because fundamentally, this is a town of followers not leaders. the only thing we will do anything about it is that you create a wave and other parts of the country and bring that wave crashing down on our heads. i said, challenge accepted. i will be back with a wave in two years. [applause] this,d, you may not know but you are the wave. you are the most powerful people in our country today. i know it does not feel like it. you are living your lives, doing your thing, showing up to your local intermediate school on a saturday afternoon because you thought the weather was going to be worse than it is. but i have done the math. manyny -- do you know how californians each of you is worth as far as voting power? 1000 californians each. if you look around this room umpian i will give a trampy estimate. there are 1000 people in this room. [applause] easily. biggest room in history. [applause] there are about 200 of you in this room. voters ismpshire's the equivalent

that is what i love about the d.c. part of it, it is just to tune out the wha white noise -- now it started again after that -- and it is good for 72 hours. it was good for the soul. >> do we have any more? ok, we are out of time. thank you so much for being with us today. [applause] [laughter] >> susan will be signing. >> quite a few. [laughter] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2020] [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy, visit ncicap.org] [indistinct conversations] >> c-span's washington journal, live every day with news and policy issues that impact you. coming up friday morning, we will talk about efforts to raise the minimum wage with the national employment law project. and then a discussion of the skill gap in the future of work with richard wang. washingtonn's journal, live at 7:00 eastern friday morning. join the discussion. >> live friday on the c-span networks, the u.s. house returns at 11:00 a.m. to close out t

and jing and establishment inside of washington d.c. i write about this in my new book restoring the republic in which i talk about d.c. has become a system of government that is run by a ruling class of both republicans and democrats hip obviously bolstered by their special interest cronies and they've linked the system to benefit themselves not the american people and then lo and behold donald j. trump shows up and goes i was elected by the will of the people by the means laid out by the constitution i am coming to represent the american people's interest on foreign policy and domestic policy and this ruling class and their cronies and the administrative state actor said we don't think so we think we're the ones to decide and trump says no i decide i'm the one that won the presidency i decide to mess to conform policy inside the executive branch and i tell people peter this all the time if you really want to have a concise explanation of why the last 3 years have taken place and all of this craziness it's about who decides and in a co

[applause] i do think the time has come for d.c.o become a state with full voting rights and as president i will work with congress to make that happen. [applause] i believe i am the only candidate with three mayors serving as cochairs of my campaign and they are three of the most respected mayors in the country. steve benjamin of columbia, south carolina. [applause] greg fisher of louisville, kentucky. [applause] michael stubbs of stockton, california. [applause] our political cochairs are two former mayors, michael nutter of philadelphia. [applause] and manny diaz of miami. both have done a great job for their cities. [applause] i guess you could say our campaign has its own u.s. conference of mayors and if you would like to join, we would love to have you. just be sure you sign up at the end. seriously, it is no secret that i am a big believer in the power of cities and communities to drive change. bloomberg philanthropy is has a supported layer -- supported mayors and leaders and i've worked with many of you over the years. we w

. >> all eyes now on washington, d.c. before we delve into what america has options going forward, let's cross over to foreign correspondent matt bradley. you just heard the threat there coming out of iran with the possibility that the united states escalates. a a lot of scenarios to get to, but it's clear now that iran would activate and would use its most powerful militia to attack israel. what is the isn'tment there this morning in uz real following last night's developments and escalation? >> reporter: i'm probably going to know more in a couple minutes because right now benjamin netanyahu, who is the prime minister of israel, the embattled prime minister of israel, is now addressing the nation. this was a previously scheduled speech, but he's likely to address the tensions that are on going with iran is and a lot of other problems he's facing in office. we're hearing from the iranians through their news agency that they would be targeting in the case of a u.s. retaliation either hifa in tel aviv as well as half a mil

memorial in washington, d.c. interior secretary david , virginia lieutenant governor and others offer remarks. good morning, everyone. great to see you all here today. i'm here from 93.9 with dominique and it is very much an honor to be here today on behalf of radio one to celebrate the life and legacy of reverend dr. martin luther king jr. and i want to welcome each and every one of you to the ninth annual wreathlaying and day of prayer in reconciliation here at the martin luther king jr. memorial. it is definitely an honor to be here. one of the most beautiful and impactful and serene memorials that we have here in washington. it is so exciting to know that many of you supported building this memorial. it has become the fifth most visited memorial at our nations capital. round of applause for that for sure. i am proud to be one of those who this memorial was built for, a strong person of color, hbcu graduate. i have benefited from the life of dr. martin luther king jr. he is a man whose life was taken at the ag

stay in d.c.ith fox news's kevin corke on the house war powers resolution being voted on right now. kevin? reporter: as we speak. here's the thing, senate republicans will tell you, susan this is never going to make its way past the senate. this will not be binding, it is not going to be law. it will be a non-binding resolution when it does pass our expectation. we have chad pergram on the ground at the capitol. let me tell you this, this has a couple of ways you can look at it. on one hand this is certainly a tone setter for the house. representatives would like the american people to know, for that matter, they would like the world to know that they are going to do all they can to constrain this president, especially if he decides to further engage or escalate the circumstance between the united states and iran. now, the other way to look at this. senate republicans, for that matter, a great number of house republicans will tell you, because this is a, non-binding, b it will not be a law, c, thi

by partisan basis in fact i think it's the only point of true bipartisanship in d.c. is corporate influence over government let me ask you this question and it seems to me as an observer that the cost of lobbying which is legalized corruption in america is pretty cheap like $400000.00 you get a lot changed it could result in a 1000000000 or $2000000000.00 and your bottom line should america at least have the decency of raising the cost of corruption i think so i think you're absolutely right that it should cost a little more to buy off your local member of congress or the present united states i am actually shocked at how inexpensive it is for corporations to buy their way some candidates of course are making this a focus right so elizabeth warren has come out with excessive lobbying tax over $500000.00 you get tax starting at 35 percent goes up to 75 percent over $5000000.00 with something like that work i think so i mean typically you want to tax bads we did that with cigarettes where you put in a punitive tax to reduce the consumption of that product i think introd

but not necessarily but absolutely the problem plaguing d.c. is this this corrupt revolving door where former members of congress the year they're lose their election or they retire they get to immediately waltz into an unbelievably lucrative career of lobbying their former colleagues that's outrageous and i think that is what permeates d.c. . and causes a lot of the problems so i think a permanent ban on the ability of these lawmakers and their top stuff from serving as a lobbyist is a great start all right well we got to take a break when we can. back much more talk on lobbyists and draining the swamp 2020 front running stay there. must leave. you force me. to. change. the law. so what we've got to do is identify the threats that we have it's crazy. let it be an arms race. dramatic to follow to the only. i don't see how that strategy will be successful. to sit down and talk. welcome back to front running cloying connie and max hazare and stacy herbert yeah we're talking about lobbyists and draining the swamp well we have established that basi

when you to run the mechanics of washington d.c. and we have to remember you know the $2800000000.00 that was spent on lobbying last year that is just a fraction of their total advocacy budget lobbying is only those direct expenditures that corporations and others spend to meet with federal officials in the executive branch or with congress that doesn't include their ad budgets their grassroots spending or their political contributions to either political action committees or contributions directly to candidates or old the dark pools of money because of citizens united so corporations continue to set the agenda for most of the issues that americans face every day you know alan i was amazed 1008 during that crisis the citibank came in and other lobbyists in the industry came in to write the response to it you know the same like there was no government officials anywhere around there were you shocked by that or were thoughts on that citibank was also responsible for getting rid of the volcker rule which was part. of following up on th

and the problem is the d.c. so many of these regulatory appeals is still very skewed with -- especially obama nominees who are much more deferent shl to all sorts of agencies. >> i want to throw it to the audience. please make your question actually a question. 10 to 15 seconds or i'll be forced to cut you off. firsthand over here. >> i don't mean for this question to come across as too lawyerly, but i am one. can you comment on whether the administrative procedures act needs to be reformed, and in terms of really reigning in the administrative state? thanks. >> go ahead, both of you. >> i can't say that i can go into detail about the administrative procedure act, but i can say the chevron case ignores the administrative procedure act. that's the central problem with chevron, and it was only within the last few years that the court appeared to become understanding that what they had done was for years left out of consideration an act of congress, administrative procedure act adopted in 1946. they ignored it. so

reporter: a lot of people reacting to mayor bowser's tweet this morning, d.c.esidents and voters concerned about your earlier stance as mayor with stop and frisk. what would you say to particularly african-americans in washington, d.c., about their concerns over that? mr. bloomberg: i'm a father and i would not be happy if one of my children were stopped on the street. when i got to city hall back in january 1 of 2002, i found 650 murders a year. one of the rights that i have to protect when i'm mayor is the right to live. it's one of the most basic ones. and we adopted the same strategies that all big cities use. what happened by my third term is, without -- maybe i didn't have my eye on the ball, i don't know what, but it all of a sudden we were having a lot more stop and frisks. took a look at it, questioned whether it worked, decided it didn't, cut 95% of them out before i left office. but i've continued, after i left office, to fight the n.r.a., continued to fight the nra. lower recidivism rate. we cut that by 40%. formed in organization to get guns off th

but not necessarily but absolutely the problem plaguing d.c. is this this corrupt revolving door where former members of congress the are there lose their election or they retire they get to immediately waltz into an unbelievably lucrative career of lobbying their former colleagues that's outrageous and i think that is what permeates d.c. . and causes a lot of the problems so i think a permanent ban on the ability of these former lawmakers and their top stuff from serving as lobbyists is a great start all right well we got to take a break when they come. back much more talk on lobbyists and draining the swamp 2020 front running stay there. vestment to become metrics bills to come to economic development. most people think about trade they think about goods and services being exchanged between countries and the investor a chapter of a trade agreement as opposed to something very different but won't win investment leads to toxic manufacturing that destroys sacred sites all the environment. that means if local communities that are being poisoned i

the d.c. circuit said the district court clearly abused its discretion, without deciding whether to grant on that bases it remanded and telling the district court why don't you reconsider. i don't think that's a material distinction between ordering the court to say you have clearly error and grant -- why don't you reconsider it. >> the court seems to have thought there is a big difference in granting the relief in doing that and that's i think why the question is well taken. that's why i am sorry, maybe you can explain to us why you meet the three requirements for getting the relief? >> again, at the first prong, let me say one last thing about that. the reason why i don't think why there is a difference is because when you tell a district court they clearly abuse their discretion and why don't you reconsider? only two things are going to happen. a reasonable district court will grant the certification. >> you need clear abuse of discretion to grant the release. >> that's the first prong. >>