. >> next, we talk with daina ramey berry about the economics of slavery. of "the price for their pound of flesh: the value of the enslaved, from womb to grave, in the building of a nation." we recorded the interview at the organization of american historians' annual meeting in philadelphia. ho

. >> next, we talk with daina ramey berry about the economics of slavery. she is the author of "the price for their pound of flesh: the value of the enslaved, from womb to grave, in the building of a nation." we recorded the interview at the organization of american historians' annual meeting in philadelphia. host: 2019 marks the anniversary of the first african-american sold into slavery in the united states. where were they from? daina: they came from different parts of west africa. they were taken on a ship and captured by the dutch, been -- then captured again off a portuguese ship. when you look at the journey, there were two different points when they were on ships. host: how do we know about them? daina: we know about this from ship records. we also know about this from the virginia records. we know very little information about them but we have bits and pieces. >> what do we know? we know that they arrived and they were not listed as end slaved -- listed as enslaved, they were servants. we know that they came and they were pretty sick when i got off