dave ramsey is with us, multinational best-selling author.king about personal responsibility. a lot of politicians, the president of the united states looking at revisiting college student loan forgiveness am a clever way to do a end run around the supreme court. what do you think of that? >> it has gotten completely out of control but the student loan program is an epic failure. we have one. $7 trillion in debt. they are so horrible we have to talk about what we are giving them and congress and the president are so until actually dishonest, they make the loans. if there's a horrible way to talk about forgiving them, we should stop making them first before having a discussion about forgiving the existing loans. neil: i will take that on as my own idea. you raise a good point. keep digging home, put down the shovel, we keep doing it. this is something robert f kennedy junior of all people, to say we compound these education ills because for every piece of loan relief kids get it costs tuition, board and this other stuff so feed the beast about

host of the dave ramsey show, dave ramsey himself. hi, dave. you helped me get out of debt.ur show and 10 years ago, i was in massive debt and you told me to start with credit card that was smallest and i slowly got out of debt. i remember the day. a lot of people are experiencing that. what tips do you have? >> my daddy used to say 90% of solving a problem is knowing there is one. be problem aware. october is coming. student loans have to be paid. i'm sorry, it is hard, you have to face this. okay. running over and -- facing the biden inflation problems and grocery bill, your gas bill everything gone up. i'm sorry. you have got to face this. children do what feels good. adults device a plan and follow it. you can't run over and cash out your 401(k). we have credit card debt for the first time ever. over 1 trillion last month, 1.78 trillion with 40 million people with student loan debt. people are saying, i am going to continue to spend like i always have, my life has changed. if you don't face it, you will make it worse. don't push the amazon prime button like a monkey on c