it we are delighted to have as our guest am a david unger. david is someone who makes a living by expressing opinion. the editorial opinion of "the new york times." he has been on the editorial board of the times for more than 30 years. and if you have ever read a times editorial about the military, foreign policy, or international finance. there is a good chance that david had a hand in it. he has brought a historian straining to journalism, having earned a phd in history from the university of texas at austin, and his provocative new book, "the emergency state: america's pursuit of absolute security at all costs", offers a broad historical perspective that survey is seven years of u.s. security policy to argue that the united states has gone terribly awry trying to make itself save. david's basic point is that the institutions we have built and policies we have established to ensure our national security were originally designed to fight not cmac germany and waged a cold war against the soviet union. they weren't conceived to protect us aga

. >> david: and krugman is not alone, rick unger is in his camp.ick, go ahead. >> yeah, while i love elizabeth's new glasses, i have to say... i find the rosy picture she paints of wisconsin to be stunning. there is a great irony in this election. what began as a protest, about anti-collective bargaining now turned into something entirely different. the polls show this has become about job creation. why? because, wisconsin today is dead last in the united states when it comes to job creation. >> that's not true. that is flat wrong. >> it is -- absurd. >> it is true. >> it is wrong. >> nevada is worse. >> let me give you the numbers. i'm sorry. let me give you the numbers. the governor came into office, promising 250,000 new jobs, by 2015. he has so far create roughly 5,000, jobs and, oh, by the way... >> he's creating jobs and obama is not. he's -- >> let's not get caught in the weeds and numbers, by the way, didn't another politician promise jobs? mike, what do you think? what happens in wisconsin, will it affect other states' chances to get their