ford sales chief george pipas from the ford headquarters in dearborn, there you have it, larry. his belief that, yeah, there's incremental effective for cash for clunkers, but they believe there's a churning of the market going on. >> i'm all for the forward churn. i'm just not for sprinkle helicopter money on everybody to buy cash for clunkers. >>> the strong sales numbers at ford helping to push stocks higher, not hurting sentiments, some better than expected manufacturing data. the ism was a mini blowout, highest level in a year, showing contraction slowing in july, but look at the real story with this is underneath the headline number, which is almost 49, new orders up -- new orders at 55, up from 49, well above expectations. production rising by six or seven points by 52 1/2 to almost 58, that is a surprisingly strong manufacturing number. and that is one reason why the indexes are up nicely.y. now the dow is up 85 and change, almost at 1% gain, the s&p is up 10, now it's up 10 points and the nasdaq was up 16. let's see, the naz is up, 15.6 points. this ism number, trish, i