he has been around since 2015, dennis muilenburg. , you described him as turning unapologetically hard-nosed under his reign. julie: well, you know, he's -- i think boeing has always been a tough competitor. but dennis is very driven, personally. extremely charming in person, and charismatic. but again, he just -- he has this goal of making boeing a global industrial champion, sort of a 1990's era g.e. that everybody looked up to. he is -- you know, his foot is on the gas. this is a company right now that seems determined not to let up. so i think in some regards, companies reflect their leaders. so that might be true of what we are seeing at boeing today. julia: i mean, the share price has doubled since january of last year. it is the best performer in the dow, so investors clearly rewarding them at this stage. they are happy. julie: yes, absolutely. and one of the things that is kind of fascinating is g.e. has imploded for shareholders who want to have large industrial stocks in their portfolio, boeing has sort of become the only ga