offers a glimpse of the chaos that lies ahead for germany's political system and great to have derek scally with us he is correspondent for the irish times and he says german politics is finally enter the 21st century but it's been all the titians are too naive or scared to notice. and of a welcome to vent alina fun to plato she writes for the economist and she believes fragmenting politics and strong extremes are up ending germany's traditional parties with the social democrats in even worse shape than america c.d.u. . so derek i think actually many people have the impression that german politics are staged to the point of perhaps the home this that you say they are now finally entering the 21st century what does that mean it means we have sort of the reality of fragmentation happening elsewhere in europe but never really happened in germany germany was solid like a sensible pair of shoes not very glamorous but you know you can go a long way and i mean next thing will be having a sex scandal you know in germany is very staid politics but maybe everything is possible at this stage that is t