. >> schieffer: that is tom coburn of oklahoma and joins dick durbin one of the leading democrats and senator marco rubio the tea party favorite as we try again to get answers to the questions, are we on the verge of an economic disaster and why for all of the bluster does congress seem powerless to do anything about it? it is all ahead on "face the nation." captioning sponsored by cbs "face the nation" with cbs news chief washington correspondent bob schieffer. and now from cbs news in washington, bob schieffer. >> schieffer: and good morning, again, senator durbin is in springfield, illnois this morning, senator coburn is in muskogee, oklahoma, senator rubio will be along later in the broadcast, gentlemen welcome to all of you. well, the administration says unless something gets done by august 2nd, the nation will slide into default and the term backed by the full, faith and credit of the united states, the best guarantee the world has ever known won't mean what it used to mean. and who knows what impact that will have on not just our economy, but economies around the world. so we w

going to go to his sort of counterpart in these negotiations, number two democrat in the senate dick durbin, who joins us from chicago. senator durbin, speaker boehner is working on a plan that he hopes can be supported in the house. but democrats have already said no way. that is this short-term extension of the debt limit. could something like that possibly pass the senate? >> bob, let me tell you what the problem is. those who give us a rating, a credit rating for the united states of america-- moody's, fitch, standard and poors have told us "don't do that." a short-term extension of the debt ceiling is going to jeopardize our economy. at a time when the global economy is so weak, when we are facing a downgrade of america's credit rating, they have warned us not to do it. and speaker boehner is ignoring that warning. we can't do that. i'll tell you what will happen. we know that majority leader kantor walked out of the negotiations with vice president biden. we know that speaker boehner walked out of negotiations with the president, not once, but twice. and now, the reality is if we fail

there is senate majority leader reid and looks like dick durbin behind him and there is chuck schumer. and we will go to that press conference. >> senator murray asked to be excused because of a family situation, oh, good, her husband is here. tonight a bipart son majority in the senate rejected boehner's short-term plan clearly. we are seeing something we have seen a lot here in the senate but this time the country's attention is focused on it, a filibuster. a filibuster to prevent us from moving forward on this legislation. the proposal that i put forward is a compromise. we changed it even more today. we would have changed it more but as i indicated on the floor we had no one to negotiate with. the republican leader said he wouldn't negotiate with me. [ringing] >> i wonder whose that is? not mine. [ laughter ] >> your pizza is ready. [ laughter ] >> it really is a worst possible time to be conducting a filibuster. they are forcing us to wait until tomorrow morning at -- let's see today is still friday until sunday morning at 1:00 a.m. to have this vote. they are kind -- our economy

there is senate majority leader reid and looks like dick durbin behind him and there is chuck schumer. and we will go to that press conference. >> senator murray asked to be excused because of a family situation, oh, good, her husband is here. tonight a bipart son majority in the senate rejected boehner's short-term plan clearly. we are seeing something we have seen a lot here in the senate but this time the country's attention is focused on it, a filibuster. a filibuster to prevent us from moving forward on this legislation. the proposal that i put forward is a compromise. we changed it even more today. we would have changed it more but as i indicated on the floor we had no one to negotiate with. the republican leader said he wouldn't negotiate with me. [ringing] >> i wonder whose that is? not mine. [ laughter ] >> your pizza is ready. [ laughter ] >> it really is a worst possible time to be conducting a filibuster. they are forcing us to wait until tomorrow morning at -- let's see today is still friday until sunday morning at 1:00 a.m. to have this vote. they are kind -- our economy

there is senate majority leader reid and looks like dick durbin behind him and there is chuck schumer. and we will go to that press conference. >> senator murray asked to be excused because of a family situation, oh, good, her husband is here. tonight a bipart son majority in the senate rejected boehner's short-term plan clearly. we are seeing something we have seen a lot here in the senate but this time the country's attention is focused on it, a filibuster. a filibuster to prevent us from moving forward on this legislation. the proposal that i put forward is a compromise. we changed it even more today. we would have changed it more but as i indicated on the floor we had no one to negotiate with. the republican leader said he wouldn't negotiate with me. [ringing] >> i wonder whose that is? not mine. [ laughter ] >> your pizza is ready. [ laughter ] >> it really is a worst possible time to be conducting a filibuster. they are forcing us to wait until tomorrow morning at -- let's see today is still friday until sunday morning at 1:00 a.m. to have this vote. they are kind -- our economy

republican jon kyl and democrat dick durbin. we'll hear from the house majority whip, republican kevin mccarthy. also, the recovering economy takes another hit. we'll ask our sunday panel if the debt ceiling standoff has made things worse or if a deal might ease the economic pain. we look back to what a roller coaster of a week it was in washington. all right now on "fox news sunday." hello again from fox news in washington. after a tension-packed day on capitol hill, filled with bitter partisan sniping, both republicans and democrats are now saying significant progress has been made toward a deal that would avert a government default. we'll take a look at the framework of the compromise with two senate leaders and a top house g.o.p. official. but first we begin with the white house view. and gene sperling, the director of the national economic council. director sperling, welcome back to "fox news sunday." >> thank you, bret. >> bret: saturday, the debt ceiling negotiation shifted back to the white house. here is what we are hea

their country into default. >> with us now from capitol hill, democratic leaders from illinois, dick durbin" columnist charles -- >> hi, charles. >> senator durbin, great to talk to you. >> thanks, joe. >> a frustrating morning for you. you have work in the gang of six. you have made compromises that you didn't want to make. you have dealt with cranky republicans like saxby chambliss and tom coburn, locked in a room with these guys for long time. and you are willing to compromise. things that mean a great deal to you. yet it looks this morning that those who are not willing to compromise at all are going to enyou the day. what's going on? >> there are 32 senators now almost evenly divided between the two parties who stepped up and said they think the gang of six approach was a grown-up, responsible, thoughtful way to deal with the long-term deficit. we put everything on the table, revenue, entitlements, spending, and we did it in a thoughtful ball lapsed way. the same thing that the bowles simpson commission did. we know this is the path. but the notion we cannot touch hedge fund managers a

so did patrick leahy moments ago as well dick durbin. we have been hearing from all of them who have been debating this whole issue of trying to reach some compromise as the sparring continues, kate. while we wait for harry reid to speak, give us an idea of what is taking place. where are we as it pertains to these proposals? >> reporter: we're tracking a couple of things at this very moment, fredricka. one thing we're watching, we're waiting to hear from harry reid, who will be integral in reaching whatever compromise if there is a compromise, to be reached, he'll be integral in being part of those negotiations on the part of democrats here in congress. i think he's actually speaking, fredric fredricka. let's listen in for a second. >> be fairly quick. there has been a number of conversations as i walk in here about the letter i got from 43 republicans today. it is pretty interesting that the 43 republicans, a number of whom are in contact with me and others, one person who signed that letter has met with one of my democratic senators a

man who was at the last whitehouse talks, the number two democrat in the united states senate, dick durbin. >> senator mcconnellas made a good positive sgestion. we discussed it at length among the democratic senators today. with or without a deal, this motion of giving the president the debt and giving congress the power to disapprove. it's at least a viable alternative. i certainly have not rejected it. i'm working with senator harry reid our majority leader to find a way to craft that in a bipartisan approach in the senate. >> charlie: wcontinue part two with our conversation with larry summers the economic professor, harvard university president and economic as vier to president obama talking about the state of the economy. >> at the center of this if the people don't build new factories, then the factories they're using aren't fully operating. developers don't build new develoents when the developments they've already built are sitting empty with the lights out. and that's why i do keep coming back to demand. >> charlie: we conclude this evening with a conversation of the irish novel

dick durbin said. we are all for will the president have a bigger plan? plan that will take to us where we need to be? a plan that will, i think, stabilize the financial markets, give america many credit worthiness the trust its always had and at the same time a handle on our debt and deficit. now, whatever the component parts of that is, i think we can get democratic votes, if it is a balanced program, and that's the key. a balanced program. the republicans have heretocore walked out on plans that were balanc balancedthey did so in the bowles simps's commission. they did so in the biden talks, and frankly they walked away when mr. boehner and president obama were talking about a balanced plan. hopefully a balanced plan will be something that both parties can support, get a majority for and set our country on a sound, fiscal path. >> congressman, i'm grateful for the opportunity and privilege to speak to you directorly particularly at this point in time. appreciate you coming on to have a conversation with me. >> thank you, dylan. >> your thoughts? >> i t

over in the u.s., the prominent democrat senator dick durbin is calling for both an f.b.i.d a congressional investigation into whether any whether u.s. laws have been broken by rupert murdoch's media empire. allegations against the corporation race questions about whether it violated the foreign acts. we are joined from new york. thank you for joining us. looking at where the legalities lie in the u.s., tell us where the jurisdiction lies in the u.s. for this. >> the u.s. has a statute called the foreign corrupt practices act that makes it illegal for u.s. companies, but also others, to bribe foreign officials in order to get busine3ey the statute has a broad reach and it has been applied in circumstances where there was bribery of a foreign official and very little nexus to the united states. >> and looking at the phone hacking allegations, when we consider the charges that the murdoch organization are facing here regarding intercepting communications, what kind of illegal activity could that be in the u.s.? what is that termed of? >> it could be considered illegal wiretap

and i think that's something that dick durbin agreed with. earlier in the week, you remember, that john mccain called house republicans hobbitts. >> right. these guys are the grown-ups right now, shall we say, in this whole debate. >> right. yes. >> i think a lot of statesman-like positions have been taken by harry reid and mitch mcconnell on that point. you know what ip to do, i want to go back to the senate floor and listen on what's going on right now, because i think we're all going to get a little bit smarter in the process. >> mrs. feinstein. mr. franken. mrs. gillibrand. >> no. >> mr. graham. >> all right. so what they're doing is a roll call vote on this harry reid proposal to move forward. they need 60 votes in order to break a filibuster. they're not going to get the 60 votes, we're told so, the debate will continue. but they want to keep this harry reid legislation as a framework throughout there in order to -- if, in fact, there's a bigger agreement between the white house, the republicans and the democrats in the house and the se

. >> dick durbin, democrat senate wit. sounds so reasonable when you put it on paper, nina. why can they not get it done? >> i don't know why they cannot get done. i do know why. if you looat the polling data, the american public wants no changes in social security, medicare, medicaid. democrats, having desires of winning back the house, they don't want to go there. republicans have a big flank of new members elected on a pledge of no new taxes. nobody is dealing with reality. anybody on this panel, two of us could make a deal, but they cannot. >> why can they not make a deal, charles? >> you saw it in the clipou showed. nancy pelosi is the classic definition of a reaction. liberal. no changes in programs, entitlements. -- classic definition of a reactionary at liberal. no genocide programs, entitlements. if you all make -- note changes in programs, entitlements. if you don't make changes, he will wreck the economy, and everybody over the age of nine knows that. is that they are not willing to means test -- if they are not willing to means test entitlements, which you think

thank you so much. >> thank you. >> ifill: we turn to your colleague also from illinois democrat dick durbin, he also took part in the white house meeting this afternoon. welcome senator durbin. >> thank you, good to be with you. >> ifill: you just heard what congressman roskam said about taxes. i want to take that on first of all, which is is what the president is doing in these nirxs asking republicans to raise taxes? >> well, of course he is. because elise ens to their list of things that they want to achieve. i listened to it today, congressman cantor spelled out what wants to achieve. he wants to raise the cost of student loans for young people from working families. he wants to raise the cost of medicare for senior citizens. he wants to make it more difficult for hospitals that are providing med car -- medical care for the poorest people in america to be reimbursed so what they are asking for is sacrifice from a lot of people who are struggling today. children of working families and elderly people and those who are providing for the poor among us. and the president is saying you canno

with us, assistant senate majority leader, democrat dick durbin of illinois, and tea party favorite, republican senator jim demint of south carolina. finally, a roundtable discussion, a "meet the press" jobs and economy summit. we try to cut through the confusion and ask where are the jobs, how important are taxes to economic growth, where are the bright spots, and when will recovery start feeling like recovery? with us, republican governor of ohio john kasich, chairman and ceo of honeywell, david cote, former mayor of new orleans, now president of the national urban league, marc morial, chief economist for mesirow financial, diane swonk, and host of cbs nbc's "strategy session," david faber. host of cbs nbc's "strategy session," david faber. captions paid for by nbc-universal television >>> breaking news this morning. there are reports that former "news of the world "newspaper editor in britain, rebekah brooks, was arrested this morning in connection with the phone hacking and police bribery scandal in great britain. there are some calls for the justice department here in the united

you've got senator dick durbin, a democrat saying flat out yesterday's meeting did not go well. he said he said a prayer for today's meeting then you have a republican senator, saying that the white house essentially walked away from $500 billion in cuts that the two sides had already agreed to so no one right now can point to any progress that these talks are achieving. >> pelley: senator mcconnell proposed a stopgap plan today in case they miss the deadline. what was that about? >> well, it's a pretty complicated plan, scott, and it essentially boils down to allowing the president to raise the debt limit in fits and starts over the next year and a half and essentially puts off any talk of spending cuts to a later date. the plan went over with a thud among house republicans who see this as giving in, but mcconnell says that he doesn't want to be a party to default and he certainly doesn't want republicans to be blamed if there is a default, scott. >> pelley: thanks, nancy. this deal to reduce the deficit could be huge. somewhere between $1 and $4 trillion. they're talking about

republican senators, saxby chambliss, tom coburn and mike crapo, and three democratic senators, dick durbin, kent conrad, and mark warner. everyone said the gang of six was dead. what happened? >> well, listen, our reports of our demise were greatly exaggerated. >> reporter: but they'll have a sales job to do in the house of representatives, where the plan is being met with more skepticism. >> i think most members are reserving judgment. >> reporter: liberals don't like the plan's $500 billion in cuts to health programs for the poor and retirees. plus $243 billion in cuts to social security, medicare and medicaid. conservatives oppose the 1.1 trillion in new tax revenue from closing corporate loopholes and scaling back popular tax deductions for home mortgages and employer provided health care. >> gang of six? the gang of six? how about that gang of 234 people yesterday, republicans and democrats, who passed a plan that doesn't raise taxes and averts the crisis. >> reporter: that plan he mentioned did pass the house last night. but with only five democratic votes, and it will not pass in th

a broad bipartisan coalition in congress read by senator dick durbin of illinois and senator jeff sessions of alabama work to pass a new law in the senate and representatives scott and conyers it took the lead to get the new law passed under suspension of the rules in the house. of course, not all prisoners will be entitled to this reduction. why? first, prisoners whose initial sentencing was below the equivalent of the new guideline range will not be entitled to any further reduction unless they get substantial assistance. the commission estimates that over 750 prisoners already received reductions below the proposed new guideline range. second, career offenders, people who already have a very serious criminal record, will not generally get the reduction. third, as earlier stated, many prisoners will be bound by statutory minimum set under the previous statute. the proposed or selective application of the men met for reducing crack penalties prompted criticism. they describe themselves as the "boots on the ground". there discern is that the early release will create a threat to public saf

we had dick durbin on the show saying when he and barack obama voted against the debt ceiling increase as senators they knew there were enough votes to pass it. none of them were going to vote to kill the debt ceiling increase. we will see what we end up with, if we get that far. richard wolf, thank you very much for joining us tonight. >> on the last word tomorrow night at 8 p.m. eastern, bill maher, host of hbo's "realtime" on his reaction to the president and congress in the stalemate over the debt ceiling. you can have the last word

democrat number two in the senate, dick durbin and, john boehner speaker of the house. on the republican side, the people who are a problem, mitch mcconnell, certainly eric cantor, certainly -- well, leave it at that. perhaps pelosi. we just don't know. fascinating stuff. >>> coming up, what are president obama's options if he doesn't get a deal? look at a deep perhaps by august 2nd. what if he doesn't get a deal? can we bypass congress under the 14th amendment and keep the country going by executive power and force the country to meet its bills? we'll hear from a brilliant columnist says. hear what she says. this is not radical. this is constitutional. >>> you're watching "hardball," this is not radical. this is constitutional. >>> you're watching "hardball," only on msnbc. >>> talk about strange bedfellows? south carolina democrat jim demint teamed up with maine moderate olympia snow to call for a constitutional amendment to balance the budget. they pushed for this in an op-ed in today's "wall street journal." snow's up for re-election next year and teaming up with de

we had dick durbin on the show saying when he and barack obama voted against the debt ceiling increaseenators they knew there were enough votes to pass it. none of them were going to vote to kill the debt ceiling increase. we will see what we end up with, if we get that far. richard wolf, thank you very much for joining us tonight. >> on the last word tomorrow night at 8 p.m. eastern, bill maher, host of hbo's "realtime" on his reaction to the president and congress in the stalemate over the debt ceiling. you can have the last word online. you can follow my tweets at lawrence.

we'll get an inside look at the status of the debate from dick durbin and senator jim demint.it's "meet the press." you can watch it 2:00 p.m. eastern right here on msnbc. >>> record high temperatures in this country proving to be a little dangerous pap lot drougs for many people. weather channel'serric fisher is at target field in minneapolis and i can already to see the sweat beading on your forehead. >> here i thought i looked all right. you telling me i look like a hot, sweaty mess. >> go ahead. >> much of the country waking up to oppressive temperatures. walking to target field this morning, 4:30 a.m. local time 80 degrees. right now heat index values over 90. over a large chunk of the country you to see values over 90 degrees. that's a combination of the temperature on the thermometer and how much humidity is in the air. i can tell you there's plenty of humidity in the air. take a look at what they were most concerned about when they built target field. heaters ringing the stadium for those cold weather games. they won't be in use during the day today. also a place to av

. >> democrats in the senate, dick durbin and charles schumer, have begun to accuse republicans of notust not getting it, but of getting it and actually trying to sabotage the economy for partisan purposes, trying to sabotage president obama's re-election effort by making sure that there's as much economic pain in the country as possible. is that a bridge too far, or is that the kind of argument that that's going to require a response or some sort of proof to the contrary from the republicans? >> well, let me be honest. it has occurred to me that this is a possibility. i think six months ago, if democrats or progressives had said that, it would have been a bridge too far. it would have sounded shrill. it would have sounded partisan. in the current context, if the president of the democrats seemed reasonable but firm, seemed to have met the republicans more than halfway, seemed to have differed from their proposal by only two percentage points, and republicans are holding to the sort of maximalist theological position of absolutely no tax revenue increases whatsoever, then i think it be

it was signed by five wonderful democrats including dick durbin and tomcoleburn. to people, they go crazy. five republicans, five democrats, one independent. 60% of the commission voted for it. all you have to do is read it. it hits everybody. don't give me the smoke about hurting the poor. we took care of social security. we gave the lowest 25% social security. then you got veterans and defense contract. you can't do anything. the mess in the kitchen is medicare. i don't care if you call it obama care or elvis presley care, i don't care care. it's there. ryan comes up with a plan to do something about it, they crucify him. we put our plan in and if obama accepted it that day, they would have crucified him. everybody is waiting to be eaten by rats, snails and toads. >> let me ask you a question about this, when you put in the effort to be on a commission like this, you consider your thoughts, write them down, present them and in my experience, maybe most of the time the political powers who ask for it then promptly stick it on a back shelf and forget about it. how

one of the apparent converts is illinois democratic senator dick durbin. listen to his enthusiasm for it? >> something happened this morning that was perhaps historic. no fist fights. no swearing instead, democrats and republican senators said in that room 49 of them. listen to the outline of group of six proposal and came out with a positive feeling is one. >> one potential problem durbin says there is not enough time to get it done by august 2nd. shep? >> shepard: positive feeling but no real specifics in that what's the feeling about warehouse republicans are going to go for this as they get ready to vote on their own plan. >> that's one of the big questions as the house considers as we speak cut, cap, and balance right now. they're considering it as of this moment. we're watching the vote right now. expecting a vote perhaps within the next hour. it's going to pass very easily in the house. faces a much tougher road in the senate. and, of course, the president has promised to veto it. debate today split right down along party lines. >> you you drastical

democratic senator dick durbin on "meet the press" launched congressional hearings. there's no evidence at this point of any wrongdoing by any of the u.s. properties of news corp. but is this now turning into a two-front war for the company, on both sides of the atlantic? >> you can see they're absolutely terrified of having to fight this in the u.s. as well. the evidence is very thin to nonexistent that there was any phone hacking done in america. certainly nobody has uncovered any evidence that 9/11 victims were hacked. jude law has brought a lawsuit against "the sun" alleging while he was at jfk airport he knew his voice mails were being listened to. that would be criminal activity in the u.s. if it happened. what the murdochs have to do is make sure it doesn't go nerney of their titles here, the "wall street journal" or "new york post" or any properties here. >> david, i wonder if you think the u.s. part of this is hype. we have a lot of members of congress and certain liberal media types jumping on saying we must investigate. but the locust of the story is very

white house chief of staff bill daly, john kyle and senate majority whip, dick durbin.he five tv network talk shows are brought to you by the networks and c-span. meet the press, 1 o'clock, abc's this week. fox news sunday and face the nation from cbs. listen on channel 119 on satellite radio. go over online to c-span.org. >> we revisit the civil war on c-span channel. we have call-in programs beginning at 11:00 p.m. even. with matthew pinsker, get the complete schedule at c-span.com/history. >> devil in the white house, erik larson tells the story of adolf hitler. >> i stumbled upon the first ambassador of germany. tonight on c-span's q and a. >> l.a. times calls it required viewing. sunday night, at nine eastern on c-span. "washington journal" continues. host: john jarvis is the national park's director. starting his term of service back in 1976. and is here to talk to us about the state of america's national parks. back in april, when they were going through budget cuts, there was a budget cut with the national parks and a threat of government shut down. there was a

jake, thanks so much. >>> let's bring in dick durbin. thanks for getting up this morning after that late-night meeting. the president wants this big deal. we saw jake lay out the consequences of no deal what is the path forward giving the fact that republicans aren't going to go for the big deal that president obama wants? >> the president will call us again today. i'm disappointed. last thursday there was resolve through most of the leadership. something large enough to address our deficit in a serious way or in a coordinated way. bringing everything to the table and being balanced. unfortunately over the weekend, the speaker said i can't deliver. i can't produce on my side. we had congressman kantor walk out of the biden talks, as well. we both have to be willing to put things on the table and get this resolved. >> t they say that the democrats won't go for the kind of medicare and social security savings that will be necessary, as well. i want to drill down here on where you go next because that big $4. >> translator: trillion deal is

. >> there you're hearing senator dick durbin talking about process of trying to push a bill through the house. the senate hasn't gotten that yet. and yet here's what speaker boehner told the gop conference inside his meeting. an aide says that boehner says, quote, if we pass this today, we will have sent not one, two bills that would end this crisis. all it will say is the resolution to the crisis will be the senate which has passed nothing. harry reid is trying to change that. he's proposing that they move forward on his version of a bill to deal with the debt crisis to raise the debt ceiling to cut more than $2.5 trillion from the budget over ten years or so. and then you have president obama saying look, the only solution that is going to keep us from default is a bipartisan solution. that's the only way that we end this debt ceiling stalemate. let me bring in karen finny. joe watkins a former president george wh bush aide. how do republicans move out of the standoff and into a place of agreement, aka compromise? >> i think that you'll see something. you'll see an agreement on th

i quote dick durbin saying frankly the banks own the place -- talking about the senate. the power of the conservative media to distort and make impossible a sensible discussion of the problems. when you have a difficult issue like the health care bill or cap-and-trade legislation, you talk about whether or not you want to kill your grandma and is that a good idea or will the government arrest you if you put your thermostat over 72. i know you people don't have that problem here, but we have it in new york. i have a great deal of sympathy for a guy trying to talk sense to the american people to treat us like adults and make these difficult tradeoffs in a context where there's no respect for that kind of thing in our society where he has to go after being asked about it on "good morning, america" he has to show his birth certificate because a good majority of republicans don't believe he was born in this country. it's difficult to govern in that context on the one hand. on the other hand, another project i've been working on as of late is a series of columns i wrote in "th

tonight your newspaper reports that dick durbin, a member of the gang of six, says their plan, it is not ready. he went on record saying the gang of six plan has not been drafted, nor has it been scored by the cbo, it's not ready for prime time. so did the president kind of jump the begun today or was he overoptimistic? how do you read it. >> i think the white house is optimistic they can despite senator durbin's pessimistic outlook on the package that they can get it scored and voted on before august 2nd. i think that might be unrealistic. it reminds me of saying let's get healthcare and do it in two weeks, before you went through the drama of committee meetings and scoring. so i think it's monumental. we're talking close to $4 trillion in cuts, and that takes awhile to figure out, just to dot the is and cross the t's. >> also takes a long time to figure out how the republicans go along with a trillion dollars of revenue increases, which is billions of dollars a year, where they are going to come up with $100 billion a year the next ten years. what republican is willing to sign onto

dick durbin and tom coburn come together on the gang of six, one of the most liberal, one of the most conservative, we can get results here if we put the country's interest first. let me give you another idea, you made mention of the question of whether tax reform was actually doable. one of the ideas i'd like to see pursued is if there wasn't bipartisan tax reform within a date certain, what you could do as an enforcement mechanism is just go in there and give all those tax breaks, all those tax expenditures a haircut. you say, look, the best way to actually produce some more revenue is bipartisan tax reform. if you don't produce it by a date certain, we're going to go in there and get a haircut to all those tax expenditures. there's a trillion dollars worth of them. that's a way to generate some revenue. >> i think if there's not some kind of serious enforcement mechanism in the way you're describing, i think people are right to be skeptical -- >> skeptical of washington? i can't possibly believe somebody might see it that way. >> exactly. i can see a scenario where the debt ceiling

we had dick durbin on the show saying when he and barack obama voted against the debt ceiling increaseey knew there were enough votes to pass it. none of them were going to vote to kill the debt ceiling increase. we will see what we end up with, if we get that far. thank you very much for joining us tonight. >> on the last word tomorrow night at 8 p.m. eastern, bill maher, host of hbo's "realtime" on his reaction to the president