this is not to diss pemco, who had close to $2 trillion, and that is big. other institutions are big too. i will only say that it is easier with $2 billion to move money. liquidity is obviously better. it is less onerous in terms of organization and decision-making, where you have to build up a consensus and a consensual outlook in terms of what you want to do. that doesn't mean it's relative to pemco. it's the best of both worlds and it is good to get feedback and to get a counter argument. but there is a situation here in janus where i can do things that i think will make money. erik: tell me more about that. the opportunities, if you will the benefit of being small, of managing billions as opposed to triple digit billions. erik: i have to use pemco to compare. we did something that the press would observe at the end of the month or the end of the quarter, but the market would note -- you can do billions of dollars in trade without word spreading. the state of california was the big cheese. everyone was always asking -- what are they doing? that is one of