unbeknownst to rosen and donoghue, pennsylvania republican congressman scott. perry had been amongst republican members of congress who joined trump at the white house to discuss overturning the 2020 election. trump also mentioned jeff clark on a separate call with rosen. >> >> he made what i regarded as a peculiar reference. i do not member the exact quote, but something about it i know jeff clark or who he was, or something like that. i was quizzical as to, how does the president even know mr. clark? >> rosen confronted clark , who admitted he had broken the long- standing policy governing to be case between the justice department and the white house. white house lawyers pat cipollone and -- also intervened and warned clark not to interview intervene with the white house. clark agreed, but just two days later, as going to the situation with an email that set off a series of events that would rock the justice department. . >> we came in on monday, december 28th. hectic day and they all were. in the afternoon, we got the email, which i had to sit down and read

in which he was trying to get donoghue and the acting attorney general jeffrey rosen to write letterso state, specifically georgia, but also others, saying that -- lying that there were -- that the justice department had identified serious problems with the election and i asked donoghue go that. let's roll that clip if we can. >> that a letter claimed that the u.s. department of justice's investigations have, quote, identified significant concerns that may have impacted the outcome of the election in multiple states including the state of georgia, unquote. was that true? >> no. it would have created chaos in the states. i think that would have been disastrous for our country and constitution. >> wasn't that the point of that, to create that chaos? >> i think so, yes. >> so this isn't a first amendment issue despite the fact that trump's lawyer was talking about that. it's a scheme, it's a conspiracy to lie, to undo the election and perhaps even cause riots in the street >> that's absolutely right. so and i think elie honig put it well in the last segment. you cannot lie for the purpos

dan, thank you, dan 0'donoghue, who has been following this trial through out.ging you all of the reaction here on bbc news. a statement hasjust been of the reaction here on bbc news. a statement has just been released by the health and social care secretary on the announcement of an inquiry, an independent inquiry that the government has said will take place, focusing on lucy letby�*s conduct and on her crimes. steve barclay said, i would like to send my deepest sympathy to all of the parents and families impacted by this horrendous case. the inquiry will seek to ensure that the parents and families impacted get the answers that they need. the department of health says that the inquiry will investigate the wider circumstance around what happened at the hospital, things like the handling of concerns and governance. it will also look at what actions were taken by regulators and by the wider nhs. the government says that inquiry will be launched to ensure that vital lessons are learnt and to provide answers to the parents and families impacted. as we were saying,

look, rich donoghue, there is no person who we met over the course of our investigation who was more attorney in brooklyn. he moved to washington to be the principal deputy attorney general and then becomes the dag at the end after attorney general barr's resignation. he is a loyal trump supporter. everyone, nicolle, every witness in this case is in that category. bill barr, as you said, he bent over backwards to try to discredit the russia investigation, was shoulder to shoulder with president trump through his immigration policy, for so much of his policy agenda. yet the president, despite that loyalty from bill barr, from rich donoghue, continues to go down the line to the next guy who might do something unethical. they're all republicans. that is to whom he steps in this misguided attempt to find someone who's going to take unlawful action. and thankfully, there were enough people in the department of justice -- and look, i'm biased. i grew up as a lawyer in the department of justice. i have immense respect for the men and women who work there, regardless of administration, repub

i want to bring in mcauley, danny 0'donoghue. you have been here for every day of this trial.eed. nine months exactly from the opening statements to the jury being sent out to deliberate. i want to talk about the families who really at the heart of what we are reporting today. talk as to their reaction as this trial came to its conclusion. aha, this trial came to its conclusion. a lot of mixed reactions in the courtroom. we have heard verdicts over the _ courtroom. we have heard verdicts over the course of the last week and there _ over the course of the last week and there has_ over the course of the last week and there has been varied reactions over there has been varied reactions over the times _ there has been varied reactions over the times. some of them have cried and left _ the times. some of them have cried and left the — the times. some of them have cried and left the courtroom. this is a combination of years of investigation and it has finally got your point— investigation and it has finally got your point with the jury has decided to return _ your point with the jur

my colleague dan 0�*donoghue has been reporting at court every day of this trial, and it is worth takingguilty verdicts, we have reflected there that in some cases the jury was unable to reach a verdict, and for some of the families, and we heard it there in the statement that janet moore read out a behalf of the families, for some of them it is a bittersweet day, because in the cases of their children, there has not been a resolution. so break down for us what we have seen. resolution. 50 break down for us what we have seen.— resolution. 50 break down for us what we have seen. resolution. so break down for us what we have seen. today we have had seven verdicts — what we have seen. today we have had seven verdicts for _ what we have seen. today we have had seven verdicts for murder, _ what we have seen. today we have had seven verdicts for murder, in _ what we have seen. today we have had seven verdicts for murder, in this - seven verdicts for murder, in this case, making lucy letby the most prolific child killer of modern times. we have also had six verdicts backed for attempted murder

indeed it is, gary, thank you very much, our north american correspondent, gary 0'donoghue. a reduction in the energy price cap in the uk from october, the regulator 0fgem has announced meaning household bills will fall slightly. the price cap which applies to england, wales and scotland sets the maximum amount that suppliers can charge for each unit of energy but not the total bill. if you use more, you will pay more. 0ur cost of living correspondent, colletta smith has been speaking to families at a theme park in warrington. with bills racking up on all sides, there has been one relief this summer holiday. i would say probably, because we've had quite a hot spring and summer, haven't we, so i think that helped. we've not needed to have the heating on. i know there's quite a few of our friends who are really struggling to pay their electric and gas. and today's small drop in energy prices isn't going to change that, so plenty of people have been taking things into their own hands to try and get ahead. thomas and jenny from liverpool are on a prepayment meter and spent £800

joining me now is my colleague dan o�*donoghue.trial listening to the evidence in person. you sort lucy letby in the interview room speaking very quietly. what kind of picture was painted of her by the prosecution in this case? bi; painted of her by the prosecution in this case? �* , painted of her by the prosecution in this case? j , . ., this case? by the prosecution, the icture this case? by the prosecution, the picture that _ this case? by the prosecution, the picture that was _ this case? by the prosecution, the picture that was presented - this case? by the prosecution, the picture that was presented of - this case? by the prosecution, the picture that was presented of herl picture that was presented of her was that she was calculating, she was that she was calculating, she was devious, she was an opportunist and she was someone who used her normality, i think one of the police officers when asked to describe lucy letby in a word, he described her as beige. she used this cloak of normality to conduct horrific crimes. the pict

let's reflect on that with my colleague dan 0'donoghue, and you been here for every day of the trialmoore took about the evidence and for the families in particular, same for everybody it was distressing evidence to listen to. but for these families, it is the infinite —— intimate details in some cases of the last minutes of their child's lies they've had to relive again in the most awful circumstances. figs relive again in the most awful circumstances.— relive again in the most awful circumstances. a �*, circumstances. as you say, it's the worst day of _ circumstances. as you say, it's the worst day of their _ circumstances. as you say, it's the worst day of their lives _ circumstances. as you say, it's the worst day of their lives and - circumstances. as you say, it's the worst day of their lives and their. worst day of their lives and their site in_ worst day of their lives and their site in court_ worst day of their lives and their site in court day— worst day of their lives and their site in court day after— worst day of their lives and their site in court day after day- site in

jeffrey rosen, who came with a blunt yet low-key acting deputy attorney general named richard donoghue. they took seriously and thoroughly investigated each of the fraud claims coming from them president trump. in late december, richard donoghue spoke with the president and told him the truth about numerous false claims, including one involving dominion machines in northern michigan. >> there you had supposedly a site director, a cyber expert group say there was a 68% error rate. it was more like 0.006%. >> he also debunked claims about the state farm arena in atlanta, georgia. >> they were putting suitcases under a table with a black robe around. >> there were allegations about two cases of fraudulent pallets being smuggled into the facility. >> now they will pull the ballots out from under the table. >> ballots run through multiple times. a u.s. attorney looked at it and found that none of those allegations were true. >> jeffrey rosen forwarded an email from mark meadows asking the department of justice to look into the possibility that italian satellites were changing votes from tru

he had a meeting in the white house with jeff clark, one of his codefendants, jeff rosen, richard donoghue. president trump told them what he wanted them to do and they said if you do that, we will resign and the rest of the leadership of the department of justice will resign. president trump decided to not go forward with his plan. he may pay a political price with that, but there is nothing wrong with talking to inferior officers. they are suggesting that merely by talking to them he possibly could have directed them to do those things. but merely by talking to them about what he wanted to do and laying out his argument, that constitutes a criminal act. that impinges vaguely on the president's constitutional conference. taking one step back, those giving him advice and appearing before state legislature -- john y: let's pause. i have one or two more questions in point about how donald trump describes himself. you are the guy who prosecuted cases in this jurisdiction. it says to me like fanni willis overturned the case by throwing in rico. in a funny way, it is -- it has overshadowed beca

and according to acting deputy attorney general richard donoghue's notes from the conversation, trumpall saying that there's not much the justice department could do. >> trump also plotted with another justice department official, jeffrey clark, to oust the acting attorney general after rosen's repeated refusals to go along with trump's fraudulent allegations. but that scheme imploded at the dramatic white house showdown on january 3, 2021. >> this is a scene straight out of "apprentice." trump has rosen and clark vie for the job of attorney general of the united states. and the president is told that if he replaces rosen with clark, there are going to be huge consequences. a number of top officials at the justice department were going to resign. there were probably going to be hundreds of other resignations of political appointees across the country as a result of this. it was a murder-suicide pact was the way this was described during this meeting. >> trump decided that the effort would not be earth the embarrassment of mass resignations and abandoned the p plot. he then pinned his

>> there are those notes and richard donoghue had the notes when donald trump said just say it is corruptnd leave it to me and the republican congressmen, which is mentioned in the indictment, but not referred to the notes. notes, contemporaneously notes are very powerful corroboration when a department, a defense council tries to undermine the credibility of a witness, because you have real-time recording of what the individual said. so it's another element of proof. because it corroborates and builds credibility for what the witness said. but erin, you really did point out one thing that jumped out at me which was that conversation about foreign affairs national security issues unrelated to the election when donald trump says well, 17 days before the inauguration, well, we'll leave this to the next guy to deal with. that is an admission that he knows that he lost before january 6th and his efforts is convinced to say it nicely mike pence to throw the election for donald trump. that is a critical, critical piece of evidence. >> yep. >> because the defense will be that donald trump is suc

clark, the new acting attorney general, but that clark would decline trump's offer if rosen and donoghue had agreed to send the proposed letter to the targeted to states. but they refused. that is an allegation of a criminal act, to commit crow fraud against the united states. >> it is, it's part of the factual predicate about all of this. sometimes cases come down to one question, why? why did you engage in all of this behavior? conspiracies talk about that phrase the meeting of the mind, a conspiracy at its core asks the jurors to understand the why. what was the purpose, why were you agreeing, as they articulate in the actual indictment, the purpose of the conspiracy was to overturn the legitimate results of the 2020 presidential election. going to the, why because then certain things can happen. why would you have coconspirators, why would they buy into it, why would they go along, why would they be enticed to engage in criminal activity? well, there's a bit of a carrot at the end of that to stick, is there not? is the idea of trying to, maybe, become the attorney general of the unit