dr. ezekiel emanuel, speci emanuel. author of "brothers emmanuel," a memoir of an american family." his brother is the mayor of chicago. rahm emanuel was at one time president obama's chief of staff. your reaction to the latest numbers is what? >> i think they are dis appoia t disappointing. i think it's not that cop fusing since the website wasn't wor working. i'm not surprised. remember, we have four and a half months from today to get to the end of the open enrollment period. it's the end of the open enrollment period which is fine. this is like watching a tea kettle saying, is it boiling yet? that's not very helpful. >> it's concerning. let me show you the number. >> i have -- >> let me ask the question and you can answer. 5 million people have been cancelled already. >> that's not a reliable number. >> it's at least 3 million. >> not reliable. >> and the stats say 5 million. >> only on fox. >> let's go with 3 million. you can deny the problem, sir, but the data is out there. >> no. >> it's 5 million people tonight by our numbers. if that's the case, put the full screen back on

dr. ezekiel emanuel is one of the architects oft obamacare. gentlemen, welcome to "fox news sunday."t's start with that pledge from the president when he was trying to sell obamacare. here it is. >> we will keep this promise to the american people. if you like your doctor, you will be able to keep your doctor. period. if you like your health care plan, you'll be able to keep your health care plan. period. no one will take it away. >> it turns out millions of americans are not able to keep their plans. they're losing them. florida blue canceled 300,000 people. in california, 28 # 0,000 policies have been canceled. in oregon, 150,000. mr. capretta, the white house now says, its explanation is that pledge only counted until the health care law was signed in march of 2010 only for policies that were in effect before then. any way, these policies are lousy. >> there's two things. there was no extenuating circumstances when you said you can keep your plan. he didn't add a clause. in fact, he said clearly you can keep your plan. he said it once. he said it a thousand times. this wasn't a mi

dr. ezekiel emanuel. welcome to "fox news sunday." let's start with that pledge from the president when he was trying to sell obama care. here it is. >> we will keep this promise to the american people. if you like your doctor, you will be able to keep your doctor, period. if you like your health care plan, you will be able to keep your health care plan period. no one will take it away. >> but it turns out millions of americans are not able to keep their plans, they're losing them. florida blue canceled 300,000 people. in california 280,000 policies canceled. in oregon 150,000. the white house now says the explanation was that that pleg only counted until the health care law was signed? 2010. and these policies are lousy. >> there is two things to it. there was no extenuating circumstances when he said you can keep your plan. he said clearly you can keep your plan. this is not a minor pledge. it's like the first president bush saying no new taxes in 1990 and 1988. he broke that pledge and he had the honesty to say he was. millions of

dr. ezekiel emanuel admitted it to me. 7 million includes the people who were expected from the individualt to come on as well. so it's not just -- >> first are you admitting it was foreseen that the individual insurance market would collapse and that was a key facet of obama care working? >> it's not a matter of foreseeing. >> why didn't you plan against it? >> we were giving them a better method called the the exchange. >> there you have it. that's the question. was that the original goal after all? joining me now the author of "how medicaid fails the poor," columnist at the national review. avik roy. he admitted right there that the 7 million people they need on the exchanges, all along they intended for a number of those people to come over from the individual insurance markets. >> he's not the only one. the entire health policy community from the beginning and today, they are always saying the old individual market was terrible. there were junk plans. insurers could do terrible things. now we, the federal government have come in to save you from the plans that were doing terrible thin

dr. ezekiel emanuel. these days he chairs the department of medical ethics and health policy.s the vice provost of the university of pennsylvania in philadelphia. but back when the affordable care act was being formulated, he was a top adviser to the president. these numbers remain this dismal, 26,000. the model, it's not going to work. you need healthy young people enrolling in order to get the system to work. >> correct. you need a wide swath of the population to create a pool. absolutely agreed. but this is not a technical problem that is insuperable. it will work at some point. and, further, i do think lots of people, as we have seen the number of people who want insurance is high. i do think this is going to be a solvable problem. >> he said he thought president obama had kept his promise about americans keeping their existing policies, something not even the president fully claims any longer. let's discuss what's going on. want to bring in a pair of democrats who differ somewhat when it comes to the problems of the affordable care act. "the daily beast" special correspon

dr. ezekiel emanuel. these days he chaired the department of medical ethics and health policy.rovost of the university of pennsylvania in philadelphia. but back when the affordable care act was being formulated he was a top adviser to the president. >> these numbers remain this dismal, 26,000, the model, it's not going to work. you need healthy young people enrolling in order to get the system to work. >> correct. you need a wide swath of the population to create a pool. absolutely agreed. but this is not a technical problem that is inseperable. the number of people who want insurance is high. i do think this is going to be a solvable problem. >> he said he thought president obama had kept his promise about americans keeping their existing policies, something not even the president fully claims any longer. let's discuss what's going on. want to bring in a pair of democrats who differ somewhat when it comes to the problems of the affordable care act. daily beast special correspondent and city university of new york professor of journalism and political science, peter beinert and

dr. ezekiel emanuel, one of architects of obamacare for the administration. how does his argument fly with voters, bob? >> if you're explaining in a long explanation in politics you're losing. that is why we've seen some in the administration pointing at health insurers, the health insurers, remember they were demonized. the administration used them as boogeyman to get the bill passed. the problem is with the president when are going up against an opponent the most damaging thing the opponent can use in politics your own words against you. that is what romney certainly was using. that is what republicans are using against the president. i think the president will have to shift gears of act noning something he was not as precise as steny hoyer said as he should have been. but there will have to be some type of admission. independent fact checkers basically ripped the administration for that promise. jon: he was so clear and i think most people remember those promises. now this president doesn't have to run again but will there be others who are affected by the

dr. ezekiel emanuel. an architect of the affordable care act.eniormes cupp reddick, fellow at the ethics and public policy center along with republican senator lindsey graham of south carolina. cnn's state of the union follows at 3 p.m., candy crowley sits down with new hampshire republican senator kelly ayotte. also former house speaker newt gingrich. at four, his face and nation from cbs. host bob schieffer welcomes intelligence committee chairman democratic senator dianne feinstein and house intelligence committee chair republican congressman mike rogers. also michael hayden, his former head of the national security agency and the cia. sunday night were tv talk shows on c-span radio. it brought tears of public service by c-span. abc this week, 2 p.m. fox news sunday. 3 p.m. the state of union and at 4 p.m. eastern time facing nation from cbs. listen to them all on c-span radio. and 90.1 fm here in the washington dc area across the country on xm satellite radio channel 120 you can download a free app for your smart phone or listen online. at c