dr. follansbee, do you have a point -- >> commissioner follansbee, m.d.: i think it's probably a very standard protocol and the -- in order to avoid, since there wasn't a face-to-face meeting, to avoid a sort of patient/provider contract which would be open to litigation. the name of the consulting physician who has reviewed the case in detail and written the report summarized by the best doctors staff is made available to our members and they can, on their own, establish contact to establish a patient-doctor relationship. if the patient is in san francisco, there are 1 or 2 in that field that would not involve any travel expenses. but otherwise, they would be making their own arrangements on their own, not only for payment and transportation, but also to establish that relationship. i find this to be actually pretty standard. and don't have a problem with it. >> president scott: thank you. any other comments -- i guess i want to go on the record regarding this particular benefit program. when we approved it a year ago, or two years ago now, 17, 18, 1 of the steps that was supposed to be taken

dr. follansbee has said before they do. so, why would we need this if they do, and especially if the second opinion is not in that separate group. so, i don't know why we need this, if that's the case. >> president scott: and to add commissioner breslin, i am in absolute concurrence, we were supposed to have done that step before this year, we all know we went through a transition. so, that's what is on the table as far as i'm concerned, that would be a priority that we get a very clear, we all have public presenttations and so forth from the plans around what they do in this area, how they communicated to the members, is it one of these things that you have to sacrifice your firstborn in order to get the second opinion, or is there more routine process and how does that work, what do we do, so so on and so on. and that's the working mandate if we should endorse it this year. we should not be paying for redundant services, that's why i'm saying if we should discover, all right, here's the range of services that we are getti