dr. nancy mccallin from my home state of colorado. for the last 13 years dr. mccallin has served as president of the colorado community college system, the largest system in the state to educate one out of every three of our undergraduate students. during her tenure at colorado's comedic host system is not ambitious initiative to increase student success and make college more affordable to cut her leadership the system revamp its program and streamline the curriculum cisterns can graduate faster and with less debt. she increased transfer agreements with four-year colleges similar students can pursue four-year degrees and she expanded concurrent enrollment for high school students by 200% saving our students and families roughly $90 $90 million in tuin cost. her leadership in higher education is just the latest chapter in her career of public service. recent she served in the administration of governor bill owens and was chief economist for the colorado legislature. dr. mccallin announced her retirement by thanking her for her service to colorado for making the

dr. mccallin do you gray grow it would make it harder to go to college? >> yes, it would make it harder to go to college. i would note our students are loan averse in general and 58% graduate with zero debt but for those who have debt it would make it more costly. >> another provision would repeal tax on waivers that covered graduate school tuition. the cost of students who get tuition waivers under this tax bill would be $5.4 billion. dr. ruben you're a senior policy at the urban institute. would this tax change help or hurt graduate students. >> if we're going beyond what we're talking about today my views aren't necessarily attributable to the tax policy center. in the work we've done analyzing the house bill, the changes in making college and graduate school more expensive would hurt graduate students. in general between that and treating employer benefits as tuition is going to make it harder for people to attain the education and training they need. >> mr. draege, do you agree? >> yes. as a general rule tax and benefits grounded in affordability are