paul mary, and italian historian of the 15th century, any paul mary who won 10 grammy awards -- eddie palmieri, who won 10 grammy awards, or isabella harry? >> i would say isabella. she's the only one i did not know about. >> you knew about eddie paul and matteo? >> i knew about eddie. i don't think he may be italian. i did not know much about matteo. >> if you look at the picture, he's very handsome. >> naturally thepalmieri men usually are. >> what is different about your work settings, in terms of hanging out with them and comparing and contrasting them? let's say, hanging out with the senior staff and the white house. >> people ask a lot what the difference between two white house is is. i would say the clinton white house was just a little more volatile. you know, decision-making happened at a slower pace in the clinton white house and at a very frantic pace at the end of the event that you had to deal with. and i guess president obama in terms of people to spend time with. president obama is probably more likely to engage you on happenings outside of politics. perez president clinton mig