debt ceiling turned the world's risk free benchmark into a risky asset, pabd moan yes, ma'am would enshoenvestors would not know which way to turn. they might hide from all risk. do you believe it would be that bad? >> i believe there is a significant possibility that this would be the most disruptive event. if suddenly that is cast into doubt, who knows what effect that has on euro bonds, on chinese growth rates and all kinds of things. you can imagine ripple effects that go well beyond any simple systematic calculation. do we really want to play with that? do we want to try and risk that scenario? it's possible but let's say there's a 15% possibility, that this poses an economic magnitude that plunges the world into a second global recession. is it really worth it? we've got to get this straight any way. we've got to sole this problem, our fiscal problems any way. is it really so hard to get it done? i think people who want to play this game of chicken with the credibility of the united states, we have not in 222 years defaulted on our debt. we have an impeccable history. do we really w