or was it not, which would suggest evan mcmullin was in the room.in denied he was the leaker. but was he the one who recorded this stuff? i don't know. they speak to a general problem with -- also just that the establishment did reasonably see donald trump as a threat for joking about it and what not. lou: . mcmullen has seemed to disappear. >> snake bit with it comes to a messaging program. they didn't seem to break through the noise. mollie is exactly right. it underscores just how much the never trumper crowd in washington has resisted at every turn to say obviously donald trump as one war front dealing with democrat, but then the more damaging war front is the one with the never trumpers in the republican party. a lot of people who are working for them in the white house. as a reporter i love leaks. the more leaks the better. when donald trump tweets, i love the tweets because it's like he's a little leaky himself. it's great stuff if you are a reporter. lots of information. the media should be thrilled with all of that. lou: i'm a little more c

to duscuss this we can speak now to the former cia officer evan mcmullin.of allegations about why donald trump has fired his fbi director. talk of a cover—up. donald trump has fired his fbi director. talk of a cover-up. how do you see it? i think the new york times reported do is few hours ago that comey sought additional resources to expand the investigation from the department of justice. that was just a few days before he was sacked by president trump. so that is an additional detail that seems to suggest quite clearly in fact that donald trump wa nted clearly in fact that donald trump wanted to remove comey because he was pursuing this investigation and in fact even trying to expand it. it is hard to imagine what other motive he might have had. donald trump is trying to claim that he is doing this because comey mismanaged the fbi and the clinton investigation but actually donald trump has praised comey in the past but that investigation so it seems hard to believe now that he would fire him so long after it. itjust does not make any sense. i think what

. >> evan mcmullin, former cia, he said it was direct communications with the kremlin, not just a simple back channel. the question also being why not just wait 40 days between the time of the meeting and that inauguration? let's put that on hold. we know that issue will be addressed in this briefing. gloria borger, let me bring you in. let me first ask you about the fact that we've just learned that the president's personal lawyer michael cohen is refusing to cooperate with this investigation as it's widening. your take on that? >> well, first of all, michael cohen is very close to donald trump. he's worked for him for more than a decade as a personal lawyer, lawyer for the trump organization, really. he said that they are on a fishing expedition with him and that people on the intelligence committees would argue that they are not. but since he's saying this is too broad, i wouldn't be surprised if they started to narrow their requests so they can't be seen as, you know, fishing for anything can hoe co. we know that cohen has helped in setting up the legal team representing the presiden

also with us, former presidential candidate evan mcmullin, a former cia officer. guys, great to have you hire. a lot to get through. one bit of information from jim sciut sciutto, jamie, that i found interesting, is following his meeting, his sources telling him that advisers after this meeting, advisers to the president, consulted the intelligence community to check on the classification level of the information that was discussed in the oval office meeting. you've been in those meetings. what does that tell you? >> that tells me that they were really worried. i mean, there is secret information, top-secret information and then secure, classified information. that is highest level of classification, and often it's because if that information gets out, it can put people's lives in danger, it can undermine critical relationships with foreign intelligence services, with foreign governments. and so, to leak that kind of information or just to give it away so brazenly, especially given the bad state of relations between the united states and russia is just deeply conc

hillary clinton, evan mcmullin, sherry red stone tonight.o we'll talk all about that all day long. later on this hour, we'll hear what ballmer said about whether microsoft was too slow in hard ware, investing in twitter and the puzzle he says that is putting together the modern nba team. guys, back to you. >> you know, carl, speaking of reads, there was another read on the state. we're speaking to reid hoffman who sold linkedin to microsoft. did he weigh in at all into that discussion in terms of robotics or ai or have a different viewpoint? he's interesting to listen to too. >> yeah. the focus last night, almost asymmetrically was from andreessen. definitely there's some -- there's some mea culpas in the past 18 hours about what microsoft did wrong in say the last decade and a half and how that's playing out big time today. >> i wonder if there's any mea culpas on politics. you know, this was a group that was in favor of hillary clinton. she'll be there and you'll get a lot of political discussion out from the valley and i'm curious to hear