it's big part of our culture at everfi. >> sounds good, but 550 people. does it work? >> it's literally one of those things that every single day it is hand-to-hand combat. you have to reinforce it at every turn. you can't tolerate it when it's not playing out that way. it's also played out even more so with our customers. it's interesting. you get these slogans people put on the walls and the customer's always right or whatever. often the customer isn't always right. the most authentic and interesting relationships, the best relationships that we have with our customers and our partners are often the ones that have the most friction, the most problems -- >> i want to go back to your employees because that's what you started with. it is all well and good to say don't talk behind people's backs, it is partly -- not human nature, but people feel more comfortable doing that than they feel face-to-face. how do you nip that in the bud? >> first thing is you really embrace -- you have to embrace a culture of discomfort. the best companies in the world are constantly in a sta