joining me now is the new york times opinion columnist, ezra klein. he has been riding with uncommon acuity about the campaign for months, and in february was one of the earliest voices calling for biden to step aside welcome ezra. >> thank you. good to be here so you did ask in february for biden to step aside, but you also called for very specific thing which was an open drum democratic primary that would are kind of mini primary that would lead to an open convention at which may the best person become the nominee that second part hasn't happened how important do you think that was? >> and what do you think about the very rapid coronation of kamala harris? >> well, in february, there was a lot of time and there's not a lot of time now, when i said then two, was it you were thinking if you wanted to argue as i did, then that the risk of running biden was too high that you had to be comfortable with harris becoming the nominee because she was always overwhelmingly the most likely alternative nominee. she is the sitting vice president by the time biden

ezra klein, thank you. >>> we will be right back. -really?gresivecommercial.com. >>> turning to important story that hangs over this week and a lot of the time to come to the security failure around former president donald trump's attempted assassination. secret service director kimberly cheatle will testify for the house oversight committee on monday and there is major scrutiny and questions. today was also the funeral for that firefighter who was killed at the trump rally. procession of firetrucks carrying the casket you can see here, he was honored at the rnc last night. there have been many new pieces of information over this busy week, including news that the secret service agents actually spotted the shooter around or near the rooftop area 20 minutes before the attack. >> local law enforcement official told the times around 20 minutes before trump began speaking, a police officer took a photo of the man acting suspicious. the officer circulates the photo among other officers but loses track of the suspicious man. at 6:09 p.m., two minut

ezra klein show row. when i say there's a mystery there's a sense in which people some people think, well, look, she's a california senator. she is san francisco liberal on the other hand, she made her name is a very tough prosecutor, tough on crime, all that kind of thing. >> do you have a sense as to who who is the real kamala harris i never know exactly who the real of any of us are, right? >> we change over time, but i'm in california and i've lived a good amount of my life itself, francisco too. >> so i know the politics of that place, that the profile she had in california was moderate black law and order democrat. she gets international politics and there are huge expectations on her, probably more than she could bear at that exact moment. >> she runs in 2020. there's real push to have her run, but she's running at a time when the democratic party it absolutely does not want a law in order. democrat, this is post ferguson, post black lives matter. there is a huge amount of movement behind criminal

>> i think what ezra klein said is the hoax.els like a planted story to get donald trump and his team to let their guard down. knowing what they've done in the past. it's don't worry, the democrats no longer see you as a threat. they are no longer out to get you. after the dossier, russian collusion hoax that went on for years, which nancy pelosi was talking about two days ago, and the legal warfare, the vast legal warfare up and down the coast [ bleep ] that. the coast is not clear for donald trump in any way, shape, or form, so we've seen the caterwauling on the tv, the unhinged and unmedicated, those are sirens sure but it's always been what we cannot hear and cannot see by the democrats that has always been the danger. because they won't try to maintain control and power by any means necessary -- will try to -- and on that note, joe biden ought to be walking around in a memory foam onesie because the big swinging scrote of his party, you know they are planning a slip and fall. hey joe, how about a midnight putting run? and t

podcaster, new york time journalist ezra klein, host of the ezra klein show podcast and many know you over the years. thank you for joining me tonight. >> thank you for having me. >> i kind of want to go in order even though a lot has happened today. this was one of those conversations that was happening behind closed doors in secret. sometimes with a time of shame and sensitivity. and nobody wants to be ageist or anything of the like. and your piece did uncork something. what were you thinking then? tell us a little about the response from the people in power in washington and how that impacted your thinking? >> i happened to be at the white house the day the special counsel report came out. and i was reporting on a bunch of things. i was there reporting on immigration and the economy. i was also trying to think of something happening right around that time. we can see in the polls, biden was losing. he was trailing donald trump. we've never seen donald trump leading in a poll in a presidential run before. and at the same time they decided not to do the super bowl interview for the s

i mean, many , times, ezra klein i mean, many, many months ago, basically said in a famous article that man is he's they're hiding him. you know, there's it doesn't seem like he can do the job of at least running for president if not being president, and, you know, there was a lot of news reports that, you know, he wasn't doing well. and, of course, people in the democratic party thought they were stuck with him. and they sort of denied what people could see with their own eyes. and then we had the debate and the end of june, and it became clear, i think, to anyone with a functioning brain that, you know, they weren't going to be able to get him over the finish line, so, yeah, i mean, i think we, i think what we think we have to see here is that like, you know, there's a lot of different factions here that are have different interests and different viewpoints on this thing. >> but if they thought they could have got him over the finish line, they would have put forward to the american people, somebody who was in some stage of senility . of senility. >> yeah. i mean, it depends on who yo

we also have michael steele and ezra klein back in 90 seconds. if plus frs d ezra klein back in 90 seconds. if plus fr your record label is taking off. but so is your sound engineer. you need to hire. i need indeed. indeed you do. indeed instant match instantly delivers quality candidates matching your job description. visit indeed.com/hire >>> welcome back. president biden will be joining what you see there, this rally in detroit, michigan. today the president's aides are on offense. as i mentioned, if you've been watching our coverage over the last eight minutes or so, they are excited. they say this is a chance to continue momentum. they say the president got a lot out of the nato summit and his press conference last night. they feel they have started to quiet what was doubts from members of the democratic house and a larger chunk of commentators. so, the president is building on this tonight. we are going to carry here on msnbc this speech when we get it. octavia spencer is speaking on stage right now, and we are roughly one speaker away from

. >> jesse: we are hearing reporting that ezra klein, one of these liberal reporters was talking to topocrats and they are resigned to trump winning and they say, we really don't think that trump is a threat to democracy, we just say that. >> exactly. they do just say it because they are losing their grip on power and they need something to say. business people tell me they care about policy. they are afraid this person has their hands on the wheel and we have national security threats, yes, but they also worry about the policy of the democrat party. it doesn't matter who is going to be there. kamala or somebody else. it is the same policies. and that means 5 scpf trillion dollars in new taxes, and a wide open border and threats to the homeland. >> jesse: chuck schumer, said he is open to having someone besides joe biden be the nominee. just rescrambled the entire message. so actually, no, no, no, i support joe biden. even chuck schumer doesn't have a handle on what is going on. is joe biden winning or losing this brawl between him and his own party. >> i think it is going to be hard to

>> i think what ezra klein said is the hoax. this is what i call pig potatoes on this. i think that this it feels like a planted story to get donaldt trump his team to let their guard down, knowing gue in the past.past >> it's don't worry, the democrats no longer you as a threat. they're no longer out to get you. after the steele dossier russia collusion hoax that went on for years and years and years, which nancy pelosi was tha stilp talking about two days ago, and the legal warfare orlegal the vast legal warfare upn and down the coast that the coast is the coast is not clear for donald trump in any way, shape o r, form to that point. okay. so, you know, we've seen the caterwauling, the tv,caterw you know, the unhinged and unmedicated. thosaue are. >> sure. but it's always been what we alw ayhat wecannot hear and cannot e by the democrats. e danger that is always been the danger. and because they will try to maintain control in power ontrol aby any means necessary. and on that note, joe oughtlkin to be walking around in a memory foam onesie . e bi yeah, because the the

we're just hearing some reporting that ezra klein, one of these liberal reporters, was talking to some of these top democrats, and they were basically like resigned to trump winning. and they're like, you know, we really don't think trump's a threat to democracy. we just kind of say that. oh, exactly. and they do just say it because they're afraid that, you know, they're losing their grip on power and they need something to say. business people tell me they care about policy. yes. they are afraid that this person is has his hands on the wheel and we have national security threats. yes, but they also worry about the policy of the democrat party. it doesn't matter who's going to be there, whether it's kamala or somebody else. it's the same policies. and that means $5.5 trillion in new taxes in the next four years. it means a wide open border, and it means threats to the homeland. and chuck schumer, who we just reported, according to three sources, said that he's open to having someone else besides joe biden be the nominee. just re scrambled. the entire message said, actually, no, no, no,

york times as refined joins us is also host of a very popular and excellent podcast called the ezra klein show that we recommend here at the lead as thanks for joining us today. the first lady's defending her husband, the president in an interview with vogue magazine saying, quote, we will will not let those 90 minutes define the four years he's been president. we will continue to fight unquote, but you've been making this argument long before those 90 minutes back in february, you wrote a call about it that democrats have better options. tell us why you think president biden should step aside? >> this is a fallacy that it's about 90 minutes. >> we've seen that joe biden many times before look, i'm not a joe biden hater. i like joe biden. i do think he's been a good president, though, this tendency to personalize everything that has happened in his presidency, as if you wrote the inflation reduction act by hand with a fountain pen is a little bit ridiculous. but biden it has been performing poorly in front of cameras for some time now, there was a big course around this when he gave the p