host: talking with fernando espuelas, from "the x-ray with fernando espuelas" podcast. first appearance on c-span. it was back in april 2013. your first appearance, speaking at a panel "the state of latino america." 10 years later, what do you think the state of latino america is? guest: it is quite chaotic. i have the same analysis -- maybe i have not thought it through more than 10 years ago. we lack leadership. there are not big iconic latino political leaders in this country yet. we said this 10 years ago and will probably say it again in five years. that is a huge limiting factor. ultimately, among many ethnic groups but particularly latinos, we have a terrible brand in this country because there is a lot of tension in the media. there is a lot of exportation of immigration issues which somehow become latino issues. we are not being understood as americans in this country still. i am not blaming anybody but ourselves and the lack of leadership. host: were just talking about donald trump. in 2020, we saw a shift in latino voters, very pronounced in the state of flor

host: talking with fernando espuelas, from "the x-ray with fernando espuelas" podcast. first appearance on c-span. it was back in april 2013. your first appearance, speaking at a panel "the state of latino america." 10 years later, what do you think the state of latino america is? guest: it is quite chaotic. i have the same analysis -- maybe i have not thought it through more than 10 years ago. we lack leadership. there are not big iconic latino political leaders in this country yet. we said this 10 years ago and will probably say it again in five years. that is a huge limiting factor. ultimately, among many ethnic groups but particularly latinos, we have a terrible brand in this country because there is a lot of tension in the media. there is a lot of exportation of immigration issues which somehow become latino issues. we are not being understood as americans in this country still. i am not blaming anybody but ourselves and the lack of leadership. host: were just talking about donald trump. in 2020, we saw a shift in latino voters, very pronounced in the state of flor