significant splits within the bloc they need to reach a group calling themselves the frugal so austria finland denmark. the netherlands and sweden they want loans more than subsidy. when we savages leone's you know they need reforms here from ford but if it's all said out west of a number of countries the most countries all can the it's not hard to learn she subsidies they only want. to know what there's a crisis with us not only because of the last name the procedures are. there now whirling around that idea of putting conditions on the money. it's getting close no. hungary's leader viktor orban is at the center of this fight over linking subsidies to rule of law in his country and other issues elsewhere. i don't know what is the person lol reason for the dutch prime minister to hate me or hungary but he's attacking so harshly and making very clear that because hungary in his opinion does not respect the rule of law must be punished financially that's his position which is not acceptable others like greece say they simply need to see the money the big picture is that we're faced with the biggest econ

a group has formed calling themselves the frugal so austria finland denmark the netherlands and sweden they want loans more than subsidies because if guy goes on when we set a limit on itself then we also need better for mr but it is also to wish on a number of countries so most countries deal for the new 10 charges relating to subsidies your and you guys i want a little girl you need to know what it is a b. or c. or they have a hunch the little girl's name procedures are created maybe. they're now whirling around that putting conditions on the money hungary's leader viktor orban is at the center of a fight over linking subsidies to rule of law in his country and other issues i'll swear it's getting cussed no. i don't know what is the person lol reason for the dutch prime minister to hate me or hungary but he's attacking so harshly and making very clear that because hungary in his opinion does not respect the rule of law must be punished financially that's his position which is not acceptable those in the middle and i greece say they simply need to see the money the big picture is that

past they've been known as the frugal 4 now they're called the frugal 5 finland joined them it's finland denmark the netherlands austria and sweden that make up these countries are wealthier northern european countries their parliaments may not agree to all of this their representatives in the leaders from those countries who essentially have been fighting with the rest of the e.u. over the last almost 5 days over this or are they going to have to sell this back home to those constituencies and say that this is a good deal i'm not sure that they'll all agree with that remember these are not only going to be difficult to sell to the existing parliaments but also to populist parts of the populations that may not agree with these ideas so one of the issues here has been that these frugal 5 nations basically said they wanted to have essentially loans that were made that would have to be repaid not grants that were non repaid by a lot of these nations the grants idea has come through and so i think that's where you're going you may see a hang up in some of these other again wealthier northern europea

the problem is that the frugal five now, which is holland, now also finland, denmark, sweden and austria sweden and austria say we want to get fewer grants, they say we go up to 350 million in grants, and they wa nt million in grants, and they want stringent conditions, veto rights, and the southern states, which is italy, france, spain, portugal, the ones really hit, say, no, we need more grants. they say we go down. it was 500 million national million in grants. go down to 400 billion. there is still somewhere in the $50 billion range. then there is something else. it is not just... they are notjust negotiating this coronavirus rescue package. they are also negotiating the multi— annual financial framework, the seven year budget. and there, a lot of states want to attach conditionality is on democracy and democratic values to money disbursed to the states, poland, hungary and the czech republic and slovakia don't want. they are at odds over the whole spectrum. how do you see this play out estimate who will get what they want? you have italy and spaying saying, you need to support, we n

so-called self declared frugal 5 countries and these countries the netherlands austria denmark sweden and finland are us of the countries merkel is talking to you and maybe also to hungary in poland because one major sticking point today it will be the rule of law if the money that will be handed out in the budget will be attached to a sort of rule mechanism and hungary and poland strongly oppose this idea so they could also make or break the deal today why exactly is this conditional of any financial assistance such a sticking point in the girls your sense. paris it would be the 1st time in the history that you is handing out taking up mutual debt and that's a really big thing and that 2 very different perceptions here was so we have the south and countries italy and spain they have been really hard hit by the covert 19 crisis and they already they already are already confronted with economical difficulties they have been confronted before and they say we need your solidarity we want. the money to be had it was s. grants and then there are all of the northern countries so so-called frugal countr

he is supported by austria and finland and denmark. they want fewer loans.oncerned about spending. they want to rein that in. this is where they have left it. they have not made an agreement. the president offered a proposal around dinner time to come down grants.illion euros in the eu majority had been around 500 billion. but the austrian prime minister soundly rejected it. thehis point, we have italian prime minister saying the hardliners are blackmailing the rest of europe. he is looking for something to happen because italy is one of the ones that benefits from it most. at this point it is hard to say. support?ey do they go into a fourth week of talks? a lot remains to be seen. quite a stalemate. the g20 also grappling with the impact of the coronavirus when it comes to the world's poorest countries. what have they decided about debt relief? >> punt. doing a already suspension initiative through the end of the year. they want to wait until closer to years and to decide what to do next. the saudi prime minister was pointing out that this suspension is goi

denmark, finland, south korea, and others have not seen a spike in infections despite kids going back home states and municipalities continue to have different rules and regulations that change from day-to-day from beaches, to parks, to restaurants. so who is right? who is going too far in either direction? we're joined by former cke restaurant ceo, andy puzder. great to see you, andy. i want to start with the positive news. around the country and "the wall street journal" had a great piece about this today, countries are finding ways to open despite being in the middle of a pandemic. some had their close-down. some did more, some did less like sweden. they're opening now and they're opening successfully, when they are spikes, they find ways to stop the spikes and keep the economy open. if the europeans can't -- can do it can't we? >> all the economic news from may and june has been spectacular, the news has been wonderful. the news we have so far for july has been very positive. president trump is doing a great job of getting the economy reopened. i think the big problem is, that the

article, schools that have reopened in most countries including germany, singapore,ma norway, denmark, finland, they have not expensed outbreaks. the cost of shutting down schools indefinitely are immense. the pediatric society weighed on the side of opening them for it we can't shut down and stay shut down t forever, those were the words of anthony powell fauci today.nbc nightly news iny p additions all say they would send their kids back to class. democrats, the mob in the media, they would turn towards politicizing, rage. even new york city season uptick infi cities, new york city sayig there's no connections to massla protests that are taking place across the city. blame the churches. "new york times" and others, that's what they did, they blame the church is for strike spiked your investigation in florida found by fox 35 numerous labs are misreporting fare reports, including a failure to report any negative cases. every single person that comes in has it. that's not right. joining me with the latest reactions, governor greg abbott. let's put up some charts first. i love our friends in tex

pointing out that schools have reopened in most countries including germany, singapore, norway, denmark, finlandave not experienced in a brakes. the cost of shutting down schools indefinitely are immense. american pediatric society has weighed in on the side of opening them. the fact is we can't shut d as the dash and stay shut down forever on those with awards of. medical expert seemed to agree. nbc nightly news interviewed five pediatricians all said they would send their kids back to c. democrats, the mob, the media, they would rather turn towards hysteria, rage, politicizing. for example, even as new york city sees an uptick in cases among young adults, city officials insisting there is no connection to mass protests that are taking place across the city. blame the churches. "new york times," others, that's what they did. they blamed the trips for the spike. also developing tonight, an investigation in florida has found by fox 35 numerous labs are misreporting their covid results. get this, including a failure to report any negative cases. every single person that comes in how is it. okay, t

so as sweden and denmark and finland it's not exactly the same but pretty representative . if you focus on either want a stable system for focusing long-term care the only countries that do that make it part of the health care system and all the rest of us are like a kind of chaos we don't get good financing and we are doing something as the population ages. a lot of it depends on what are you particularly focused on. >> guest: i knew there was no simple answer. >> we have to make everything complicated. >> thank you both for a very illuminating discussion. if we can't travel freely abroad because of the time being we can at least david has expertly plugged the book already and i will say again you can order copies of which countries have the best healthcare by cracking on the bar below. from all of us here at politics and prose, stay a while and while red. >> thank you brad and thank you david. >> i'm the director of the

we know that countries like denmark and finland have open schools without problem and we have had daycarers open essential workers throughout the pandemic. there are lots of ways to protect the vulnerable populations that might be there and modify operations. this should be a priority. we know that children not being in school harms them and we want to get schools back open with .chools following cdc guidance we don't want to throw out the guidance without consideration for what might happen. this should be a priority for the country. alix: oh, yeah. literally ask every parent, myself included, everyone thinks it should be open. it's not a matter of if, or when, but how. if you were writing a prescription for say a public school in new york city, what would be the safest way for my five-year-old daughter to go back to a first grade class? want to make sure that children can do social distancing. that may involve some innovative thinking. you may want to limit interactions in places like cafeterias and playgrounds. you might want children to kinda be in blocks together so they are not mixi

frugal five, austria, the frugal four have become the frugalfive, austria, sweden, denmark, the netherlands and finlandall about the main issue, the money given out as grants rather than loans. 750 billion euros is the pot they want to race on the financial markets between the 27 countries to basically in the short—term survive the recession from covid—i9. 8% on average gdp contraction across europe, spain 11% contraction, so what do they do to try to boost the economy, bizjobs, get people working again, and it comes down to leader of the pack, mark rutter, they say that in dutch, he is keeping a stiff leg, which means he is and budging an inch on this. the dutch want to see a smaller amount given in grants, around 400 billion euros not 500 billion euros as planned. the italians and spanish don't want to see that pot reduced, they want to see that pot reduced, they want to see money without these conditions of having to pay it back because they say it is simply not their fault. last night, we were told from mark rutter that angela merkel and emmanuel macron the french and german leaders walked out. he

here the frugal four have become the frugalfive, austria, sweden, denmark, the netherlands and finlandre is about the money that is given the money that is given out as grants rather than loans. so 750 billion euros is the part that they want to raise on the financial market, between the 27 countries, too, basically, in the short term, maybe survive the recession from covid—19. 8% on average gdp contraction across europe. spain, for example, have seen an 11% contraction. so what do they do to try and boost the economy, boostjobs, get people working again, and it comes down to relieve the leader of the pack, mark rutte, they say in dutch... he is keeping a stiff leg, that means he is not budging an inch on this because the dutch want to see a smaller amount given in grants. around 300 billion euros, not 500 billion euros as is planned, but the italians and the spanish, they don't want to see that part being reduced. they want to see money without these conditions or having to pay it back, because they say it is simply not their fault. last night we were told from mark rutte that angela

countries in the north the so-called frugal countries including the netherlands denmark but also sweden to some extent also finland who have said look we rather like to see loans with conditions with strings attached different 2 countries one particular person to look out for tonight is the dutch prime minister mark whitaker who has made very clear when he arrived today that he wants to see conditions and guarantees that this money that is different potentially to countries in the south south is put to good use so the big question today in some sense to some extent is how deep this cultural frugality if you want to call it a run for instance the dutch society might my colleague bob a visual traveled to the netherlands to find out. in the last days they have all been beating a path to michael it is still 1st came the italian prime minister. then his spanish counterpart. and finally the portuguese it was a concerted lobby effort to convince the dutchman to loosen his purse strings but so far no luck. getting it all begins to move in our direction and it's already looking better. the netherlands are the 5th largest e

idea that these frugal four, the self—proclaimed frugal four, austria, sweden, netherlands, denmark plus finlande been saying we don't want to give 500 billion euros in grants. we don't trust enough that the money will essentially that'll be it and it will be spent on the right things and the furthest is the dutch leader, mark rutte, who wants a veto for the dutch to be able to say, we don't like the spending let's stop it at this point. so it's basically been a back and forth between the council, putting new proposals on the table with lots of different meetings. now, where we are at at the moment, the so—called frugal four are saying they will offer as grants, no more than 375 billion euros. if other countries, including france and germany are saying that they won't go over 400 billion euros and at the table this afternoon will be around 390 billion. that is where it seems to be at. and this has got pretty nasty at points. tempers flaring like i haven't seen it before, you've had the bulgarian prime minister, boyko borissov, calling mark rutte acting as a policeman of europe. victor 0ban, the

the self—proclaimed frugal four — sweden, denmark, austria and the netherlands — along with finland,oo much to offer badly affected countries in grants. led by the dutch prime minister, mark rutte, they say 375 billion euros is as far as they'll go with conditions including the right to block requests. but other nations, including france, germany, spain and italy, are refusing to go below 400 billion euros. this latest proposal being considered includes 390 billion in grants. there would be an allocation key, which determines who gets what based on unemployment rates in member states and the size of the contraction in gdp. eu council had believed this could be the one they agree to. it would be the one they agree to. it would bea be the one they agree to. it would be a proposalfor 390 billion euros so less than the 500 and 360 billion euros in the form of loans so this is considered quite a big number. they have not agreed to it yet but there is some optimism that they could agree to tonight. heading into the talks, this was mr rutte's take... "we're not here so we can go to each oth

increase unfortunately france there's increasing cases in belgium netherlands italy denmark even in switzerland and norway in finland there's a level of increase now what you call a 2nd wave is kind of open to debate there's no absolute definition of what is a 2nd wave and what is a continuation of the 1st wave it doesn't really matter too much just suppose a 2nd wave really is a sustained increasing cases so what we're concerned about is a sustained increase in cases now at the moment we are seeing an increase but i don't really think we can call it sustained yet it's a bit of a resurgence this certainly happening and as you know as we've seen before you start off with individual cases then we get clusters then we get community transmission and i think what would largely seeing in germany for example at the moment is clusters there's always a degree of community transmission but it's largely clusters at the moment so we've got this case of a $150.00 harvest workers in bavaria that was a cluster and now all 450 workers are quarantined meat processing plants are also quite a high risk there's been several clusters in

5 as it went on now the frugal 4 were the netherlands austria sweden and denmark they were ultimately joined it seems by finland as a group that said they were keen on taking out get themselves in order to put money into a pot which as they saw it was free cash for nations to spend as they wanted to mark the netherlands. about in courts of austria. of denmark and matthew fredrickson of. pardon me but the fragrance one of denmark and my staff and often of denmark really but boxing above their weight pushing above their weight when it comes to the influence they were able to have on these talks they will see this as a big success just how they were able to see well to basically. move the goal posts as they were set out originally back in may what had been initially set out was that there would be 500000000000 made available in grants 250 made available as loans they weren't happy with that and they got it changed the other thing from the netherlands side in particular that shown that if you stand your ground you may get something in return the neverland seem to be implicated with new e.u. rules that mean that cou

denmark and sweden they would join does this summit went on by finland as a group of nations they were saying they were particularly happy about taking out their own sovereign debt in order to essentially give free money to all of the member states and usually the plan had been for 500000000000 in grants 250000000000 in loans they managed to get that changed and this has seen something of a split between those nations that want to weld not share the burden as it were of taking out debt against those countries that are suffering the most financially from the corona crisis only jordan the reason the term to. compromise the extent of our goals but don't because we are inflexible probably the most difficult because who sions i've ever been involved in. the quota that was imposed by the group of the most stingy and selfish member states was done by judging the situation exclusively through the prism of their own interest well away from talks again of another north south divide between those need of money following corona and those willing to share there was also a little bit of division whe

when denmark and sweden and finland and all these other countries aren't wearing masks. oh, no, he's talking about masks. he's an anti-masker. that's what it's all about now. get on twitter, bash somebody, they're a nutball. when are we going to look at the data and try to do the things that we need to do to lead this country forward? do we know what we're doing to children right now? do we have any idea? our own c.d.c. director talking about the number of suicides outpacing the number of deaths from covid. i love my 10-year-old son. i love my 9-year-old daughter. i would give my life for them at any given moment, but they're going back to school on august 20. ecause it's good for them. but there are so many children in this country who are not going to be going back to school because we have scared the bejeezus out of the entire country. we're america. we cured polio, we put a man on the moon. we beat nazi germany, we beat japan. and we're cowering in the orner about a virus. let's look at the numbers. let's protect the elderly. let's protect the people in nursing homes

austria, finland, norway and singapore have all reopened their schools and none of those countries have seen an explosion of cases linked to schools. in denmarkchools have been open since late april. masks have not been required but the number of infected children has not grown. in fact has steadily declined. none of this is opinion and none of it is political, all of it is actual science and there is an overwhelming amount of science that humanly steadily. coronavirus is not deadly to current children. keeping children home are his children and everyone else and schools must open. nothing affects the life of an ordinary family more than the question of where to go to school and when. without schools returning to normal millions of american parents will not be able to work, even as we descend into recession. their own job and the job the teachers are refusing to do while still getting paid by the rest of us. but instead of sympathizing with the plate of american families, the head of the american federation's teachers, randi weingarten, rejoices at the prospect. employers must adjust work schedules to accommodate the which will time of her me

the self—proclaimed frugal four — sweden, denmark, austria and the netherlands — along with finland, they will go. others, including france, germany, spain and italy, are refusing to go below 400 billion euros. the new proposal reported to be on the table today is 390 billion. the european commission president struck a positive tone as she arrived for the fourth day of talks. so, after three days and three nights of negotiation marathon, we are entering now the crucial phase, but i have the impression that european leaders really want an agreement, they showed a real will to find a solution, and we need a solution. european citizens need a solution. the european union needs a solution, needs an agreement to overcome this crisis and to prepare europe for the future. i am positive for today. we are not there yet but things are moving in the right direction. our europe reporter gavin lee is in brussels with this update. potentially it is going to be the longest summit in history. you go back to the nice summit when 15 countries were expanded, back in 2000 it was five days just, but two

the ‘frugal states' include the netherlands, austria, denmark, sweden, finland — mostly northern countriesll this out next week in brussels. and as we watch this play out, here's some good advice from wolfgang munchau, a columnist for the ft. and that's the argument that spain and italy hope will cut through. here's the italian president. we are talking about the future of europe. what is at stake here is the single market. imagine what it will mean if we are incapable of providing a strong pain related european response. —— coordinated it will destroy the market, the european value chain will be destroyed. our economies will be destroyed and all of europe will be less competitive at a global level. the uk next — which today has revealed more of its plans to manage the covid economic crisis. the chancellor, rishi sunak, has said the government will pay businesses 1000 pounds, or 1200 dollars, in ajob retention bonus for each furloughed person brought back and employed through to january. there are also plans for a two billion pound, or 2.5 billion dollar ‘kickstart‘ scheme to create thousa