of foia requests we've received. to that we've a foia put together assistance team in searching documents and making sure we're responsive. initiated? that team >> about a year ago. >> have you seen improvements on that? >> we're working hard. don't have statistics for you today but i can get back to you with that information. i appreciate that. >> congressman, we've made a changes to put in place better systems for keeping activities that occur and flagging anything that would be suspect. like we've made progress on this in the last couple of years. audit, we'veancial had a clean audit the last several years but we're always follow up and make sure we have appropriate systems any ace to detect misconduct. >> why is it that epa employees who spend thousands of dollars epa taxpayer money on personal expenses can get away reimburse theg to agency? we have been -- we're -- obviously we share your concern about that. he cases that are before us over are cases that we're for the most part -- were over a couple of years ag

or will it still be her team which decide which ones go through the foia process? so the ones that you release are the ones that she decided, if she sent them to an official account which she have had the right to choose which ones were official? >> that's a good question. i can look into it. the reason i ask is that i do do not know, for example i was foia if i would have the first right to say here all my official emails are not. and then they they would be better properly, don't have the answer to that. >> what is it secretaries carries system for sending and receiving e-mails? >> secretary carry relies primarily on his state.gov account for work. the e-mails on his state.gov account are automatically archived and this is an improvement, and part of the advancements that we have made. so any e-mail that he senses automatically copied and remotely saved electronically. again, this speaks to the fact that we are now complying, this automatic archiving approach does comply with the federal records act as well as e-mail records. >> and he says that through a compute

has been a substantial increase in the number of foia requests we have received. in responding to that, we tried to put together a foia expert assistance team to assist us in searching through documents and making sure that we are fully responsive. >> when was that team initiated? >> that team was initiated within the last year or so. >> are we seeing improvements on that? that you can tell us about? >> we're working very hard. i don't have any statistics for you today, but we'll be glad to get back to you with more information. >> i appreciate that, because i know that you have to get a lot of requests, undoubtedly. we're dealing with very emotional issues, substantive issues, waters of the u.s., flint water crisis where government failed at all levels and people have been hurt. there certainly is emotional issues dealing with requests that go on. but there are reasons why epa has been brought in front of us on several occasions dealing with foia, and i'd hope that would be addressed. going on to purchase cards that was introduced in i believe our chairman's open

one is that we take our foia responsibilities very seriously. we found in recent years there's been a substantial increase in the number of foia request we have received. responding to that, we have tried to put together a foia expert assistance team to assist us in searching through documents and making sure we are fully responsive. >> when was that team initiated? >> that he was initiated within the last year or so. >> i was seeing improvements in that? >> we are working very hard. i do not not have statistics free today but will be glad to get back to you with more information. >> i appreciate that. i i know you have to get a lot of request. undoubtedly. we are dealing with very emotional issues, substantive issues, waters of the us, flint water crisis, where government water crisis, where government failed at all levels and people have been hurt. there certainly is emotional issues dealing with request that go on. there are reasons why epa has been brought in front of us on several occasions dealing with foia and i hope that will be addresse

number two, when you look at the foia release on the state department's website, the two people that would send stuff to mrs. clinton are ms. abedene and mrs. mills. do these two women have security clearances and does anyone know who in the state department released this information for it to get moved to ms. clinton's server. i'll take your answer off line. thank you. >> i think the last question, that's one thing the fbi and justice department are now trying to answer. i believe they do have security clearances. mrs. clinton, again sending and receiving classified information is just made up about the requirements of the law in terms of handling it. that story has changed for her. initially she says it was never classified and then she said it was never marked classified and now we have e-mails requested by her with the classified markings removed so they could be faxed to her. it's just devastating. the material is classified and the markings recognize this classification. those in a position of authority like mrs. clinton who has what is known as original classification authorit

another one of our foia requests said it had to be referred to ice, and this was our foia request regarding chicago, st. louis and minneapolis, regarding the monitoring protesters and the use of stingray fusion and facial recognition technology. and we've heard different reasons around why it was referred to ice, so some say this is actually a good sign. it's them doing their due process, and others have said it's possible some of the people that are coming up under the dragnet are also on the radar of ice and that there's a connection there. so we're exploring that as well. and then finally we've heard regarding some of our requests on communications in minneapolis during the jamar clark protest on use of stingray that releasing that information would invite risk of circumvention, and we also received notes on some of our new york foia requests that we couldn't get the data because there were still open investigations. so we've been fortunately working with some really great lawyers that are helping us to refine these foia requests and put them back in, and we sort of keep plugging away at

could you tell us why it takes the epa so long for these foia request to be filled? foianerally, we take our responsibilities. seriously. in recent years, there has been a substantial increase in those requests. in responding, we have tried to foia expert to make sure that we are fully responsive. >> when was that team initiated? >> within the last year. >> are we seeing improvements that you can tell us about? where he --rking very hard but we do not have any statistics. >> i know you have to get a lot of requests. undoubtedly. when you are dealing with very a issues, substantive issues, the flintthe u.s., water crisis where government failed at all levels -- people have been hurt. there are emotional issues dealing with requests. there are reasons why the epa has been brought before us on several occasions dealing with foia. going on to purchase cards which was introduced in our chairman's opening comments. can epa keep better track of the purchase cards and the usage of those cards by your employees? >> we have made a number of changes in response to interest from

in nurem race cases where the dotcht energy's counsel general had provided their foia response to the white house, the file was incomplete and didn't contain all documents related to the foia response. itch complete documentation certain what ng changes or redaxes were made when the white house reviewed the documents. for an administration that once sought to be the most transparent administration in our nation's history, actions such as these do nothing to inspire trust or confidence amongst the american people. it took a foia request in 014 to reveal that the of the 450 department of interior inspector general requests, the obama administration only aloud the i.g. to release three reports. while that stat is trouble, figures released by the associated press this year through their annual foia review are more disturbing. the annual review covers free tom of information act requests made to more than 100 different fall agencies. shockingly, the a.p. reported in martha in 2015 the american people received censored responses or nothing in 77% of all foia requests, redacted releases or n

under foia is not without precedent. the n.s.c. maintained a foia program and complied with requests under presidents ford, carter, reagan, bush and clinton. however, a 1996 court case ruled since it was an advisory body it did not need to participate. the n.s.c. is not simply an advisory body anymore. it's time to bring it back under foia and shine light on its activities. this amendment fits well under chairman thornberry's broader n.s.c. reform efforts and i thank him for bringing this a priority in this year's ndaa. this will make it clear to future administrations that the n.s.c. cannot continue to grow in size and mission without consequential oversight measures. i now yield thess tamed chairman of the house -- i now yield to the esteemed chairman of the house armed services committee one minute. the chair: the gentleman is recognized. mr. thornberry: i thank the gentlelady for yielding. mr. chairman, she makes the point very well. at a certain point you get to the national security council taff get different characteristics

foia, freedom of information act. clearly, secretary clinton wanted to avoid the freedom of information act at all costs. that i.t. director who warned her about the transparency laws for the state department emails is named john bentell. he has since retired from the state department and thus the inspector general could not require him to testify. he refused to speak with the inspector general. in fact, former secretary clinton and several of her aids also refused to speak to the inspector general. mr. bentell also refused to speak with the judiciary committee. according to his attorney, randall turk, mr. bentell knew nothing about the server at the time. he refused to participate in a voluntary witness interview with the committee. and so in refusing, mr. bentell's attorney claimed that his client only learned of the controversial email arrangements after it was reported in the press. he said another congressional committee -- quote -- "spent its entire interview focusing on what the committee's letter says you want

the house still has things going on, there are lawsuits, foia requests. >> you don't think it will be> politically it won't be over, there are hearings and foia requests that have to be answered. they try to say it is over. >> i want to take a look at a video claiming donald trump saying he loves hispanics. more ahead. no other nasal allergy spray can say that. go ahead, embrace those beautiful moments. flonase changes everything. are you powered by protein? i am. milk has 8 grams of protein to help give me energy to unleash my potential. start every day with milk's protein and milk life. ♪ no, you're not ♪ yogonna watch it! ♪tch it! ♪ ♪ we can't let you download on the goooooo! ♪ ♪ you'll just have to miss it! ♪ yeah, you'll just have to miss it! ♪ ♪ we can't let you download... uh, no thanks. i have x1 from xfinity so... don't fall for directv. xfinity lets you download your shows from anywhere. i used to like that song. >>> trump posted a photo of him enjoying a taco bowl, with happy cinco de mayo with the message he loves hispanics. and clinton campaign posted this video on twitte

adequacy of the state department residents search for these documents in response to that original foia request. he then says, look, it is necessary in answering that question to explore the creation, purpose, and use of this private server through this limited discovery of all of these depositions. so you're right. it's not a witch hunt. it's garnering more information. but he was quite explicit about the fact of who the depositions need to be with and why. >> when i had to chance to look at the political failout -- bernie sanders -- in west virginia right now -- his wife, jane sanders, was telling me without taking sides on the issue, just get it resolved already. i want you to react to this. >> there's a process. it's going forward. it's an fbi investigation. we want to let it go through without politicizing it and then find out what the situation is. and that is how we still feel. it would be nice if the fbi moved it long. >> what she was saying there, they're not going to make this an issue but this does cast a pall over the whole campaign. resolve it already. is it your sense that

one, but there are reasons why epa has been brought in front of us on several occasions during with foia. that on to purchase cards was introduced and i believe my -- and i believe our chairman's opening comments. how can epa keep better track of the purchase cards and usage of those cars are your employees. employees. your to put in place better systems in keeping track of activities they keep -- that take place on purchase cards. we feel like we have made progress on this in the last couple of years. on the financial audit, we had -- we are always continuing to follow-up and make sure we have appropriate systems in place to detect any misconduct. >> why is it that epa employees spend thousands of dollars of epa taxpayer money on personal expenses can get away with not having to reimburse the agency? are -- wesman, we share your concern about that. the cases that are before us -- today oures cases that were over years ago. >> the particular individual over $22,000 in international roaming charges abroad, willning that employee be required to reimburse the agency? >> i'm glad you brought

the house still has things going on, there are lawsuits, foia requests. >> you don't think it will bever. >> politically it won't be over, there are hearings and foia requests that have to be answered. they try to say it is over. >> i want to take a look at a video claiming donald trump saying he loves hispanics. more ahead. [woodworker] i live in the fine details. that's why i run on quickbooks. i use the payments app to accept credit cards... ...and everything autosyncs. those sales prove my sustainable designs are better for the environment and my bottom line. that's how i own it. real is touching a ray. amazing is moving like one. real is making new friends. amazing is getting this close. real is an animal rescue. amazing is over twenty-seven thousand of them. there is only one place where real and amazing live. seaworld. real. amazing her long day as anne. hair stylist starts with shoulder pain when... hey joanne, want to trade the all day relief of 2 aleve with 6 tylenol? give up my 2 aleve for 6 tylenol? no thanks. for me... it's aleve. >>> trump posted a photo of him enjoying

. >> talk about did you use the foy ca laws -- [inaudible] -- foia haws -- >> did you use foia laws toget any of your information. >> some. but most of the information, most of the main files we looked at had already been declassified. for example, elijah mohamed's file, malcolm x's files, some of the other lieutenants' files. most of them have already been declassified, and a lot of them you can get online. the hard thing about using those is that they're so redacted that -- we really had a, we knew where the two characters were day by day, and that helped us to see when they were close to each other, and it helped us kind of provide a key to decipher what the documents were saying. because if you look at an fbi document welcome -- [inaudible] but we were able to get a great deal out of hem. johnny was a master at it. >> one more. >> we only have time for one more question. my caribbean brother, try to make it brief. >> are, two questions. >> make them both brief then. [laughter] >> the first one is, obviously, muhammad was fighting at the very top of his career. i mean, you in many w

the courts want to know, was it set up to subvert foia? and was foia subverted. bill: the way i understand it. if you file a foia request, a freedom of information act. if that is a government document, you can get, right? you might have to fight for a while, but you will get it. if it's a personal document is it off limits to you and others? >> if it's truly personality can be off limits. but in the case of mrs. clinton. she took the records, turned over only half of them, and said i just presumed the others were personal because my lawyers looked at it and told me that. but that's not the way it works under the freedom of information act. all those records should have been reviewed by government officials. that's the goal to get all of mrs. clinton's emails she took. bill: why did she do it this way? >> to avoid disclose our, i think. the effect is delay by years of information. the information was not voluntary it was forced out. it makes her raise questions about the clinton foundation and her relationship with donors and the foundation. the connections with

set up a private server around private e-mail account to circumvent congress and circumvent future foia requests. she also lied to congress and lied to the courts as well. >> there is no evidence she lied to congress under oath. >> she failed to turn over e-mails and she actually signed documents -- >> i'd like to point out that there is a whole bunch of stuff in this report we have not yet said. for example, it talks about colin powell not having turned every, up to this date -- >> he didn't exclusively use a private server and -- >> alan, to be fair, there is a big difference between having a private e-mail account like back in the '90s when only some people were using e-mail, and setting up a private server. >> if i could just -- probably be safer on a private server? i actually wonder if colin powell were running for president, would we be pearl clutching. >> alan, she didn't exclusively use any private e-mail server. she set this up in 2009 with the foresight to intentionally circumvent congress and future foia requests. >> let me just mention, anyone who spent time in washington,

you cannot foia a private individual.can is why hillary clinton be because she was part of the executive branch. i do not think people get the and how important it is. i also want to make the point that government transparency is not a partisan issue. if it was not for judicial watch, there is an amazing amount of information that the not have.blic would if you are thinking of writing a judicialde it to the watch. you are doing great work. keep it up. guest: that is an essential point. the freedom of information act is somewhat limited. i cannot get president obama's phone messages, at least not yet. the freedom of information act is not apply to congress. it does not apply to the federal judiciary. it is somewhat limited. it is remarkable, given the limitations, what we are able to do. a little bit of work can go a long way. not rocket it is science. it is persistence and the willingness to ask questions and get accountability. host: the last caller will be donna. go ahead. caller: hello. host: you are on the air. upler:

systematically every month we went through this 55,000 pages of emails that she gave to us, through the foia process. we he had at this at this edited them. we only dealt with what we received from secretary update on the email story. secretary clinton's email server. catherine who ple why? >> the remaining hack his or her goes by the name gucifer pled guilty to two relatively minor counts. is he looking at about seven years or less. in exchange he has agree to do fully cooperate with the fbi and the justice department in any current and future investigations, including testifying before a grand jury or even testifying at trial. and gucifer is important because it's through his hacking activities that we first learned about the clinton email.com account and that she was using this email specifically for government business. >> all right. is the prosecutor convinced that he hacked into her email account? or is there some sort of gray area on this? >> i can't speak for the prosecutor. i know he told under the circumstances that he hacked her account. >> that's what gucifer told you? >> right.

the pudding is no access to the president, criminal investigations against reporters, lagging on foiahe president fulfilling george w. bush's dream of doing a total end run around of the press. >> the white house will say they grant lots of access. reporters disagree. how would boycotting the dinner help with that? >> i'm not telling anybody to boycott the dinner. i don't go to the dinner, and there's a very good reason for that. i'm seldom invited. you know, i'm not going to tell you not to go. i just think the event is -- >> it may be a symbol of what you think is the problem. >> it's everything that's wrong with journalism and government in this city. everybody's too cozy. it's hard for the press to fulfill its watchdog function if you're patting around with people who you can't even ask a journalistic question of. >> we think about what one of the themes this campaign season has been, especially with donald trump's rise. it's that the media has been out of touch, especially d.c., new york media has been out of touch. you do wonder if this is an example of that. on the other hand,

the only reason she did this was to avoid foia requests and make sure she could keep all of her emailspublic or private, private so they could not be subpoenaed period, you know it and i know it. american public knows it. that is why they don't trust her. that is number two. number three, as other secretaries of state we're finding out that is not true. like cavalier response. feigning indignation and then you get angry and, this is cycle with the clintons. it happens every time there is anyone questions their motives. >> this was almost the right thing for hillary clinton to do, right? how great would have been for her argument if indeed colin powell and condoleeza rice had done the same thing, that they did it too defense would work but for these important distinctions and distinctions matter tremendously, number one, hillary clinton used her personal email server and address exclusively. that is hue among gus. almost 1600 emails compared to like 12. >> personal device. >> personal devices. that is humongous. also now the i.g. report saying explicitly she was indeed in violation of t

swriewl jewell they're not foia-able.e they have to vet donald trump, he may be the president of the united states. kimberly: but howard stern's sex talk, kennedy? ken -- kennedy: i always thought i could never run for the highest office in the land because of the things i divulged on howard, and we all know he's perhaps the most masterful interviewer on the face of the planet -- [laughter] and he gets things out of people -- harris: are you being sarcastic? kimberly: no, he's very good. kennedy: he gets things out of people. it's pretty legendary. and i think if you realize that the stains of time may possibly have softened some of the things that donald trump revealed on that show, but it also gives many, many people great hope that they, too, can run for office someday after cracking open and divulging contents of their soul -- julie: are you announcing right now? kimberly: a miss manners book, perhaps, right? do we care about the sex talk? >> for trump? kip kim yeah. >> i would say nowadays it probably gives him a coo

>> we concted a foia.orked with another reporter named steve foreign and we received dozens of e-mails showing a new layer of how aggressive this initiative was that hillary clinton notfrackine e-mails, her aides discussed using: as a laboratory to show that fracking could be successful in europe and to take that model and spread fracking all across both eastern and western europe were we're seeing a lot of opposition to fracking. the e-mails show a very close bond with industry that hillary clinton's aides worked closely with large fossil fuel companies to pressure foreign governments around the world to adopt american-style fracking. amy: i want to thank you, lee fang, we will link your pieces. we turn now to our last segment. we go to santa fe, new mexico, where former president bill clinton found himself in an unlikely 30 minute debate with a 24-year-old bernie sanders supporter. bill clinton was campaigning for hillary clinton when he stopped at a santa fe restaurant last week. there he met josh brody

in this case there isn't paperwork and the secret service is not responding to the foia requests. >>nton friends and supporters say dredging up the epstein story now is nothing but a political stunt. >> from now until election day everything is politics. >> david goolfriend served as an aide to president clinton during his years in the white house. he believes donald trump and gop lead remembers driving the epstein story in an effort to tarnish hillary clinton. and predicts the american people won't take the bait. >> this is trying to attack the character of the candidate by attacking the character of the spouse. and i think that's unusual and i think it will backfire. >> across the media spectrum, analysts and pundits say the ep steam story isn't going away. >> i'm just telling it like it is. that's, that is the new story that is going to be the ultimate counterattack. >> msnbc spent several minutes on the story monday. >> i don't know the whole story or anything, but i keep having -- reporters say this is going to blow up. >> a spokesman for president clinton did not respond to req

address, officials admitted that it was not publicly released and it should have been under these foia lawsuits. it appears it was withheld because it was damaging to her public explanations. >> very interesting. what is the response, if any, from the clinton campaign? >> the clinton campaign statement today seemed to be an effort to spread the taint by emphasizing one finding that there's been widespread problems at the department with e-mail use. campaign spokesman brian fallin said while political opponents of hillary clinton are sure to misrepresent this report for their own partisan purposes with be in reality the inspector general documents just how consistent her e-mail practices were with other officials at the state department who also used personal e-mail. though i would add that none of them had private servers exclusively for government business. this is what mrs. clinton told reporters 15 months ago when she was confronted on the e-mail issue. >> i'd be happy to have somebody talk to you about the rules. i fully complied with every rule that i was governed by. >> were you

sharing between the government and the private sector, for example, the possibility of civil liability, foia exceptions, et cetera. we now feel the disincentives have been wiped away by the new act. we at the nccic now need to figure out what are the positive incentives. how do we in the government show added value from cybersecurity information sharing such that companies will see benefits to their security and to their bottom line to participate. i would also note, building off the point on the president's cybersecurity commission, we see ourselves as having a significant role in promulgating best practices across the nation and figuring out how should companies best evaluate their relative cybersecurity posture and measuring progress thereto. and of course our foundational document is thenist framework. we need to figure out how they use the framework to show measurable reductions in the cybersecurity risk. we're focusing in the private sector for increasing our capacity in these two key areas. how do we demonstrate to the private sector the value of cybersecurity threat information shari

kennedy: also the foia lawsuits and that federal judge, and she's dealing with the fbi. fronts on which she's having to defend herself -- >> there is no evidence that anyone breached her account, there's no evidence -- ken. dagen: there's evidence of one thing over and over and over again in her whole career that she acts in her self-interests -- >> well, that's a different -- kennedy: i am in the mood, i'm getting hungry, and i want a bernie sandwich. [laughter] bernie sanders versus donald trump, it could happen. trump says he's open to the idea which sanders has been pushing pretty, pretty hard. the vermont senator tweeting, quote: i am delighted that donald trump has agreed to debate. let's do it in the biggest stadium possible. like the o2 arena in london? but frustrations seem to be boiling over for many democrats who believe sanders is grasping for any angle against clinton at this point. west virginia senator joe manchin telling politico, quote: that confirms what we've been saying. why would you expect bernie should be contractor or nice or being -- consider rat

server, that she used constantly and had her colleagues in the state department use in order to avoid foiand any transparency to the public. so i hardly believe that hillary clinton is in any place to be giving a critique on transparency. trump has made it clear, when his audits are complete, he'll release returns. >> that's new jersey governor chris christie responding to call for donald trump to release his taxes. calls that now include mitt romney, who had his own issues over tax returns in 2012. let's bring our panel back in, joined now also by msnbc's cal perry. so, romney had a moment where he sort of ordained himself the never trump voice. he trolled for a few days, it petered out. this seems to be a general election resurfacing of that. >> i think so. and i don't know if it's going to affect him, or is trump the teflon candidate. today he's engaged on twitter by elizabeth warren and it's like it's fight club and you're not getting out of fight club without taking a hit. and she's taking some major hits. trump just tweeted, isn't it funny when failed center like goofy elizabeth warr

is it possible it is related to not wanting to have foia requests of e-mails and questions about these e-mails that were involved with countries that had dealings with the clinton foundation? >> a person named brian has been granted immunity by the department of justice, and that does not tend to happen unless there's some substantial criminal proceeding having been undertaken or underway. so that has not been given adequate consideration by democratic partisans, either. as you mentioned, there is the issue of whether public records laws have been flouted. that could conceivably, you know, depending on how enterprising a prosecutor is, could be folded into a criminal charge because there are certain federal statutes governing how agencies and stewards of agencies must maintain public records. it is already established that hillary clinton's maintenance of records violated the regulatory framework of the state department. now the only question is, whether that rises to the level of a criminal violation of federal code. it is very possible -- again, it is troubling to someone who may hav

clinton over which emails would be produced to the state department as part of these foia requests.mits -- this was negotiated to be off limits because of attorney-client privilege. >> in fact, that actually would be routine. >> right. >> that this would be off limits. there is nothing surprising. when you read that someone storms out and fbi, naturally everyone's radar went off. >> these leaks are designed to have agenda right now. that's my view based on the reporting because you and i both know when an fbi agent asks you a question, nine times out of 10 they already know the answer to their own question because this can be a real jeopardy situation. >> it almost sounds that the agent went rogue because the department of justice agreed this was off limits. at least. >> that's how it's being portrayed. i think the leaks, the time something extremely interesting. >> do we have an end point on this investigation? >> well, what we do have is the fbi director is going to be speaking on the record with the reporters who routinely cover this beat tomorrow. no topic is off limits. he has

you cannot foia a private individual.can is why hillary clinton be because she was part of the executive branch. i do not think people get the and how important it is. i also want to make the point that government transparency is not a partisan issue. if it was not for judicial watch, there is an amazing amount of information that the not have.blic would if you are thinking of writing a judicialde it to the watch. you are doing great work. keep it up. guest: that is an essential point. the freedom of information act is somewhat limited. i cannot get president obama's phone messages, at least not yet. the freedom of information act is not apply to congress. it does not apply to the federal judiciary. it is somewhat limited. it is remarkable, given the limitations, what we are able to do. a little bit of work can go a long way. not rocket it is science. it is persistence and the willingness to ask questions and get accountability. host: the last caller will be donna. go ahead. caller: hello. host: you are on the air. upler:

one of the things we are going to do, was foia subverted, the open record law, and if it was, can we that were looked at. i don't even know if the f.b.i. has gotten them. the judge suggested he may subpoena them. bill: the judge is emmett sullivan. what do you think huma abedin knows about this server and email system. >> miss and continue was the only person mrs. clinton told under oath had an emailened the system. and continue was reviewing and talking to mrs. clinton about all sort of things on this system. and and continue evidently was concerned about the freedom of information act and mrs. clinton using emails that could be subject to disclosure. when it was suggested she use the state department system and they would be subject to the freedom of information act the response from and continue was i don't know if that would be a good idea. bill: brian fallon from the state department says this. from the start she refused to answer questions that would help the justice department complete its review. what's the alleged crime. >> on the crime side there were major violations of cl

you have now got federal judges in washington in these foia cases getting increasingly dissatisfied withrtment, and they will have issues with them that will cause real trouble for the department. what it says about the clinton investigation is how far away it still is from a resolution it's inconceivable that if bryan pagliano is doing real state department work while secretary clinton is at the department, they would have emails in the archives. it suggests to me that he may have been on the federal payroll but doing non-federal work. that might explain why bryan pagliano had potential liability. bill: apparently he has been a quote devastating witness to hillary clinton. did you follow that? >> exactly. he would be able to say what he was told to do to set up the server. what he did to maintain the server. what he did to wipe the server. his testimony is more hand on likely than almost anybody else. and he can also say who was taking orders from, which is the way a criminal investigation normally goes. he can provide a roadmap part way up the chain and i think that is what have been d

she can't admit that she did it to avoid foia requests. >> i think comparatively this is a small matter to the things donald trump said he would actually do. i appreciate rich reading hillary's mind. but donald trump's positions, you know, a lot of these things he says -- >> you can't defend this so you are talking about donald trump. yes donald trump's policies deserve political debate. but you can't defend this because the position is not defensible. >> she know she broke the rules. bill he said she broke the rules, now it remains to be seen whether she also broke the law. martha: this story had everybody talking over the past couple days. growing outrage over the killing of a gorilla to possibly save a boy's life who fell into an enclosure. martha: this video is so unbelievable. the zoo shot the gorilla. now it sparked a national debate. >> the gorilla took hit to one end of his habitat. the little boy started screaming and the gorilla grabs him again. you pay your car insurance premium like clockwork. month after month. year after year. then one night, you hydroplane into a ditch. y

i've filed a foia request and got the videotapes of when i was going through that checkpoint. and it has all the different segments except when i'm taken behind closed doors, where they were very aggressive. and this is like a metaphor of the entire war on terror. yeah, it seems bad, it seems stupid, and then they take you behind closed doors and it gets a whole lot worse. and yet very few people on capitol hill have really turned up the heat on tsa. there have been some people. john mica's hammered them at times. >> just on our show yesterday. >> yep. yep. i mean, i wish he would twist the -- would be more vigorous on that. but i think it was a congressman from south carolina, clyburn -- >> james clyburn. >> yeah. james clyburn said one of the problems with tsa is it doesn't treat congressmen specially, it doesn't realize that congressmen need to be really -- hey, this is a special class. i'd love to know how many of these congressmen effectively get a pass and don't get hassled by tsa. president obama said that nobody would say that tsa was an example of how people are losin

sharing between government and the private sector, for example, the possibility of civil liability, foia exceptions, et cetera. so we now feel that the disincentives have been wiped away by this new act. we at the nccic now need to figure out what are the positive incentives. how do we in the government show added value from cybersecurity information sharing such that companies will see benefits to their security and to their bottom line to participate. i would also note, building off the point on the president's cybersecurity commission, we see ourselves as having a significant role in promulgating best practices across the nation and figuring out how should companies best evaluate their relative cybersecurity posture and measuring progress thereto. and of course our foundational document for that is the n.i.s.t. cybersecurity framework. we need to figure out how companies use the cybersecurity framework to measure reductions to show measurable reductions in the cybersecurity risk. we're focusing in the private sector for increasing our capacity in these two key areas. how do we demonst

the government has been fighting tooth and nail against foia requests to get those policies. that's another area where this committee could be helpful to try to pry those loose. >> thank you, i notice i'm out of time, thank you very much mr. chairman. >> thank you, mr. chairman. mr. goitein, i understood -- i understand you work for senator fine gold when he was on the committee, so welcome back. >> thank you. >> i would like to focus for a moment on the question of transparency and our surveillance programs. last year, we passed the usa freedom act, bipartisan bill, which brought much needed reforms to the federal government's surveillance programs, including an end to the bulk data collection program that the intelligence community said wasn't necessary and that the public said it didn't support. i was a proud co-sponsor of the bill. i was proud to develop the provisions with dean heller of nevada. senator heller and i recognized when the public lacks even a rough sense of the scope of the government's surveillance program, they have no way of knowing if the government is s

that were stymieing sharing with government and the private sector, for example, civil liability, foia exceptions, et cetera. so we now feel that the disincentives have been wiped away by this new act. we at nccic now needed to get what are the positive incentives. how do we and the government shall added value from cybersecurity information sharing such that companies will see benefits to their security and to the bottom line to participate. i would also note holding off the point of the president's cybersecurity commission, we have a significant role in promulgating best practices across the nation and figuring out how should companies best evaluate the relative cybersecurity posture and measure their progress. and, of course, our foundational document for that is a nist framework but we want to figure out a companies use the cybersecurity framework to invest in targeted measures that actually show measurable, quantifiable reductions in their cybersecurity risk. in nccic we are focusing on the private sector one increasing our capacities in the sticky areas. .. and as we move forward

loss in court, the energy and environment legal institute has since filed foia requests against scientists at nasa, texas, a&m, texas tech, the university of alabama huntsville, the university of delaware, and the university of arizona. some double standard. in 2009, a hacker stole more than 1,000 e-mails and 3,000 other documents from climate scientists at the university of east anglia in britain who were working on a united nations report on climate change. naturally the climate denial apparatus went to work to select passages from e-mails to assert that the climate scientists manipulated data. this turned out, after multiple -- yes -- investigations to be false. six official investigations ensued, clearing everyone of any wrongdoing. a three-part penn state university investigation, two separate reviews commissioned by the university of east angli, a united kingdom parliamentary report, an investigation by the noaa inspector general's office and an investigation by the national science foundation's inspector general's office. throughout all of these investigations of the climate scienti

the government has been fighting tooth and nail against foia requests. >> thank you, i notice i'm out of time, thank you very much mr. chairman. >> thank you, mr. chairman. i understood -- understand you work for senator feingold. last we passed the usa freedom act bipartisan bill which brought much needed reforms to the federal government's surveillance programs, including an end to bulk data collection program that the intelligence community said wasn't necessary and the public said it didn't support. i was a proud supporter of that bill. senator helder and i recognize when the public lacks even a rough sense of the scope of the government's surveillance program they have no way of knowing if the government is striking the right balance, whether we are safeguarding our national security without trampling on our citizens' fundamental privacy rights. but the public can't know if we succeed in striking that balance if they don't even have the most basic information about our major surveillance programs. that's why my focus has been on transparency that's why senator helder and i crafte