let's talk about this all with frederick mishkin. great to have you back can you hear me all right? >> i can hear you just fine. we had two dissentence today, one from capellan, the other from neil kashda are cashcari. >> it tells you there's disagreement, they're not absolutely clear on whether they're going, in a sense there has been a shift i very much welcome. it's something i've advocated, and i think they're trying to sort out what that means this is an indicateth haven't quite sorted it out. >> here's the key, one of the big problems you have and of a need for more extensive policy, they've already got the fed race down and basically it's called effective lower value. so the question is how do you make sure you want to be stimulative. one way to do it is indicate when you've inflates lower for a short period of time, up to shoot above that. you want it to be arches, and that is key. what it means is when you have things -- you old way the doing things is bygones are bygones, whatever has happened in the past you don't worry and keep interest rates low. >> and make we can show