and it was all about the fuchs, about klaus fuchs in his brother, all the nazis they fought. all the problems that occurred and once i get the idea of how to find things i could go through the files myself. i found lectures they were giving. you know? pulling their group together. all kinds of stuff. i found hundreds, and hundreds of pages. >> so that is a good point. let's have you talk a little bit about klaus himself as a young man. how he became an anti fascist. tell us that story. because obviously that gets into the motivation for what comes next. >> it does. it was the key part of his life. to me one of the most fascinating because nobody else -- well, let me say, he started off in a family of four children. he was number three. he was born right before world war i. in 1911. and he had a very politically active father. the father was extremely liberal. he was a minister. he was in the very conservative lutheran church. the two did not match. and his mission in life was to support the working class. he was a socialist. he joined the social democratic party, the socialis

go at it. >> i was asking you why klaus fuchs instead of ted hall?the student of max born? >> yes, i actually got interested in him when i was doing work on max born. i had a lot of family papers from them. hn

we hear fuchs to jin's. because all resulted from. in the system saying to intercept there are kits that would have been fired from gaza and the early morning to work. so that tax also. ongoing from both sides but. really the recent as the raiders. are different from the previous different from the yesterday was the strongest was of course when they had to hit the shell buildings leaving thousands of families in the city. all right we'll leave it there clear an escalating situation that will come back to your life a software and a cyber attack on a u.s. oil pipeline is starting to have an impact on the public the colonial pipeline was shut down after a ransomware attack i think ohio reports. an increasingly familiar scene stretching up the east coast of the united states long lines of cars waiting to get fuel as more and more stations say there's none to sell but it's just one more thing that takes into major strasser the problem is a major pipeline that provides nearly half of all gas diesel and jet fuel to the east coast it's been t

and experts say the administration sanctions are not enough to deter fuch future attacks.his attack is too coincidental so close to that meeting? >> the administrations now have tried to use sanctions to deter cyber activity. i think this administration had a particularly weak showing with a response to the solar winds hack. the sanctions they levied against the russian federation drew laughter out of their president when he was asked about the effects of those particular sanctions. i think if you really want to stop russian cyber activity, and it's really gotten to that point, you're going to have get much more creative because clearly sanctions are not the method of causing or inflicting pain on the russian federation. we're going to have to come up with, you know, stronger economic creativity, maybe military and technology deployments, something that will not elicit laughter from the russian president when he hears about what our reaction was to the solar winds campaign. i think this has emboldened the russian federation, right? they realize there's no consequences to c