as merrick garland just said. he is being entrusted to run these investigations, because of that independence of spirit. he's got 16 years of history with the justice department, and now, he's being entrusted as garland said, and i think this is important, chris, and i am a word parser, as you know, to complete these investigations, in an even-handed and urgent way. and i'm hearing merrick garland say we're not starting from scratch. jack smith does not expect to start from scratch. but rather, we are giving to jack smith the body of work completed thus far, and we are trusting him to take this over the finish line wherever that may lead. whether to indictment, or not. but this job now belongs to him to complete. and i think the word complete is really doing a lot of work there. for people like me, who wish that the department maybe had continued on its pagtd on its own. >> and i'll also bring in former u.s. attorney barbara mcquade, and can we talk a little bit about the timing of this, obviously, after the midte

that obviously includes garland. with any special counsel or this new one, and attorney general garland, so let's imagine that this special counsel's so aggressive that he wants to do something that garland opposes in the future. well, extra autonomy. that type of clash will go public under the rules. you would hear about it, because they say the attorney general may reject an investigative or prosecutorial step that's unwarranted. that's why all the calls go back to garland, but if that happens, then the a.g. shall notify congress. that means the special counsel has an extra autonomy and four, because if they have a losing battle, the -- and like you saw in the new york case, the line prosecutors wanted to go at trump, and their boss didn't. if that situation happened here, under the rules, you'd actually hear about, it would go to congress, it would go public, so that could strengthen this prosecutor's hand, in theory, but no matter what happens, it all still comes back to garland. so, what i just showed you, those

out merrick garland is still in charge.k me through your expectation here. i understand there is no response yet from the white house but having covered them many times and former president trump of course, your expectation here. >> i don't think we will hear a whole lot. and let me walk you through the day so far, kristen. >> it's fair -- >> they can't, and this is part of what president biden campaigns on, when he was a candidate, the promise to have this, to allow the justice department to be independent. i happened to be at an event with president biden about the economy, when the news broke, and once we were ushered out of the room, i was among the reporters who shouted at the president, tried to get him to respond to this breaking news, he declined to comment. i can tell you a white house official said to me, d.o.j. makes decisions about its criminal investigations independently and we are not involved. so i would refer you to d.o.j. i expect that is about what we are going to hear from white house press secretary kri

it was just too complicated, or just too much for garland.e special counsel regulations had to be involved. >> did you get a sense, from your sources, that there was any disagreement, or conversation, at all, within the justice department? among senior officials, about whether or not to appoint a special counsel was the right approach? >> ultimately, the decision is garland's. it is the attorney general who comes to this conclusion. interestingly, long before we had any inkling what garland would do, there was reports of cnn, and other publications within the new york times, that there are people at lower levels of the justice department tour starting to talk about, whether or not, they would need to appoint a special counsel. simply because it became clear, and clear, that trump would run. the conversation, happening with garland, and his closest aides, was happening independent of what we had reported. the census, one, the decision is his, but that nobody disagreed. basically, in this tight circle of his closest advisers, people read the sp

what circumstances is merrick garland talking about here? because what has changed? >> good morning counselor, there is been a lot that's changed in the last week, one big thing in particular is that donald trump, the former president, has now become a presidential candidate. and again with donald trump, as often we are in chauncey territory. but i don't want to jump all over the attorney general, we can hear from him himself without how exactly he made this decision. >> criminal investigations, developments, including the former presidents announcement that he is a candidate for president in the next election. and the sitting president stated intention to be a candidate as well. i will conclude that it is in the public interest, to appoint a special counsel. such unemployment underscores the departments commitment to both independents, and accountability, and particularly sensitive matters. [silence] >> and katy, listening there to attorney general merrick garland, you get the sense of this really unprecedented moment in american history, he didn't really have much

merrick garland referred to both. he referred to the scope as including efforts to subvert the election. that potentially includes states like georgia which have their own criminal investigation and you could now have a dual investigation looking into some of those questions. >> sandra: based on what jonathan just said, gerry baker from the wall street journal. you and i have copies of the order appointing smith as special counsel, line b, highlighted what jonathan turley just highlighted, the special counsel is authorized to conduct the ongoing investigation to whether any person or entity violated the law we have efforts to interfere with the lawful transfer of power following the 2020 presidential election or the certification of the electoral college vote held on or about january 6, 2021. huge legal implications. and considering the players involved, gerry, potentially huge political implications as well. >> yeah, i think -- that was the language i was struck by, too. not just about january 6th, you know, the pres

from garland's position. indict, he would really be swimming upstream to indict. if the special counsel says indict, it makes it more insulated from charges of political bias. although, in our current landscape and profile, those charges are going to come anyway. robert mueller was a special counsel before. lifelong republican. straightest of straight arrows and they called him a political hack. there's no way around political turmoil, but this will mute it, at least in garland's view and it's just how he reads the law and the regulations and he follows them to -- wherever they lead him. that's the kind of lawyer and judge he was. >> i wonder if you think this will mute some of the criticism. there's been a lot of conversation about the justice department trying to reach a decision before it gets too much into the 2024 election season. >> earlier in the show, the republicans have made investigating the doj one of their prime targets. it's highly political sized in their minds. i can't imagine who exists out t

now merrick garland comes along and everyone says the exact same things about merrick garland you just said about jeff smith. merrick garland couldn't do it because in a locked room, donald trump said, yeah, i'm running again. will anybody ever deign to hold donald trump accountable to the same rule of law that the same four, five of us are held to? >> i think that's absolutely right. and we are well past the point in this country that we can pretend that blind faith in our legal system is warranted. donald trump has challenged the rule of law and the way our courts and our criminal justice system operates in a really unprecedented way. and i think it's okay for people to question where we are and wonder if anyone will ever hold donald trump accountable. that's the challenge that merrick garland faces and that's perhaps why joe biden faces, because of his reputation and biden's belief that he's up to the job. something we all wonder about is where doj was during the first year of the biden administration, the first year that merrick garland was in office. why didn't we sign of a grand

you saw garland was at pains to say today that it won't.e all know that donald trump's method of dealing with legal peril is to kick the can down the road as long as possible. i think there is concern about delay. what do you think about the delay question here? >> i'm not really concerned about that, chris. i mean, look, there is a moving bus. jack smith will have to hop on it. there is lots of prosecutors and agents, to extend the metaphor, already on the bus. they've got the case and the facts. he will get up to speed. delay is a non zero number but it's not very large. it shouldn't really be, i think, a reason for grave concern. he will get up to speed. he will be fine. like carole said, he's a very thoughtful, deeply respected prosecutor. i have no trouble with the choice. i think it's a wonderful choice. i'm just not sure it was necessary. >> carol, on the question of what this indicates about the nature of these cases, we don't know. and i think everyone would be at pains to say the decision is not made. but it does seem a fair readi

what is garland telegraphing here about upcoming trials?> i think they embolden the justice department a lot. i've known merrick garland over 30 years since we were young lawyers starting out in d.c. this is an unusual victory lap for him. if you have any question about the relationship of the oath keeper's case to donald trump's potential liability, including on some of the same possible crimes, sedition -- seditious conspiracy, the attorney general talked about it when talking about the special counsel. >> how worried should he be? >> it's not the comments alone. it's the substantial evidence that like the oath keepers defended that didn't enter the capitol that he was a significant part of events that may confer criminal liability he should be worried about the facts and the law, but also the resolve that garland, on behalf of doj, is signaling. >> the comments about the special counsel jack smith that evan asked garland about, do you think those gave any indication as to where the investigations stand now? >> they're still going full ah

so, merrick garland -- >> nonsense, john. >> merrick garland, the appearance of a conflict.ry was it, do you think, for a special counsel? >> i think the attorney general had a lot of discretion here to make the decision for a special counsel. he didn't have to do it. he wasn't required by law to do it. but it's in his good judgment to do so, and he gave the reasons for it. in particular, the timing with respect to the former president's announcement that he is now a candidate and the fact that the current president has indicated all of his intentions to run to. so, what the attorney general is concerned about is the appearance of a conflict, the appearance of impartiality. so, i think his decision to move forward with the special counsel is absolutely defensible if it wasn't absolutely required. >> so, jessica, what do we know about how jack smith -- i suppose, how and even where, he's going to be operating? >> well, interestingly, john, he will not be operating within main justice here in washington, d.c., as he's following the same steps his other special counsel. he will

we so -- ultimately merrick garland. so this is about the appearance of justice. the concern was if aidan and trump both ran for president, it might look for some people that the biden administration was trying to take down his political opponent. that would actually be the case because the attorney general will still -- without consulting the president and you way. >> there's another piece of, this which is merrick garland knows that the republican house is gonna try to drag him up to testify as often as possible. and they're gonna want to ask him questions about the investigation prosecution of donald trump. of course, he would refuse to answer those questions because it's an ongoing investigation. but now there is one other layer of his refusal to answer the questions which is he's not actually supervising the cases. >> that's an excellent point, remember, the last time around with mueller, he was under tremendous pressure within the department and the department backed a little. rob rosenstein actually gave information over to congress. they're going to want g

it's a regulation and this is how merrick garland was reading it.-ed, i made it clear, it's a nuanced call. but when he used those words, extraordinary circumstances, public interest, that's merrick garland seeing a text that gives him marching orders and as he read it, there were extraordinary circumstances. can't really debate that when he's, when the possible defendant is a presidential candidate. and is it in the public interest? the argument against it, the one that garland ultimately rejected, is, they are going to be calling this politicized in any event. there's really no way of reassuring. the last 24 hours does seem to reinforce that point. not just trump, but many republicans are saying the move itself is politicized, which is a little bit crazy. but that's the notion and the thing to understand is, this is garland reading the law that abides him and saying, we've got to do it for that reason. >> so, garland says that jack smith is going to exercise independent prosecutorial judgment on whether or not judges should be brought, harry. does

ag merrick garland appoints a

that's not an accident here by merrick garland. again, this is someone who wants to, if he's going to investigate a former president, which is fairly untrue modern ground, he wants to make sure that there is no air for any kind of suspicion of political motivation behind this. it is going to be, over the next few months, and over the next presidential campaign, a lot of scrutiny over whether any doj investigation over donald trump is politically motivated. that's to be expected. but the fact that mr. smith here is a seasoned prosecutor and has this impressive resume, i think really shows the length that the doj is going to try to be careful as they conduct this. >> charlie, we were just at the beginning of this conversation. i wonder where you believe it's going to go next. >> this conversation? >> yes, this conversation. >> to a commercial. >> no, i mean, listen, the conversation today assured alike should garland, shouldn't he, who is this guy? but there is going to be our next round to this conversation about the speed at which

in the end, doesn't merrick garland have to make a decision one way or the other? >> if you go by the strict guideline in the department of justice, the answer is yes. i don't think that's what he has in mind. i think he's really looking to have this special counsel be more in the world of cox who had total independence and really could do whatever he wanted. you know, as long as it wasn't anything completely off the wall. so i think what this special counsel is doing, he's not coming in with a staff. he's not bringing in lots of people. he's basically going with what is there and what his job is to look at the evidence and really decide whether he pulls the trigger on either of those two cases. so that i think is his limited role here and having said that, i think merrick garland is going to step back and let him make that decision as well he should. i mean, i think what you've got here is a conflict, i mean, and garland so much as said so. there is a conflict because his boss is running against donald trump who he's investigating and even though you can trust mer

. >> plus his criticism of merrick garland. >> i have great concerns about his judgment in the leadershipjustice department. >> and his believe on the supreme court's was the singlemost achievement. >> i celebrate that from really the depths of my heart. >> the former vice president opens up, as he considers his own run for the white house. >>> joining miss is "new york times" peter baker. republican strategist brendan buck, kimberly atkins stohr, and ana -- and if it's sunday, it's "meet the press." >> announcer: this is "meet the press" with chuck todd. >>> good sunday morning, we have following the breaking news reports of a shooting overnight at a gay nightclub in colorado spring, colorado. at least five are dead, another 18 so far are wounded. police say the suspect was injured, is in custody, currently receives treatment at a local hospital. the fbi is already on the scene and assisting local law enforcement. the club writes lq is devastated by the senseless attacks on our community. we thank the quick reactions of heroic customers who subdued the gunman. stay tuned to nbc news for

garland announced the appointment of a special council. another one to oversee investigations into the former president. >> the department of justice has long recognized that in certain extraordinary cases, it is in the public interest to appoint a special prosecutor to independently manage an investigation and prosecution. based on recent developments, including the former president's announcement that he is a candidate for president then next election, and the sitting president stated intention to be a candidate as well , i have concluded that it is in the public interest to appoint a special council. >> does anyone actually believe that? this is all in the public interest. the special council. known as john l or jack smith. he begaines prosecutorial career in 1994 as an assistant district attorney with a new york county -dda's office before becoming assistantment 1789 attorney for the eastern district of new york back in 1999. then from 2008 to 2010 he served for the international criminal court where he supervised all war crimes invest

merrick garland is very much by the book.g really out of the ordinary here, i expect to see the special counsel's decision. and merrick garland again, unless there's something really extraordinary will say, i am giving that great weight and that's what we'll go with. >> and the new special counsel, jack smith, he's a longtime prosecutor, no stranger to the justice department. known for his work in international war crimes prosecutions. he's obviously doing this in the shadow of everything that happened with the mueller probe. what are you going to be watching for with jack smith, elie? >> there are a few big differences between the mueller probe and this new probe. for one thing, this is not brand-new. mueller essentially started from scratch. in this case, jack smith is taking over a well-developed investigation. i imagine he will keep most of the prosecutors and the investigators and keep their evidence. but the other huge distinguishing factor, jim, is when mueller was doing his investigation, donald trump was the presiden

smith in this particular instance he's meeting with garland regularly, reviewing briefings as garlandcknowledges there. and there's a team in place working on this, gathering evidence. so he's going to function essentially like any u.s. attorney would in the investigation. the team will bring him a case, he'll make a thumbs up, thumbs down decision on whether to charge it. and it will function as part of the justice department, its own special counsel office but just like the justice department functions. >> another lawyer. >> an impressive one. gloria, the justice department and merrick garland clearly emboldened and confident here. how worried do you think trump and those around him are or should be? >> they should have been worried. now that you have this verdict in this case on seditious conspiracy. i think they should be extra worried. there's a special counsel now. there's a georgia grand jury that he ought to be worried about. on a political side of this, you've seen him time and time again claim that he's the victim here. i think it's more difficult when a jury has decided tha

i understand what mayor garland did, i want to hear what you have to say. >> garland was concerned aboutppearance of justice with both biden and trump running for president. it might look like the biden administration is trying to take down his political point and that would be a bad look for the justice department. i don't think that the special counsel is going to solve that problem, simone. first of all, the attorney general will still make the final decision about whether to prosecute. and obviously, there was a special counsel with the russian investigation, but that didn't stop trump from calling it a witch hunt. >> i mean, i have to agree with you, i do not think -- even now, the special counsel has been appointed, and donald trump is still making it something that it is not. neal katyal had something to say about this last night, he is the former acting u.s. solicitor general, and this is what he said on msnbc, listen to this. >> i disagree pretty strongly with the decision by attorney general garland to seek a special counsel. i do not think it is needed under the regulations an

well, merrick garland is the timing? well, merrick garland is the country's — the timing?ountry's top law _ the timing? well, merrick garland is the country's top law enforcement . the country's top law enforcement officer, so basically if donald trump is going to be prosecuted for these alleged crimes, these investigations that are going on into him, it is merrick garland that makes that call. he has decided he is not going to be that guy. he held up is not going to be that guy. he held up short press conference today. he explained the reasons why, the challenges he is facing. donald trump has announced he's running for the white house, but notjust that, the white house, but notjust that, the man who oversees the department ofjustice, the man who hand—picked merrick garland for his job is the current president, joe biden, is also likely to return to the campaign trail, so you can see where that conflict of interest is. donald trump has accused the department of justice of a witchhunt, and if all of a sudden merrick garland says he will prosecute donald trump, you can see

unpacking merrick garland's big announcement.he former president be handling this news? plus a familiar face who might be auditioning for for trump's vice president, omarosa right there -- will explain it all for you coming up. will explain it all for yo coming up. coming up. the drummer, the dribbler, and the day-dreamer... the dribbler's getting hands-on practice with her chase first banking debit card... the drummer's making savings simple with a tap... ...round of applause. and this dreamer, well, she's still learning how to budget, so mom keeps her alerts on full volume. hey! what? it's true! and that's all thanks to chase first banking. freedom for kids. control for parents. one bank with tools for both, all with no monthly service fee. chase. make more of what's yours. (vo) with verizon, you can now get a private 5g network. so you can do more than connect your business, all with no monthly service fee. you can make it even smarter. now ports can know where every piece of cargo is. and where it's going. (dock worker) right

look, this was the safe thing for attorney general garland to do. when you have both the former president announcing he's running for president, the current president saying he's going to run for re-election, you want to try to take the politics out of it. that's the goal here so to appoint someone from the outside who will make an independent decision. and he very well may do that. he has a very good reputation. but that doesn't mean that you won't have the former president and his allies pointing to the fact that this special counsel still reports to the attorney general. david? >> our legal analyst dan abrams with us as well. dan and pierre, thanks to both of you. >>> in the meantime we turn to the snow emergency across five states. the storm turning deadly in upstate new york. already four feet of snow in buffalo, and the band of snow expecting to keep coming through at least sunday now. more than four feet and counting in and around buffalo. look at this time lapse showing one of the band of lake effect snow heading right towards buffalo. light

so that delayed his return and made him unable to appear with garland. but we think you will sort of slip right in over the existing apparatus alex. that is somewhat different than other special counsel investigations in the past. >> i have not heard about the bike accident, is he doing okay? >> i think he broke his knee or did something quite bad to his knee and had to have surgery but we are told that he should be able to come back to washington within a few days. >> yikes, i hope he is better seen cars that hurts. what does it mean overall josh to have a special counsel assigned to these cases? and i guess the question is this. as the investigation any different from the day before he came on board? >> i think that merrick garland is hoping that whatever final decision the justice department reaches which is ultimately his decision, you know we'll have a degree is monaco's saying earlier, a degree of additional credibility and insulation for having and vogt this procedure. i think that is what's held. i don't think the investigation is changed very mu

not just for appearances, that is not what merrick garland is all about. he is not into performance art and in fact, we have already seen the president has made up claims that this nonpartisan, non political special counsel was somehow a lack did. the that's not true, the reason that it makes sense that it will actually speed things up and the circumstance because merrick garland and lisa monaco's deputy are running a department up 115,000 employees. they have hundreds and in fact thousands of investigations and prosecutions going on around the world. they cannot engage in day-to-day coordination's, tactical decisions, which witnesses to be called before the grand jury? to make the charge for the mar-a-lago documents and mar-a-lago? or because the documents were stolen in washington. we bring those in washington post? all of those decisions need to be coordinated by somebody and that somebody is jack smith. he has extraordinary experience, he is very aggressive. nobody can question his objectivity. and without, him there really is no head of that process.

a guy named merrick garland. he's going to get all the same accusations because we know trump and his base will always attack anyone who goes against donald trump's wishes. it doesn't matter if it's merrick garland. it doesn't matter if it's jack smith. it doesn't matter if it's trump's own vice president, as we sadly learned two years ago. >> you know, and exactly. very well said. i know you have to go. i really appreciate you making some time to make those very, very important points. thank you very much, sir. really appreciate you. come back any time. and jill, i'm going to go to you on the point neil just made. merrick garland makes this decision, sort of trying to make it sound apolitical. number one, there is an investigation of hunter biden that's floating around there. doesn't that mean that any investigation that involves anyone named biden also needs to go to special counsel, number one? and number two, this is how republicans are reacting. ted cruz tweeting, joe biden is completely weaponizing the depa

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that's definitely a brilliant move by merrick garland. it is now, you know, out of his hands, and whichever way it goes he no longer has to bear the brunt of the decision-making on this. the hypocrisy is what is offensive. it's not a brilliant move for the department of justice. i've never been a fan of special prosecutors. i've said that for a long time. all of the department of justice are special prosecutors. i was not a fan when starr was appointed, i was not a fan when mueller was, but the reality is you have to ask yourself, how do you under this criteria, appoint this special prosecutor, and not have done it in the biden situation, where you have an insider on a conspiracy involving hunter biden, and funds if you believing to the big guy. how do you not appoint it in that circumstance but you do here? >> martha: it's a question that maybe is not answered yet. jonathan was also speaking about this, saying there's a need for a special counsel in that situation as well, pretty much for the same reasons that the department of justice h

>>> happening now, attorney general merrick garland appoints a special counsel to oversee the sprawling federal criminal investigations into donald trump. the announcement prompted, in part, by the former president's decision to launch a 2024 white house campaign. up on capitol hill tonight, the new democratic leadership team is taking shape after nancy pelosi's decision to step aside. the house speaker giving her blessing to the new generation running to lead the party. >> also tonight, new tensions on the korean peninsula, after north korea test launches a new type of long-range missile with the potential to reach the mainland united states. we're getting reaction from u.s. national security officials. >> welcome to our view ners in e united states and around the world. i'm wolf blitzer. you're in "the situation room." >>> let's get right to our top story tonight, a special counsel now taking over the u.s. justice department's probes into former president donald trump. our senior justice correspondent, evan perez, is standing by with new information. tell us what triggered this appoin

garland has named veteran prosecutor jack smith to the position. the justice department says smith has resigned from his position at the hague where he investigated war crimes committed during the kosovo war. he will return to the united states immediately to begin his new assignment. naming a special counsel gives garland some distance from the investigation should his boss, president biden, face off against president trump in the next presidential election. >>> based on recent developments, including the former president's announcement that he is a candidate for president in the next election, and the sitting president's stated intention to be a candidate as well, i have concluded that it is in the public interest to appoint a special counsel. such an appointment underscores the department's commitment to both independence and accountability in particularly sensitive matters. throughout his career, jack smith has built a reputation as an impartial and determined prosecutor who leads teams with energy and focus to follow the facts wherever they le

i think merrick garland made a discretion decision.he department handled it for two years, could have continued to handle it but he thinks this would promote public confidence. it remains to be seen if that's the case. >> you wouldn't have done this? >> my inclination given the investigation had been going on for some time and given the stage which they've reached, is that i probably would not have. i just can't tell from the outside. >> from where you sit, does the appointment of a special counsel indicate at least a willingness on merrick garland's part to go ahead with the prosecution or is that overreading the decision? >> i think what it indicates is that, you know, despite the fact the department has been at this for some time, almost two years on the january 6th investigation, close to a year of the mar-a-lago investigation, that they still believe that they have a viable potential case. it doesn't mean they made a decision to go forward. but it certainly is an indication they believe it's a possibility. >> now, one case that's

now we have a new boogeyman. >> well, merrick garland. i think they've always thought that merrick garland was darth vader to them. if you saw merrick garland today, he hardly appears to be a darth vader. i think he'll become more of one. you'll see republicans wanting to do investigations. i'm not sure that's exactly what the public voted for. in fact, they did not vote for that, but donald trump has shown over and over again that he can play the victim card. look. this is -- this is somebody who was impeached twice and now had two special counsels working against him, he would say, you know? i would say that these are two special counsels investigating his behavior. one thing i want to point out though is that it's clear that the issue of obstruction is front and center here. perhaps in both of these investigations, and i remember back covering mueller -- bob mueller and the russia investigation that obstruction was also front and center. in the end, mueller did not make any disposition clearly on obstruction because this was a sitting

merrick garland can indict him right now. he has the power to do so. indeed i think he should, so going outside to the special counsel if anything just delays that day of reckoning, something that i find, you know, absolutely inappropriate at this point. but look, at the end of this, katie, i think jack smith -- he's not a democrat. he's a registered independent. so that's ridiculous. jack smith will look at this evidence. the evidence on mar-a-lago so an open and shut case. donald trump's best -- is to wait in line with the turkeys biden is pardoning. >> assuming innuendo, garland and smith is on the money, this is not going to delay, the appointment of smith, it's not going to delay. the evidence is teed up through the investigation that's already been conducted. does this not give sufficient nonpolitical, apolitical cover for merrick garland with the ultimate indictment of donald trump? you and i both know garland would never bring on smith for indictment. >> i want to fight the premise. it's impossible to bring someone new on to an investigation an

attorney general garland appointed special counsel. well it bring donald trump nichols or to justice? plus, democrats are already looking to 2024 in the shakeup of the presidential primary calendar. i'll speak with former 2020 candidate, castro. just a few moments, a live report from colorado springs with the latest on that shocking mass shooting inside an lgbtq nightclub. on tuesday, a major and pretty shocking political moment in our nation's history occur. an event, whether we like it or, not would have reverberations for years to come. >> in order to make america great and glorious, again i had tonight announcing my candidacy for president of the united states. >> the fact that donald trey trump, a disgraced twice impeached ex president can make this announcement despite everything is a massive indictment of this country's political systems. it shows how broken our media is to. to put mildly, trump's four years in office were one long car crash of scandals, controversies, corruption and chaos. and came the first president to be imp

this is before merrick garland made his announcement. this is what he said about the case involving the mishandling of classified documents at mar-a-lago. >> i personally think that they probably have the basis for legitimately indicting the president. i don't know, i'm speculating, but given what has gone on, i think they have the evidence that would check the box. they have the case. >> do you think they will? >> i think it's becoming increasingly more likely. >> you said that it could be pretty soon. when you talk about that, i talking several weeks, a few months, what is the soonest? because the way he talks about it, it's almost like it's a foregone conclusion. >> i think it could be a few weeks, a couple of months. they do need to move fairly quickly but as i said, any case that they would bring that relates to the documents themselves and the improper taking and storage retention and so on, they would want to bring any obstruction charges along with that as well so i think they will need to wrap that up. maybe a matter of six week

justine garland's move here. installs a new chain of command over the sensitive investigations and recognizes their potential political implications. >> appointing a special counsel at this time is the right thing to do. attorney general merrick garland has selected jack smith, a veteran career prosecutor to oversee 2 of the justice department's criminal investigations involving former president donald trump. one probe focuses on the presence of classified documents at mar-a-lago. while the other involves the january 6 attack on the u.s. capitol and efforts to overturn the results of the 2020 presidential election and to prosecute any federal crimes that may arise from those investigations. garland said his announcement friday was triggered by trump's own announcement this week that he's running again for president in 2024. and also president joe biden's intention to seek another term. extraordinary circumstances presented here demanded garland said smith will start work immediately. a special council requiring h

at the end of the day, merrick garland still owns this decision.t the end of the day, merrick garland makes the final determination. in other words i don't think he's purchasing that much distance between himself and the special counsel. >> walling off this investigating part of this. >> he is. to be clear, jack smith will be an independent actor up until the end when determinations and decisions have to be made. those decisions will rest with merit arlen. >> we have seen the justice department sensitive to election years in the past. >> the sooner the better. but the special counsel can outlive in administration. john durham was appointed special counsel by bill barr and is still working under the supervision of merrick garland. >> it's clear that a former president can be charged for a crime. >> absolutely. if they can prove it and the facts supported. -- supports it -- support it. >> thank you for your time. i'm vanessa ruiz. we will return to the full program after the lates headlines. donald trump responded tonight to that appointment of the s

garland sa matt , let's start with you now. garland saids that trump's announcement and biden's professed likely run in 2020 four were factors in his decision to name a speciala spea counsel. coun th announcement on tuesday or somehow triggered this decision? justifiably? >> i don't think so, lord . it's good to be with you tonight. i think here wthis ie go againso i mean, this is the left's favorite tool is to appoint a special counsel and then letry the media breathlessly report on every twist and turn ofand 2r a special counsel, giving itn some imprimatur of evenmissta super legitimacy like merrick garland misstated a very important factte , and that is that this special counsel. e is not independent from the department of justice. >> this special counsel departm is going to not only use all the resources of the departmentc of justice in the fbi, buttl alo report directly to merricky garland. is coa wantroy for merrick garland to solely control the fate of donald trump's legal cases. most part and i think itisan is probablye

we know merrick garland is on a clock here, and merrick garland knows he's on a clock. donald trump knows he's on the clock. how much is trump thinking about that when he makes the announcement? >> well, i have not heard this directly from donald trump, so he has not said this to me but advisers of his have told me over the past 68 months that he does see running for president as one of his best offenses against these investigations, being a live political candidate, which he has been toying with. he keeps escalating, saying -- it's almost comical, i am very probably going to announce very time soon, et cetera. he's really been operating like a live political candidate for months now, and he does see that as a protective mechanism, obviously formalizing and announcing takes it to another level, but he's very cognizant of that i am told. >> it is worth noting that in his legal filings, trump has mentioned his potential candidacy. august 22nd, a filing requesting the special master. president donald trey trump is the clear front runner in the 2024 presidential primary, an

your reaction to what we just heard from ag garland? >> you know, victor, there really isn't a roadmap for a circumstance like this because of how remarkable the circumstances are. as the attorney general laid out, you have a former president being investigated by the justice department. to do this by the book, to conduct these investigations in a way that the textbooks would say to do it, yes, the attorney general had to appoint a special counsel here. what you have to do is take out even the appearance of impropriety. look, we all know -- i wasn't born yesterday. and within hours, the record of jack smith is going to be picked apart, and he will probably be seen by some or criticized by some as being a partisan political hack or tool. we saw this play out with robert mueller several years ago. the simple fact is removing it from the chain of command to some extent, to the justice department, is very valuable. the other point i would make here, the one person who was not there on the stage, and that was jack smith. that was to give at

at the end of the day, merrick garland still owns this decision. at the end of the day, he makes the final determination. i don't think he's purchasing that much distance between himself and the special counsel. >> rolling off this investigative part. >> he is. jack smith will be an independent actor up until the end when determinations and decisions have to be made. those decisions will rest with merrick garland. >> doesn't need to happen befe the presidential election? we have seen a justice department sensitive to that. >> the way to think about it, the sooner the better. a special counsel can outlive and administration. john durham was appointed special counsel by bill barr. still working under the supervision of merrick garland. >> at this point, it is clear a former president can be charged for a crime? >> absolutely, if they can prove it and the facts support it. >> thank you for your help. >> in the other news, the u.s. and other nations offered an 11th hour proposal to rescue u.n. climate talks from failure. the focus was on compensating n

garland wants to insulate him from those accusations. the truth is, it almost does not matter who they appoint as an independent prosecutor. as far as donald trump is concerned, his supporters are concerned, no one could ever possibly fair enough in their eyes to mr. trump. he released a statement, mr. trump. "totally expected political stunt by feckless politicized, weaponized, biden department of justice." >> which of the criminal investigations into mr. trump will the special counsel be overseeing? >> the first one is the january 6 capitol riots. they will be investigating to see if there a any criminal charges to be brought against donald trump who is accused of inciting a mob to try to overturn the 2020 20 election results. the second follows the fbi raid on his home in mar-a-lago in florida in august. he is accused of removing highly classified top secret documents from the white house when he left florida. those are the two investigations that jack smith will be overseeing. he will decide if there are any criminal charges to be br

what i question is why after all this time does garland now decide to appoint a special counsel. and the answer, of course, is it's because trump declared his candidacy. and that's the problem. it really does the opposite of what attorney general garland wants to do, which is to insulate the department from politics and partisanship. look at the reaction to his announcement. all heck has broken loose. trump is going on the air waves calling this a witch-hunt. republicans are calling for a special counsel for hunter biden. other people who are very anti-trump are angry at garland, feeling that he has punted the football. and that's what's happened. he's turned the special counsel into a political football at this point. >> interesting. as opposed to merrick garland saying because of the stated intentions of running in 2024 by trump and biden it's necessary to have a special counsel because among the investigations is the peaceful transfer of power, the threat to a peaceful transfer of power. and now you have those same or possibly the same people involved, meaning a trump and a bi