. - [margaret] midway through donald trump's presidency, george conway emerged as one of donald trump's sharpest critics. - [george] you know, it's like the administration is like a [censored] show in a dumpster fire. - [margaret] a stance that was notable because his then wife, kellyanne conway, was a senior counselor to the president. - he's a whack job, there's no question about it. i call him mr. kellyanne. - [margaret] george conway has long been well-known in conservative legal circles. - i grew up watching american politics as a kid, and becoming a reaganite. and so i still believe in that. - [margaret] he supported the impeachment of bill clinton. - i think he effectively committed obstruction. i found it deeply offensive. - [margaret] and was once considered for a post in trump's department of justice. now, he is one of the strongest voices supporting the prosecutions of trump. - this man's a criminal, and i don't think he deserves a pass on anything. - [margaret] and has donated nearly $1 million to president biden's reelection effort. - the reason why i'm supporting joe biden

george conway, kellyanne conway, wanted to be part of the administration.cohen going back decades with the trump team, and allen garten, they have long and complicated histories. >> and to the extent the jurors can recognize. >> when alina habba was passing george conway, the jurors were out of the room. >> these people who have such intertwined histories, i mean, donald trump's future could be on the line. >> definitely. definitely. it's been really remarkable to see in person, and i will say, the jury was paying close attention. that's all you can ask for in a moment like this. sitting there as the prosecution or defense, are you singling out jurors in your mind? can you read their mind based on their facial expressions? >> no and no. i'm watching the jury because i want to make sure they're listening. if i'm losing the jury, i want to know that. but trying to guess what the jury will do or what an individual juror is thinking, katy, i think that's hazardous. it's tea leaves. and so i've never tried to do that and i would have gotten it wrong. >> danny ce

george conway, charles coleman, and anna bauer. tank you for spending your friday memorial weekend eve with me and giving us the goods on what you think is going to happen. i really appreciate with your time. enjoy your weekends. >>> still ahead this evening, we know that the number of abortions rose in the year 2023 despite the proliferation of state bands. tonight, louisiana has become the first state to figure out a brand-new way to stop people

and i apologize. >> george conway, donald trump has never apologized.en on tv since most of my life. he's never done that. but he did it not because he was afraid melania would be upset. he did it for the campaign. >> absolutely. you never heard him say that again. he doesn't apologize for anything. that was how bad this was, that he actually made a public apology and admitted wrong. he never does that. i mean, he's been asked, do you ask for forgiveness from jesus christ. no, why would i do that? then, this is something i can't believe that my brain still remembers but in december, he actually told the united states senator, this was reported by maggie haberman of "the new york times," that the "access hollywood" tape, we think that was faked. he actually said that. i mean, you know, that was absolutely 100% fake remorse. it's the one time, you know, i have written about him being a narcissistic sociopath who has never shown any remorse. when i wrote that article about five years ago, this was the only time i ever found any evidence that he apologized

george conway? >> that is perfect donald trump. his reputation has been in the past that he is sleepy donnal. i have talking to journalists who have written books about him and back in the day, he never showed up in the office at trump tower before 11:00 a.m. or ever, apparently. we know what he did at the white house. he was not there in the morning. he was not an early riser and read his briefing books. this is rough on him. he's got to get up early every morning. and he's not free to fly around the country like we are. >> there is the for a reason. we are going to discuss the gag order. we have to take a quick break and we will be right back. bac. . now there's an easier-to-use at home skin tag remover, clinically proven to remove skin tags safely in as little as one treatment. only purple's gel flex grid passes the raw egg test. no other mattress cradles your body and simultaneously supports your spine. clinically proven to remove skin tags memory foam doesn't come close. get your best sleep guaranteed. save up to $800 during o

george conway. >> that is perfect donald trump. his reputation has been in the past that he is sleepy donald. i've talked to people who wrote books about him back in the day and he never showed up at trump tower before 11:00 a.m. and we know what he did at the white house. he was not there in the morning. he was not an early riser to read his important briefing books. this is rough on him. he has to get up every morning. he is not free to fly around the country like we are and the people on the telephone commercials. >> there is that for a reason. okay, you are all staying where you are. we are going to discuss the gag order. we are going to take a really quick break and we will be right back. right back. i have moderate to severe plaque psoriasis. thanks to skyrizi, i'm on my way with clearer skin. 3 out of 4 people achieved 90% clearer skin at 4 months. and skyrizi is just 4 doses a year after 2 starter doses. serious allergic reactions and an increased risk of infections or a lower ability to fight them may occur. tell your doct

on the impact of hope hicks is testimony on the jurors that trump himself, vocal trump critic george conway, standing by to join us live. that's next greetings happen yeah. that's not good happened huge things happen happen. be there with three, learn more at rnc dot critics and audiences are raving about them. number one, get america when they come talk to you in good guadagnino's challengers. >> nothing short of miraculous. it's pure filmmaking booleans challengers, we are now playing in theaters everywhere time for growth funding from bus due credit makes it possible, are easy and convenient process makes it simple to take the next step on your journey this to credit funding. what's next that's good data cough. >> oh, no bob, i call later chest congestion. >> hello, 12 hours of relief wow, bowers now coffering about movies, past acts, del knocked off mucinex, dm 12 hours i'm back season stubborn chest congestion, dry mucinex, 12-hour. sure. i'm a paid actor and this isn't a real company, but there's no way to fake up work can help your business. so much talent all over the world with ove

let's bring in attorney george conway, who was inside the courtroom what room today, as well as in studio here with me, former trump attorney tim parlatore, george. you were in court do you agree with paul reads assessment and the assessment? smith made by other journalists, other people in the room, that todd blanche really took a hammer to michael cohen's credibility, especially on that october 24, 2016 phone call, assertion, what was your take i thought it was a mixed bag. >> i don't i don't think he was particularly effective. all day overall. i thought i thought that there were some some good points that were scored here and there and particularly about the, you know, about his history of lying and mystery of misstatements. but it was scattered was to he took too long. the question he took too long to get to each point it should have been done much more quickly. and as a result, it was it just felt meandering and ineffectual and the thing that also surprised me was that how a little of the cross-examinati on really addressed the case? i mean pollock refers to that one circumstance ju

let's discuss this in more with conservative lawyer and vocal trump critic george conway. george, thanks so much for joining us. why are we seeing so many republican lawmakers parrot trump's baseless claims about the weaponization of the us judicial system against trump the republican party is in the thrall of a now convicted felon and adjudicated rapist. >> and they are all jockeying for position in the party because that's what they're used to doing, they're used to parroting his lies and protecting this man who has basically done nothing but bring disgrace to the party and it's just absurd. it's just mendacious on so many levels. mean, first of all, the first person to be charged with any crime that involve the stormy daniel's episode was of course, michael cohen, who charged michael cohen. it happens to be the united states department of justice in 2018 lo and behold, who was president in 2018? me, this is just absurd. the man cohen went to jail for doing under federal law for committing campaign finance violations that he admitted two and then testified to under oath

. >> i also have george conway, you're joining us, andrew on this breaking news, and george conway, obviously, i don't think it's any secret to anyone who's watching. you're not a fan of donald trump's, but, but for something like this, for someone who declares himself the law and order president and talks about how he's there to back the blue and attend memorial services for officers here in new york and then to see, how he's talking about these law enforcement officers simply because they work under the umbrella of the fbi and how he feels about the fbi is quite remarkable when when you read how jack smith puts it to these stark terms here in this filing? >> yeah. and i don't think i mean, i don't think there are terms that are stark enough to describe what donald trump has done here. i mean, he's a pathological liar. he lies about everything. but this lie is just an exceedingly dangerous lie. >> as as as the attorney general and mr. mccabe has pointed down and it's an attack on the entire system of the legal system. as judge grosso put it before the break. >> and to emphasize how dramatic

. >> george conway on the man nikki haley just indoors. >> do you think donald trump would follow the constitution if he were elected to a second term? >> i don't know. >> the american doctor who shot these unbelievable scenes inside a gaza hospital and he will join me live. all in starts right now . >>> good evening from new york. i'm chris hayes. it's been 24 hours since reporting by "the new york times" revealed that a flag championed by the far right christian national movement, displayed widely by january 6 insurrectionist as they storm thedonald trump also flew all summer long last year over the beachhouse of supreme court justice samuel alito. that news about that flag came days after we learned that his home in virginia also displayed an upside down american flags in the weeks after the violent sacking of the capitol. another symbol, adopted and embraced by trump stop the steal support. in that case, alito responded to questions in an email statement saying his wife , you know, the wife, hoisted that inverted flag in a dispute with their liberal neighbors. why? it does not say

george w bush, and the conservative lawyer and contributor to the atlantic, also a trump critic george conway at very grateful to have all of you this morning. david from, i would like to start with you and we're going to contrast what you have had to say about this with what we have heard from mr. conway, you write this wrong case, right. verdict. what has been served here is not the justice that america required after trump's plot to overturn the 2020 election first by fraud, then by violence it's justice instead of an incredible, especially ironic sort driving home to the voting public, that before trump has a constitutional criminal, he got his start as a squalid hush money paying document tampering tabloid sleeves ball, what does this mean the system is trying to difficult the whole trump to account for his crimes against the constitution, but for his crimes against the ordinary political process for the kind of stuff that gets everyone who runs any kind of dry cleaning store sent to prison and get some trouble that is tampering with your records to conceal improper activity. >> the syst

i am back with george conway, charles coleman, and anna bauer. tchered the quote, but i do wonder what you think of it. is this-- i mean, in some ways represents bookends of the trupification of the republican party in the speaker of the house coming to the aid of a potential felon outside of the republican courtroom. >> they always managed to sink lower. you have the speaker of the house of the united states of america, who is a conservative, evangelical christian, telling- - telling outright lies about a trial, in defense of a-- an adjudicated rapist, who he knows lies in almost everything he does. and is-- no, this isn't a sham trial. the evidence is there. the grand jury indicted him. what does he have to say about the evidence that involves, not really in dispute. the person he is lying for, this conservative christian evangelical, who paid off a porn star that he had sex with very briefly and covered it up with a payoff. i mean what-- what is he saying is the library? he is lying. and he is lying in defense of a pathological liar and crimina

the reporters in the room, boebert and gaetz keep turning around to stare at anti-trump attorney george conwayboebert are turning the first-ever criminal trial of an ex-president into some sort of telenovela. [ dramatic music sting ] ♪ george? lauren! matt. ♪ george? [ laughter ] matt? lauren? [ gasp ] kellyanne! ay, dios mio! ♪ [ laughter ] [ applause ] got all the cameras right. [ laughter ] it wasn't -- i'll be honest, not a lot of confidence from the staff. [ laughter ] but aside from embarrassing themselves and their party i'm not sure what exactly they were hoping to accomplish with their presence. i guess they were there to offer moral support for trump and ended up coming off as creepy. for example, see if you can spot matt gaetz in this clip of trump speaking at the courthouse. >> are you worried about a conviction? >> will you testify, mr. trump? >> thank you very much. [ talking over each other ] >> excuse me, excuse me. we are going to be working with a lot of people over the next couple of weeks. this is finishing up. at some point it will be finished. every single review, every l

they noticed george conway. they started to snicker.rybody stared right at george conway and whispered among themselves. they did the same thing looking at michael cohen. you get the idea that donald trump bringing this crowd is not just a show of force for the cameras outside but a show of force for the witness inside. potentially even the jury. can you get under michael cohen's skin by not just showing him donald trump, but all of his entourage with him? the lawmakers who have yelled at him in congress, the potential vp candidates, donald trump's family, former colleagues of his, epstein there. trying to see if anybody can knock him off his game. michael cohen, for his part, has not looked at donald trump, from what i can tell. he stayed focused. if he had gotten any coaching -- i know he has gotten a lot about how to deal with todd blanche. he is doing it. he doesn't seem like he is somebody who isn't aware of the way he should approach this testimony, isn't aware of how he should say yes. there were a couple instances where he got i

it's not hard. >> george conway, it's good to have you. thank you. coming up next more from the full trial transcript just out also, in light of all we've just been saying in so many ways about myself cohen here would he is saying for himself tonight about the prospect of taking the stand and later former deputy assistant attorney general, harry litman joined us. his thoughts from his time in court today the myth has to be re-imagined it was theater. >> you didn't know whether you were next? >> they were both tied up? >> yeah. yeah. i was called in and they saw what turned out to be the biggest heist in history he went from gold medal winning icon to a pariah would really happen with jesse l. >> martin. sunday's at nine on cnn. >> you know, i spent a lot of time thinking about dirt at three in the morning and he china what people don't know, is that not all der, is the same? you need dirt with the right kind of nutrients. look at this new organic soil from the miracle grow, everybody should have it, it worked great for us. >> this is as good as gold

back with the panel joining us conservative lawyer george conway, who was in court today what were your takeaways? >> i might takeaway. was that the continued cross-examination of stormy daniels was a complete disaster and a fiasco for the defense. i mean, as a rabbit hole, they didn't need to go to it, just was just it just went on and on and didn't cheat. they didn't have anything. honore. and you got to confine crosses to basically a few short lines of stuff that's good. >> they didn't do that. >> i think what happened was they had a day off and necklaces of very good lawyer by reputation. i can even tell just by the way, she conducted as she knows, how to cross-examine a witness and knows how to ask questions but she was she's per client is a narcissistic sociopath and who is obsessed with proving the lie, that he didn't have anything to do with stormy daniels. and so they went off on this whole tangent on, but basically it doesn't it done in a lot. the defense's position should be it doesn't really matter whether that happened or not, because even though it wears extortion money it

walked in and the first person that caught my eye was everybody from greg kelley on the right to george conwaythe left. and i appreciate that they all want to act journalistic in those moments. on looking but they are snarking and it's very strange feeling. >> jesse: it's like a show trial for the media except there is no law that's been broken. they haven't even named the crime. >> it's unbelievable. when anything salacious happens all you hear is the clicking of the keyboards. when actual law and facts are discussed it's silent. >> jesse: i expect that. that -- it sums it up perfectly. everyone is looking at donald trump. is he cursing or sleeping, what else can you see? >> the ruin of our justice system. you can see everything. i'm sitting in the front row pew behind the team that's doing the case and you can see everybody. there's a tech team, there's all the people and commentators we see on tv watching. it's a very strange thing. >> jesse: does the judges seem like he's in control of the courtroom? >> he is commanding. you can tell he is outspoken. you can tell he has an opinion. in fron

, not surprising, joining our coverage, conservative attorney and contributed to the inventor, george conwayditing the things that the vp were saying outside the courthouse because they were the things he would say if he was not at risk of criminally violating his own gag order. >> that's right. but in doing that, he was criminally violating his own gag order because that order covers people, covers any statements made on his behalf that he causes to be made and that is clearly what he did here. he brought these people encourage them to cut come to manhattan, edited their statements and sent them out so they can make the statements that he wanted them to make but that is nothing going on here that i think it's worth pointing out. this is part of a massive effort that appears to be going on on trump's side to keep this man from blowing up. to keep him on the relatively emotional even keel for donald trump you saw last week where there was a story in the new york times where they are printing out things to cheer him up and then you saw how last week he almost, he lost it in the courtroom when

george conway, charles coleman, and anna bauer.tank you for spending your friday memorial weekend eve with me and giving us the goods on what you think is going to happen. i really appreciate with your time. enjoy your weekends. >>> still ahead this evening, we know that the number of abortions rose in the year 2023 despite the proliferation of state bands. tonight, louisiana has become the first state to figure out a brand-new way to stop people from accessing reproductive choice. that is coming up next. we see you. athletes. investment bankers. doctors. business leaders. we see your ambition. your desire to succeed. which is why we are investing in your future. ...empowering the next generation to reach the c-suite and elevating women's golf. because you may not always see yourself in the world, but we see you. nice to meet ya. my name is david. i've been a pharmacist for 44 years. when i have customers come in and ask for something for memory, i recommend prevagen. number one, because it's effective. does not require a prescript

george conway, thank you.nd vaughan for filling in the gaps that you've left, the massive gaps you left by being stuck in traffic. thank you, andrew weissmann. i'm going to stay out of it. >>> just ahead for us, donald trump may or may not testify in front of a jury of his peers, but he does now have a date to debate joe biden. it's next month. we will preview what that will look like after a very short break. don't go anywhere. e after a vert break. don't go anywhere. ed tardive dyskinesia, or td. so his doctor prescribed austedo xr— a once-daily td treatment for adults. ♪as you go with austedo♪ austedo xr significantly reduced dan's td movements. some people saw a response as early as 2 weeks. with austedo xr, dan can stay on his mental health meds- (dan) cool hair! (vo) austedo xr can cause depression, suicidal thoughts, or actions in patients with huntington's disease. pay close attention to and call your doctor if you become depressed, have sudden changes in mood, or have suicidal thoughts. don't take if

. >> in heard george conway go al my god and put his hands to his face.y reacted theto h same w. they played podcasts at the the beginning and cohen was all like we have to arrest this guy and i need my revenge. he had this hysterical voice. people in the court say the jurors were embarrassed for michael cohen and michael cohenm was embarrassed fobar himselfcas because he sounded like a whackb job. at that point donald trump was-o paying very close attentionth because they wereye playing the podcast. then for almost thane entire day the defence counsel was saying lie, like, ally. catching them in lie after lie. even lying about wanting a abo pardon. then he was caught in another lie. actually i did ai di ask for a t in. 's voice was breaking, he wasin shifting in his seat. and then he was deleting texts with his wife and he had recorded over 100 phone calls10 with reporters and0 other peop. total scam artist. i guess from what i'm hearing, they just have to prove this. correct me if i'm wrong judge. this payment was a campaign finance violation and trump

conservative lawyer george conway, who was in the courtroom today. he is actually wearing a jacket.a contributing writer at the atlantic. also a former assistant district attorney with the manhattan district attorney's office. she is now an msnbc legal analyst. and a department of justice veteran and former act solicitor general. you were our eyes and ears in the courtroom today. what stood out to you? >> there was not much said about the gag order. it was a written opinion and we didn't have the judge read it in court other than to say i ruled the nine out of 10 for the prosecution. >> why didn't he read it? >> because he wanted to get straight to the trial and a lot of the stuff we just heard about what was in the opinion we did not actually here in open court. that obviously was very significant, because he will have more to say on this next week when the second round or third round actually of gag order violations is going to be discussed and i think it is already significant. he mentioned the possibility of jail and is not going to impose it for the next series of events becaus

to be when i heard in the courtroom, that big moment jeanine described, george conway goes, oh, my godt his hands to his face, and the jury reacted the same way. so they played podcasts at the beginning, and cohen was all like this. got to arrest this guy, i need my revenge, and he had this high-pitched, giddy, hysterical voice, and people in the court say the jurors were embarrassed for michael cohen, and michael cohen was embarrassed for himself because he sounded like a whack job. and then come at that point, donald trump was paying very close attention -- obviously because they were playing podcasts -- and then for almost the entire day, the defense counsel was just saying lie, lie, lie come over and over, catching him in lie after lie, even lying about wanting a pardon and then he was caught in another lie, actually i did ask for a pardon. his voice was breaking, cohen, he was shifting in his seat like this, looked extremely uncomfortable, and then was gotten out that he was deleting texts with his wife, and he had recorded over 100 phone calls with reporters and other people, tot

george conway, the lawyer, husband of kelly and conway who is of course close to donald trump made a the alleged lies of people versus trump strike at the core of the moral to try since and trump knows it. they are lies allegedly meant to cover up a tawdry man's tawdry behaviour. the case embodies donald trump and for that reason, i think it deeply disturbing. there are a lot of people around him that actually think that it is starting to get at the president, the former president, and it is starting to show. . , president, and it is starting to show. ., , , ., president, and it is starting to show. ., , , ., ., show. certainly if you look at him in the court _ show. certainly if you look at him in the court room _ show. certainly if you look at him in the court room he _ show. certainly if you look at him in the court room he looks - in the court room he looks absolutely tired and washed out, frankly — absolutely tired and washed out, frankly i— absolutely tired and washed out, frankly. i do think that there is this issue _ frankly. i do think that there is this issue that donald tr

and george conway put his hands to his face. and stared at the ceiling. could not believe it. >> michael cohen was cornered and what appeared to be a lie. >> i don't think i have ever seen a star cooperating witness get his knees chopped out quite as clearly and dramatically is what just happened with michael cohen. >> this does seem pretty bad. >> i feel like there are a lot of questions that have been raised. >> if i was a juror in this case, watching that, i would think this guy is making this up as he is going along. >> jesse: donald trump called it fascinating. >> i think it was a very interesting day. it was a fascinating day. and it shows what a scam this whole thing is. i'm spending a lot of time and i'm spending a lot of money which is what they want. they want me to spend my time in my money. and i'm willing to do it because ultimately we have to fight for the constitution. >> jesse: the entire testimony was a disaster. trumps lawyer played for the jury, michael cohen sounding like a lunatic on his podcast. a very different michael conlan from w

in and the first person that caught my eye was everybody from greg kellsye left on the right to george conway on the left. kaitlan collins sitting there. and, you know, i appreciate that they all want to act wa in those moments. i'm sitting there and i'm looking, but they're snarking and it's ver y strange feeling. >> so it's like a show trial. itg. jesse: is for the media, ? except there's no law that'sher been brokelan. >> they haven't even named the crime. it's unbelievable. and when anything salaciouss th happens, all you hear is thee clicking of the keyboards. but when actual law and factss r are discussed, it's silent. >> that that i expecet that that sums it up perfectly. >> everyone's looking at donald . is he cursing? is he sleeping? what else cap. n you whenee you're inside that room, the ruin of our justice system? to be honest, you can see everything. i'm obviously sittinstem. g in the front row pew behind the team. that'sm that doing the case. a and you can see everybody. there's a technd team. there's obviously all the people, the commentators that we see on tv sitting there all

yesterday, or sunday, george conway was on margaret hoover show she does the night show on sunday andeferred to donald, similar to hitler's, a fascist. i am fearful we will lose our constitution. there are prominent republicans who fear fascism. we fought world war ii against fascism. we just had memorial day to honor those who fought fascism. i just can't stand it. this is a terrible situation. people need to hear the word fascist with donald trump because he is a fascist. host: let's hear from richard in pennsylvania on the republican line. caller: listening this morning, a lot of the same games. we have to stop listening to the lies that are out there. basically, what has happened, we are listening to one man who is a demagogue. the republican party it wants was but it is the lies that are killing us. people are struggling to live their lives and we have to stop listening to this bs out there. i have heard it on the show as well. please, do not lose our democracy that's the main thing. don't listen to the lies, listen to reason. host: one story from u.s. today. the army cartel u.s.

yes, george, our friend george conway. he said, what is everybody getting so exercise church think the same demand is around. looted anything, sitting just just in front of andersen. >> i wanted to grab you and be like, oh, my god, norton, are you hearing we had a quick conversation about it. >> it was a good moment of cross. it was a very professional and powerful moment of cross i think if cohen had been shown those texts by the prosecution on the direct examination, if they had refresh his recollection, there's nothing implausible about, but actually what's happening right now. i think both subject it seems like a huge mistake. by prosecutors was not the best. it was not do they know did they not look at what the texas there it was not their finest moment. >> i my experience has been it wasn't it was a blow on the chin, but my experience, 30 years of doing this is that it takes more than one punched knock out a witness. this is a witness that the jury had believed but watching the jury at the time, i did not think it wa

but he also talks about the great times joining us now to new attorneys to add to our law firm george conway and tim parlatore george, what concerns might you have as somebody who thinks that donald trump is guilty of crimes you i'm talking about what what concerns might you have about michael cohen's credibility? and are they surmountable? >> well, the concern i have is that he you know, he's got to keep his cool i don't think i mean, i think the thing about this is that the about what's happened in this case is the the, government has essentially pre corroborated michael cohen and a lot of ways. >> so the burden on cohen and the burden on the prosecution on how it elicits testimony from cohen is reduced at the same time because i don't really see what the alternative scenario that the process that the defense has to will be arguing is an alternative explanation of this series of facts i don't see what that is yet i think that they're not i don't think they're going to be able to do much damage showing that cohen is lying about the facts of this case that said they're going to try to show t

. >> george conway sat at this table and said he was with kellyanne conway and jared and ivanka and askedope's testimony about karen mcdougal used by the prosecution to do? >> so i think, again, she came off as somebody who is very credible giving that inside context how it was playing in the campaign. the prosecutors to prove it's a felony have to come back to the fact that he wasn't worried about melania or the family and how it was affecting the campaign. you have a woman saying she had an affair with this. you don't have hope hicks saying, he's worried about how melania was going to take this. she doesn't testify about any of that. >> melania did come up. there was a conversation between donald trump and hope hicks -- was it after the 2016 story on karen mcdougal -- >> "the wall street journal" story. >> yes. donald trump says to hope hicks, can you make sure the papers aren't delivered to the apartment today so melania doesn't see them? as if melania doesn't have a phone and doesn't call anybody, her only source of news is a physical newspaper. so she did mention -- i'm sure that don

we do have george conway in the room as well.n conway as we prepare for part two of the cross examination of michael cohen. the last go-round that todd blanch had it michael cohen didn't exactly go as folks expected. a lot of legal experts thought it was a little bit of a scattershot cross examination, not a lot of direct angles and story lines being told there, but trying to undercut cohen's credibility. we're being told by sources that todd blanch today will focus on cohen's past lies, his lies to congress, his lies under oath in the past, his lies in 2016 and 2017. of course, that's something the jury has been primed for. the prosecution and cohen himself have already admitted that he has lied in the past. cohen says it's in order to protect former president trump. he lied in the service of his former boss. that is what we expect will be the focus of the defense today. this is the prosecution's last witness. that's it for them. whether or not that's a good thing or a bad thing, i'll let your legal panel chime in on that. but t

conway, fox news contributor. also mark thiessen former speech writer for president george w. bush and now an american enterprise institute senior fellow and washington post columnist and former biden 2019 -- 2018 circuit. we fancy totals for you because you bring a wealth of knowledge to this conversation. does begin with this interesting new polling we have. this is from npr pbs news hour. president trump holds a big lead with independence has him at 54%. president biden 42%. is it really going to come down to these independents? it seems like the really hard-core base on either side are locked in with them when they are going. -- where they are going. >> yes. that's the highest lead donald trump has had among independents since mariss was actually the question about these 2 paragraph think it's significant because why does someone call himself or herself an independent? they are not moderates, their nationally suspicious of government. institutions for better or for restricted don't like the 2 parties, they don't like those who have been watching for over 50 years like joe