also george gianarikas he has a buy rating on the shares gentlemen, thank you for being here tim, wewith you to set up the story 2022 saw a lot of shareholder disruption for tesla it is more of the same for 2023 or can it find the bottom? >> it is hard to say it can go further down it has been a horrible season for tesla. when you look ahead to the year to 2023, there is market rumors of refresh to the model 3 and model y. the question could be where is interest rates are we in a recession? where is the buyer mind set? those are things that investors are worried about tesla going forward. twitter and elon musk with those distr distractions this is a growth story if that growth can continue, people will be excited >> george, this idea that that's is almost talked about in multiple circles now as more of a traditional type car company suc secular issues similar to ford or gm. is tesla a mature auto company >> no. we value it relative to traditional growth stocks. large cap. apple or alphabet or meta or nvidia if you look to next year with the uncertainty with earnings and out to 2025,