ginnie mae and the home loan banks. ginnie mae didn't fail, but fha is deeply under water now. once you shift the risk from fannie mae to freddie mac, who knows how they'll bail that out. home loan banks never failed, because they over collateralized. regul regulatory arbitrage. that's why when he went into indymac, the banks had half the collateral and there was nothing left for the fdic. this is my last slide. securitization should go, because it's inherently undercapitalized. and i would say that the capital requirements should be transparent, covered bonds have extra -- more capital requirements, but they tend to have over collateralization, just like i did in my first bond deal, because the investors don't trust the regulators, the quality of the capital or the quality of the loans that an institution is providing. so they want excess collateral. and you know, that's -- you've got to have capital someplace. okay. i think we'll wrap that up. take questions. send hate mail to my e-mail. >> thank you, kevin. captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2008 captioning pe

the reason ginny mae was created was to find down fannie mae and freddie mac and only left one part of fannie mae in existence and it was only for fha loans, had absolutely no point to exist once ginnie mae, outside of its chartering legislation went and created a new securities market. so of course you can wind them down. this whole notion that we won't have fixed rate loans without them, well, they're intermedi e intermediat intermediates. it turns out that when these institutions were created and when we got dependent on fixed rate mortgages, 85% of the market on the other side was fixed rate liabilities. it was all in life insurance companies, because we had relatively low insurance. if you go back to the 1970s, everybody has fixed rate nominal liabilities going on forever. that's down to 15% of the market now. there are no fixed rate liabilities. in pension funds, all hedged to inflation. nobody wants that. so there is a very small other side of the market. if you want a fixed rate loan a pure gamble on your part that you can pay it off if interest rates go down, you're going to h