correspondent evan perez and gloria borger. gloria, what are you guys learning? >> some time in early to mid-january the president's legal team sat down with the special counsel and at that time the president's legal team really wanted to get this investigation of the president over with. and so, they were talking about a potential interview. and this special counsel suggested a date, saturday, january 27th. an interview that would last anywhere between four and five hours. we were told. and the president's team just kind of sat there and took it all in and then when they got back together they were actually to the point where they were thinking where can we have this interview? maybe camp david to keep it kind of private. eventually, though, january 29th, two days after the interview to take place, john dowd wrote them a 20-page letter saying absolutely not. >> this is the attorney before rudy giuliani came into this

our gloria borger has more. gloria. >> reporter: so far the special counsel's investigation has yielded 75 criminal charges, 22 defendants, and dozens and dozens of witness interviews. experiencing team mueller up close is no walk in the park. >> it's intense. you know, first of all they ask to pick you up at a nearby hotel because they want to sneak you in the back door. that's the way they want to drop you off as well when you're done. it's also not a friendly environment. they're professional, i wouldn't call them impolite. >> reporter: but they are well informed. >> they know more about the trump campaign than any single person that worked there. that's because they have the documents. the mueller investigation knows more than one person does and anyone who sits with them needs to be mindful of that. >> reporter: especially the president as he and his team of revolving lawyers are aware. what would trump risk if he testified in front of bob

i have with me gloria borger and david preece. good to have both of y'all on. gloria, let me dive in to you, the headlines, about how trump said he would guarantee kim jong un's safety. now, he said that but let's remember what his own vice president said in the last 24 hours warning that kim could wind up ala libya and moammar cad gadhafi, dead. >> this will only end like the libya model ended if he doesn't make a deal. >> some people saw that as a threat. >> i think it's more of a fact. >> how do you square that?

you heard gloria borger's reporting. >> actually, wolf, i didn't hear gloria borger's report. but anything that the president does with regard to talking with mueller, i'm sure it will be quite the thing if that actually happens because they're creating all kinds of -- demandsiing all kinds of positions. it's sad to say too many people including chairman nunes of the house intelligence community are playing right into that and facilitating that lie. >> what gloria was reporting he would be willing to answer questions but only on events that occurred before he was sworn in as president. anything after that including his decision to fire james comey, he would only do in writing. what's your reaction to that? >> i think that's trying to limit what the mueller investigation should proceed with, and i think it's crazy that, you know, that part of the allegation is or the investigation involves his efforts to stymie and interfere with the mueller investigation. and of course, that includes the comey firing. so for them to be setting the parameters for how and when they're going to h

gloria borger is standing by.her coming out of this. >>> also as lawmakers get ready to start to arrive for the second meeting, i want to discuss why this white house lawyer attended this meeting originally not scheduled to be there and when democrats didn't want anyone from the west wing there. stick around. almost $800 when we switched our auto and home insurance. with liberty, we could afford a real babysitter instead of your brother. hey! oh, that's my robe. is it? when you switch to liberty mutual, you could save $782 on auto and home insurance. and still get great coverage for you and your family. call for a free quote today. you could save $782 when liberty stands with you. liberty mutual insurance. booking a flight doesn't have to be expensive. just go to priceline. it's the best place to book a flight a few days before my trip and still save up to 40%. just tap and go... for the best savings on flights, go to priceline. handcrafted layers of clean food you can give your kids. tomatoes. even the picky ones

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gloria borger will join us with details. each day justin chooses to walk. at work...fter work. he does it all with dr. scholl's. only dr. scholl's has massaging gel insoles that provide all-day comfort. to keep him feeling more energized. dr. scholl's. born to move. kyle, we talked about this. there's no monsters. but you said they'd be watching us all the time. no, no. no, honey, we meant that progressive would be protecting us 24/7. we just bundled home and auto and saved money. that's nothing to be afraid of. -but -- -good night, kyle. [ switch clicks, door closes ] ♪ i told you i was just checking the wiring in here, kyle. he's never like this. i think something's going on at school. -[ sighs ] -he's not engaging. >>> breaking news tonight. jared kushner's attorney, abbe lowell, tells cnn his client had a second interview with robert mueller's team last month, an interview that lasted seven hours. >> back in the fall, they were interested in understanding some of the issues about general flynn and he answered all of their questions then. and in april, we basically

. >> reporter: my colleagues, evan perez, gloria borger, and i have learned that the president's legal team is trying to narrow the scope of any potential interview with the special counsel to russia-related matters that occurred before trump's election. also, they want an audio recording made to make sure that there's no question about what is actually said. now because mueller clearly want to talk about issues occurring since trump has been in the white house like potential obstruction of justice and firing james comey, our sources tell us that with those questions, they're proposing written answers. but there's no indication that this will actually work with mueller. our sources have cautioned that while the sides are talking and inching toward some agreement that mueller has clearly suggested that he's not interested in written answers to questions. so there could be a standoff. in that case, you may see this question of a presidential interview go all the way to the supreme court. >> all right. thanks. >>> the business partner of president trump's attorney, michael cohen, pleading

gloria borger is joining me now. >> i hate when that happens. y >> you come back from the gym and i'm always in your office having meetings. >> that's right, with the russian ambassador. >> why are we just hearing about this now? >> i'd like to know what michael flynn is saying about this meeting since he's n now cooperating with the special counsel. we don't know what jared curbmer h -- kushner has said about this meeting but jared kushner was supposed to be the back channel between the trump transition and russia. and we do know that jared kushner had meetings with russians including kislyak and this is one we don't know about and we don't know what it was about but obviously don jr. wasn't saying much about it because he wasn't really much a part of it, or so he says. >> it seems like there might have been other opportunities -- jared kushner has had to revise his statement. >> and in his testimony before congress, which we have not seen the whole breadth of that yet and certainly before the special counsel but again, michael cohen, who was g

gloria borger, pamela brown as well. >>> another lawsuit filed by stormy daniels. i will speak to her attorney next. >>> more breaking news about the allegations of ronny jackson. what we are learning next. ways to lthe northern belly fat. percussion massage. not cool. freezing away fat cells with coolsculpting? now that's cool. coolsculpting safely freezes and removes fat cells. with little or no downtime. and no surgery. results and patient experience may vary. some rare side effects include temporary numbness, discomfort, and swelling. ask your doctor if coolsculpting is right for you. and visit coolsculpting.com today for your chance to win a free treatment. you won't find relief here. congestion and pressure? go to the pharmacy counter for powerful claritin-d. while the leading allergy spray relieves 6 symptoms... claritin-d relieves 8, including sinus congestion and pressure. claritin-d relieves more. i am totally blind. and non-24 can throw my days and nights out of sync, keeping me from the things i love to do. talk to your doctor, and call 844-214-2424. si

gloria borger and i have learned that jared kushner's security clearance was restored today officially. it was suspended during the rob porter scandal, where rob porter was allowed to remain on staff despite allegations of spousal abuse. john kelly suspended the clearance of everybody whose clearance was pending, that included jared kushner of course. we have heard now from abby lowell, who is kushner's attorney and he says this is a process a long time in coming. he said it was delayed in part due to the fact that kushner's application was very complicated and the fact that there was a back log that begins for every new administration. the second piece of news that we have from gloria borger and myself is that jared kushner went in for a second interview with the special counsel robert mueller. this happened in mid april. he sat for seven hours, answered questions, a number of questions on different topics, a lot of it having to do with his role in the campaign, his role in the presidential transition, as well as some questions after president trump took office and that includes quest

our gloria borger has more on that. first her report, our best inside look at the investigation, itself. >> reporter: experiencing team mueller up close is no walk in the park. >> it's intense. you know, first of all they ask to peck you up at a nearby hole, because they want to sneak you in the back door. that's the way they want to drop you off when they're done. it's a friendly environment. they're professional. i wouldn't could them polite. >> reporter: but they are well informed. >> they know more about the trump campaign than any single person that's worked there. that's because they have everybody's documents the mueller investigation than anybody who does. anybody that citizen i sits with them need to be mindful of that. >> reporter: especially the president and his revolving team of lawyers are well aware. >> what would trump risk if he were to testify in front of bob mueller? >> untruthfulness and the possible charge of lying to a federal investigator. >> at the end of the day is it a perjury trap or not? from

>> especially if he gets fired. >> that was gloria borger reporting.to don lemon. cnn starts right now. >> this is cnn tonight. i am don lemon and we've got multiple breaking news stories. again for you. president trump back in his happy place tonight in front of a crowd of adoring supporters at a campaign-style rally in indiana. >> we will never give in. we will never, ever give up. and we will never stop fighting for our country, our freedom,

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especially if he gets fired. >> gloria borger is is joining us right now. excellent piece.has been quiet about the justice department. what does this bode for rod rosenstein? >> right now, he's preoccupied with foreign policy. the iran deal. also a new legal team he's put in place. he's got a few new lawyers and they're clearly telling him the same thing that his former lawyers were tell iing him. which is leave rod rosenstein alone right now. leave jeff sessions alone right now. congress, republicans in congress are facting with him. let members of congress have this fight with him. we don't want you to get involved. however, wolf, you know with this president, it's very unpredict bable! very. wonders every day what's going to happen. >> especially rosenstein. >> good work. thank you. just ahead, why did the head of the epa share an expensive meal with a cardinal accused of sex abuse who's also a climate change denier? david. what's going on? oh hey! ♪ that's it? yeah. that's it? everybody two seconds! "dear sebastian, after careful consideration of your application, it is

we've also got gloria borger up there as well. what's going on with jared kushner? this hour we're finding the white house mass now restored jared kushner's security clearance. if you remember, it was suspended back in february when the white house was doing an overhaul of security clearances after the rob porter scandal. he was still employed at the white house despite the allegations of spousal abuse. so the security clearances of jared kushner and other top officials who had been pending was suspended at the time. we're told that the word now from the white house is that it is now officially restored. this is something that people close to jared kushner say was done through the normal process. there was no pressure put on the fbi that did the review for the security clearances. no pressure was put on from the president or anybody else. obviously we know that there's been months of a cloud over jared kushner about the security clearance. in his first submission, if you recall, back in 2017 there was a number of -- dozens of foreign contacts left off the applicatio

>> according to my colleague gloria borger, she said it was a very tense meeting, simply because john dow had a very sharp response to the idea, the idea being that this would interfere with the work of the president, and this is something, obviously, the president's legal team takes very, very seriously, and this is why they believe, you know, it should never even come to this. even the idea of an interview, they believe, interferes with the work of the president, because obviously he's preparing for a summit meeting with north korea. this is something they keep bringing up as one of the many reasons why doing this would interfere with the president's work. >> earlier the "washington post" was reporting that according to their reporting, the president is thinking now of not going for an interview, not complying, that he doesn't think it's a good idea. is that what you're hearing as well? >> that is exactly what we're hearing. i think it's become abundantly clear that the president's legal team is getting ready for a standoff, really, on a subpoena. if a subpoena does come, there is,

we will also be joined by gloria borger. later the president speaks to the nra a few months after he said he was open to changing gun laws in the wake of the parkland shooting. obviously a much different tone today. we will hear what he said plus speak with two of the parkland school survivors next. ster's new create your own shrimp trios. pick 3 of 9 craveable creations for just $15.99. you can enjoy the classics you love, along with new creations like savory crab-topped shrimp, decadent parmesan truffle shrimp scampi, and creamy shrimp and lobster pasta. your perfect shrimp plate is just waiting to be discovered. but shrimp trios won't last, so get to red lobster today. and get your red lobster fix with our weekday lunch starting at $7.99. hey ron! they're finally taking down that schwab billboard. oh, not so fast, carl. ♪ oh no. schwab, again? index investing for that low? that's three times less than fidelity... ...and four times less than vanguard. what's next, no minimums? ...no minimums. schwab has lowered the cost of

yeah, according to a source who spoke with my colleague, gloria borger, the focus of the

gloria borger and larry noble.ges and there's a lot in here, let's talk about what you sigh in here about trump paying michael cohen for stormy daniels. we have that disclosure on page 45. >> that's right and last year, it was admitted. i signed last year's report and i can tell you, if i had known that he omitted this, i would have said the same thing that the current acting director, that this is reportable and it's terrible to the decision to certify it. so i would have refused to certify it. there was no getting around certificating it and i'm another person at the campaign legal center wrote an op-ed monday warning the president that he's out of loopholes. he had to disclose this thing. so he did, but it's terrible that talking about a terrible message, the tone from the top for the other 25,000 people who have to file financial disclosure reports, that he's saying i didn't have to report this. op onthe front coverage page, yes, you did. he knew for a while that the position was reportable and still wrote a no

here to talk about it is gloria borger, phil mudd and carrie cordero. it is interesting. both sides seem to think this is not appropriate. you have senator blumenthal saying he worries about the precedent it set and the president supporters are saying the president got played. >> right. conservatives like meadows, i talked to a conservative attorney involved in all of this today who said, look, this is just sweeping it under the rug because the inspector general, a, will take a while and, b, doesn't have subpoena power. so they're saying how are you ever going to get to the bottom of this? they believe that rosenstein was just trying to diffuse this, maybe save his job, and that the president eventually will get frustrated. >> phil, you worked in the fbi and the cia. is there precedent for this? you now have this investigation from the inspector general being expanded and you have chief of staff kelly going to be going through some classified information with folks from the fbi, the doj, the dni, and also congressional leaders. >> yes, sure. but i remember talking to vice

we will also be joined by gloria borger. later the president speaks to the nra a few months after he said he was open to changing gun laws in the wake of the parkland shooting. we will hear what he said plus speak with two of the parkland survivors next. ♪ ♪ (baby crying) ♪ ♪ don't juggle your home life and work life without it. ♪ ♪ and don't forget who you're really working for without it. ♪ ♪ funding to help grow your business... ♪ ♪ another way we have your back. ♪ ♪ the powerful backing of american express. don't do business without it. proven to protect street skaters and freestylers.ng of american express. stops up to 97% uv. lasts through heat. through sweat. coppertone. proven to protect. with expedia, you can book a flight, hotel, car, and activity... ...all in one place. everything you need to go. expedia >>> before the break we spoke with a "wall street journal"ist michael rothfeld who has been reporting michael cohen was stockpiling money, expanding his home equity line of credit building up three-quarters of a m

. >> this coming from gloria borger.et with the special council in 2017, this is notable because of his proximity to president trump. it's notable because of his proximity to other figures within the campaign, namely, paul manafort and his deputy rick gates. a source indicating that was the focus of this interview. the special counsel wanted to know more about paul manafort and rick gates. manafort has been charged with a whitney of financial crimes including fraud. he's denied all of those allegations. that source telling us that the special council zeroed in on those relationships, that he did not ask barack about his relationship with president trump. western told that barrack was told he was not a target of the investigation. >>> more breaking news this afternoon. house minority leader nancy pelosi calls for an ethics investigation into a fellow democrat accuses of sexually assaulting a teenaged girl, the new developments next. truecar is great for finding new cars. you're smart, you already knew that. but it's also

joining me now is cnn chief political analyst gloria borger. gloria, what are you learning? >> well, michael cohen's lawyers, and this is their first response, really, to michael avenatti, are timing in court, trying to block avenatti from representing stormy daniels in a new york courtroom. and what they are saying is that he used false information and he disseminated it and he used, got bank records that were gotten in a very strange way, which they believe to be illegal, and they are saying that as a result of this, avenatti should not be allowed to practice in new york state in the court. they're not saying get rid of the stormy daniels case, but they are saying that he published information that was either inaccurate or that, michael cohen's bank records, and they believe those records may have been gotten illegally. >> they're firing a cannon in this courtroom. >> absolutely. >> however, the actual disputed things are like pinpricks, because they don't dispute all of the information provided in these documents by michael avenatti. >> right. the pinpricks you're talking

i have with me gloria borger and david preece. good to have both of y'all on. gloria, let me dive in to you, the headlines, about how trump said he would guarantee kim jong un's safety. now, he said that but let's remember what his own vice president said in the last 24 hours warning that kim could wind up ala libya and moammar cad gadhafi, dead. >> this will only end like the libya model ended if he doesn't make a deal. >> some people saw that as a threat. >> i think it's more of a fact. >> how do you square that? >> after john bolton, the national security adviser originally made the statement about libya, then the president backtracked on it and said no, no, no, the libyan model is not the model we are thinking about and that threw things off track. i don't understand and maybe someone can explain it to me how the president can say that we will guarantee kim jong un's safety. what if he is under threat from his own people, for example? does that mean that the united states would intervene on his behalf? i think he's trying to bend over backwards to say forget

>> gloria borger and i have learned that the president's legal team is trying to narrow the scope of any special interview with the special counsel and narrow it to russia-related matters that occurred before trump was elected president. now, our sources are telling us that in order to try to avoid a standoff, one possibility they're thinking about is limited trump interview plus written answers to questions that special counsel clearly wants to ask about things happening during the president's time in the white house, like obstruction of justice. we know that is something the special counsel has been asking people about. >> is there any indication this will actually work, that mueller is willing to cut a deal, or is this just stuff that the legal team is kind of floating out into the public as a way of, i don't know, influencing something? >> that's a great question. first of all, the answer to that question is obviously this is something that the legal team is trying to get out into the public, or at least entertaining in the public as a way to try to push robert mueller and his te

go gloria borger is standing by. let's just get rolling on all these different headlines. gloria, first to you. the notes that jim has from the source that, you know, the reasoning behind this ty cobb departure was because he was clashing with the president, he didn't want to be part of the mud slinging, he was uncomfortable with the president's tweets. is this just another signal that the president will not be sitting with bob mueller? >> reporter: yeah, i think it is. we did the story last night saying that the legal team is at this point preparing a more adversarial posture with the special counsel. it's clear that's the way that it's heading. and, you know, to follow up on jim's reporting, that is not the way that ty cobb wanted to go but he was the odd man out. and i was told by one source that cobb said, look, when the situation becomes too rancid, that's the word, when it becomes too rancid, then i'm going to make my exit. there's also the case that, you know, ty cobb came in to prepare all the documents, to make sure all the witnesses were interviewed, to make it ki

. >> stick around, i want to bring in gloria borger, dana bash. >> any time a first lady is hospitalized it is significant for a number of reasons. >> well, it is. and in this case, melania trump is quite popular, a 57% approval rating. she is seen frequently now. she has got her own agenda out there. so we do see her a lot. and it is important for another reason. people in this country look to the medical treatments of people who were well-known to see in their lives if something should happen to them what they might do. i remember when nancy regular beg -- nancy reagan had breast cancer and she had aggressive treatment. people will look to the first lady and try and figure out what she has and they are being protective about it. but trying to judge from her treatment, this is what melania trump did, and maybe this is something that i ought to think about. so it is significant. >> yeah. and to gloria's point, it comes after a very busy period for the first lady. >> she clearly has made a point of not only putting her own agenda out there but being more present even as recently as the en

whole notion of a subpoena versus the question of whether the president could be indicted and gloria borger talked to another source familiar with the legal plans by the president who said this notion, this question, what do you think, can the president be indicted. was brought, this was leading them to this for the explicit reason of trying to make the argument well if that is the case, then you have no right to subpoena him. >> this is exactly what i heard. >> so carrie cordero, from a legal standpoint, is that a solid arguments. if there is concern about mueller issuing a subpoena, the trump team arguing if they want to fight the subpoena which it seems like they would, the argument to the court would be there is no need for a subpoena if there is no underlying crime, that would be an indictable crime. can a subpoena be issued even if an indictment is not possible to be tendered? >> as dana said at the opening of the show, none of this has been ruled on by the supreme court whether or not a sitting president can be indicted or receive a subpoena. so because these are actions and indictme

kirsten power was gloria borger laura coates. gloria be the "wall street journal" report, all along michael cohen said i got a home equity line of credit to pay stormy daniels. i did it because i'm a loyal guy to mr. trump. he didn't even know about it. giuliani has now said it did have something to do with the election because it would have been bad. then he stepped back from that. he said the president paid michael cohen through the retainer to me. now the "wall street journal" was saying it wasn't just the $130,000 basically there were two transactions gained access to about $700,000 zmo over 700,000. >> as the campaign started to heat up. we don't know what he used the rest of the money for. we don't know if it was for the president, other business deals michael cohen was involved in. >> we don't know why he got the loans. we have no idea. we have no idea. what we do know is that the timing is interesting because as soon as the president started taking off in february of 2016 was when michael cohen started doing all these tran

>> reporter: according to my colleague, gloria borger, the questions centered around tom barrack's relatio

i want to discuss this with chief political analyst gloria borger.learly a number of companies that were trying to find a channel to president trump through michael cohen and they were paying him big bucks to do that. you just said one of these companies has quite an amazing statement. >> they're throwing michael cohen under the bus. novartis is saying they thought he could advise the company how they could address certain u.s. matters such health care. then they say the agreement was for a year, michael's company was paid $100,000 a month and they one meeting with him and they determined he would be unable to provide the services that he thought he was going to provide but they couldn't fire him because they could only fire him for cause so they continued to pay him for no work through february 2018. >> it seems like cause would be if you can't deliver. if you can't deliver what you expected, all they maybe -- >> maybe that's a little different point to make. >> so you see it as legitimate. we should also point out it not just legitimate meaning thi

our gloria borger is reporting that the blitz angered and blind-sided some members of the justice team>> it's very hard to see. and you can imagine emmet flood a real pro who's onboard feeling completely blind-sided. on the one hand the revelation or the admission that trump knows about the payment puts him a giant step closer to coconspirator liability with cohen for whatever campaign finance violations there may be. and on the other the reiteration of the narrative that he really didn't know anything about the hush agreement when it was made makes it harder to enforce the mba, makes it more likely he'll have to sit for deposition. there's just dozens of headaches this will create down the road. and you have to imagine it was not at all cleared with the people who are now supposed to be actually in charge of figuring out trump's legal strategy. >> well, see if our other legal mind on the panel agrees. do you agree with that, michael? >> yes. in fact i think that what rudy giuliani did, whether he did it in coordination with the president or some think i thought he was freelancing and

the scope of the investigation -- >> right, this is reporting i did along with ed one perez and gloria borger. as you said trying to narrow the scope to specifically questions before donald trump was in office, and even more so, russia related questions, meaning because they argue this whole thing was supposed to be about russia clouollusion. they also don't want the president to be asked in a face-to-face interview about chuck schumer justice. they know other witnesses were being probed on and the investigation would be about the firing of james comey. we're told by our sources that -- because the trump legal team understand -- they were trying to say those questions can be asked in written form. the question is whether or not robert mueller is going to go for it, and the answer is we don't know. what we do know according to sources we have talked to, they were cautious saying look, these knocks are inching along. a couple of sours admitted that robert mueller isn't interested in written answers. that may be a bridge too far for him. this may end up in the supreme court if in fact they can't

joining me now we have cnn chief political analyst gloria borger, sarah murray and white house reporter sarah westwood. she has the details on how cohen pitched himself to companies after the months president trump was elected. describe this pitch, sarah, and also if cohen was able to make good on it. >> we're hearing cohen had an opportunity to pitch himself after the leelection and he seid it. one republican strategist described his pitch like this, "i don't know who has been representing you but you should fire them all, i'm the guy you should hire, i'm closest to the president, i'm his personal lawyer." it's important to remember this was coming at a time when corporations were desperate to make inroads with a new administration, it's an outsider president. >> and they thought hillary clinton was going to win and she didn't, right, so they found themselves sort of flat-footed, not with the in that they thought they would need there. so it seems like it's widespread practice for high-ranking associates to -- >> it's called cashing in. >> corey lewandowski did it. is there something d

back now with allen dershowitz and jeffrey toobin and gloria borger. >> we are learning is it really you have his new legal team in place and they are trying to figure out what to do and there is a sense among a lot of his attorneys that the president ought to stay away from this. ought to fight this, and the president's state of mind particularly after the raid of his personal attorney, michael cohen's office is i'm not going to sit for an interview. whereas the president initially was sort of all for it. i am going to sit with mueller, and i can do this. right now his state of mind is no way, i'm going to do this. >> professor, how long a fight could the president put up through courts to try to resist a subpoena? >> in general, since he is the president, the courts will allow him to defer and ultimately the supreme court which is more than a year even with expedited appeals and that gets him to a time when congress is controlled by the democrats. he will lose enough that he will have to give some testimony under the worst of circumstances without his lawyer being there with no res

and gloria borger. >> reporter: we've asked, they have not responded yet and earlier today, sarah sanders, she was sort of reading from different talking points today. i think gone are the days they are going to speculate a lot on these legal troubles she was deferring us over and over again to the legal team. the president's legal team is making a final push to make the determination one way or another. the source i spoke with said the odds are around 50/50 and. >> one source who spoke to my colleague and gym's colleague, saying they are looking for this may 17 deadline. this source said it is all fluid. and my sources are telling me the reason this is fluid is because this legal team right now is being run by two people. the president of the united states and rudy giuliani who is not read in on the legal case. emmett flood is coming in and has to deal with the security clearance in order to do that yet. and most of the attorneys, believe the president should not testify. and i think they would agree with rudy giuliani on that and have this sense watching this, watching it play out over

gloria borger, what are you learning?>> michael cohen's lawyers are filing in court trying to block avenatti from representing stormy daniels in a new york courtroom. and what they are saying is that he used false information and he disseminated and he used got bank records that were gotten in a very strange way which they believe to be illegal. and they are saying as a result of this, avenatti should not be allowed to practice in new york state in the court. they are not saying get rid of the stormy daniels' case. they are saying he published information that was either inaccurate or that were michael cohen's bank records and they believe those records may have been gotten illegally. >> so they are firing a cannon. the actual disputed things are like pin pricks. >> the pin pricks that you are talking about is that avenatti got some wrong michael cohen's. referring to a guy in tanzania. someone in israel who is not the correct michael cohen. but as for the larger issues, there is no definial of the this you and brian were

gloria borger, what do you believe the president's political motivation is right now? >> well, i think he's trying to undo some big wins by his enemies. it's pretty clear here when you look at what he's already done with dinesh dsouza, which is major campaign contributions. and rod blagojevich who was convicted of trying to sell a senate seat, basically, public corruption, and martha stewart was a comey case, and she was convicted of perjury. you know, making false statements. blagojevich was done by patrick fitzgerald who was appointed by comey. i mean, i think there is a pattern here, and i think that the president is making it very clear there is no nuance to donald trump, we've learned over this year, and what he's saying is, you know, i've got a lot of power and i can use it where i want, and you guys had some big wins here, you thought you did, well, guess what? i'm undoing it, and for the future i can do that, too. >> carrie, you're a former assistant general for security. how do you see it? >> i was county assistant general, but thanks for the promotion. i thin

our chief political analyst gloria borger and shimon prokupecz. can the president claim that he knew nothing about this payment? >> no. i think rudy giuliani has some explaining to do and i think tha that's what we'll hear this afternoon. can you imagine a client saying about his attorney, give him some time, he'll get his facts straight? i don't think he should pay rudy giuliani for that. rudy giuliani is new to the case. our reporting is that the other attorneys on this case were appe apoplectic about rudy's media tour the other day, because he doesn't have his facts straight, that michael cohen's attorneys were not happy, either, obviously, because these are different stories. rudy giuliani was supposed to be out there to be a message about how terrible the special counsel is, how the fbi is corrupt, and if he decides in the end not to testify, he can then say, why would i testify before these people who are unfair? so that's the case rudy giuliani is supposed to be making publicly instead of messing up everything that was said before. >> and p

. >> i can tell you, to me and gloria borger, the president's legal advisers were simply blindsided by rudy giuliani's comments, they were perplexed by them. rudy giuliani remember was brought onto represent the president in the russia probe and the robert mueller case. so the president's lawyers, others on his legal team were confused as to why he ven tustu into this other territory that isn't his portfolio. and the fear was that rudy giuliani went on television, spoke to the media, and was essentially winging it, wasn't prepared with all of the facts, and it sort of underlines a notion that the president himself who rudy giuliani claims he coordinated with before this television appearance is his own legal strategist. what's notable is that rudy giuliani did not coordinate with the rest of the legal team on something as important as this. >> all our legal observers are saying this is a political argument that rudy giuliani is making, not really a legal one. i wonder if the people who are in charge of making sure that donald trump is protected legally worry that rudy giuliani actually

sources tell our gloria borger and evan perez that the president's lawyers and special counsel actuallyte for bob mueller to interview president trump, but the trump team balked. this formal q & a between the president and the president's team was in the planning stages for earlier this year, january 27th at camp david. days earlier, you'll remember the president told reporters that he was, quote, looking forward to answering mueller's questions. joining me now on all of it, shannon wu and molly ball. molly, let me begin with you on how extraordinary it is what lauren just reported. the fact that you had emmet flood, a white house attorney, and the chief of staff, folks on the president's team in this meeting about a confidential source that could be key in the probe against the president and that giuliani told dana, well, you know, the president wanted him in there. >> right. the objection to this meeting in the first place was the suspicion that the reason republicans had convened it and at the beginning it was only going to be republicans was to basically collect information for the

but as cnn's chief political analyst gloria borger reports rosenstein seems to be unruffled by the situationesident is in your boss, this is not what you want to hear when he's asked if he'll fire you. >> you'll figure that one out. >> reporter: trump was dissing his own deputy attorney general rod rosenstein for whom every day can be a near death experience. as a frustrated president lashes out as the russia investigation. >> the entire thing has been a witch hunt, and there's no collusion. >> reporter: rosenstein became the man in charge once the attorney general recused himself. so he's the one who hired the special counsel, which leaves him as the man in the middle, between trump and any move to fire robert mueller. a precarious place. oddly enough rosenstein started out as a teacher's pet. >> highly respected, very good guy, very smart guy. the democrats like him, the republicans like him. >> this guy is man of upstanding character and essentially a gold standard at the department of justice. >> reporter: rosenstein's stock rose even higher when after just two weeks on the job he wrote