does gordon ridder ring a bell? if he doesn't it's probably because he lets other people ring the bell. that's ridder in the corner rt handsome blond fellow is one of the bay area's most successful ipos. viva starts the first day of trading on the new york stock exchange, and that was not his first win. gordon ridder was one of the very first investors in sales force a company with a $32 billion market cap. in fact ridder and mark bennyoff founded a company together before sales force called software is a service. he's a partner with emergence capital ventures. the reason i think it's fascinating that you named the company software as a service is that's what the whole category is now called which is like opening up a thing and calling it restaurant. >> or internet. >> right, or airport. and then has this idea we'll have airplanes, we'll call it airport. you were crazy early to this space. >> things kind of work out for the best. meeting mark bennyoff in that point of his career as he was transitioning from oracle to