some have made smart changes andfrom utah we have gornor herbert what did you do? >> we try to think long term. we move from the defined benefits to the defined contribution. john: oh my gosh. don't say those words. [laughter] steve uses those all the time but i know that you are switching off. explain why it you talk about. john: defined benefit mean the politicians defined the benefit this is what we py the teachers. >> the rerement income and guarantee benefit until you die. john: we promise. as opposed to? >> typically called 401(k). you define the money in the account to have tord the retirement and build up over time. then the taxpayer liability ends. john: not like so secured year medicare, it is real money. money in your account. not subject to the whimof politicians. the other is the promise. and a good chance the money will not be there. >> hot air i a risk because courts state audacious a is guaranteed but then the taxpayer has to make it up. because of the obligation that has not been followed through. john: rhode island made a change and can workers ge