they're being persecuted and they have to go out and do something about it. >> do we still have harry lipman with us? okay. let me ask you, frank, you may be able to speak to this. there's a difference between all of us -- any of us sane, normal people saying trying to kill somebody is crazy, there's a difference between conspiracy, crazy, and what would be considered to be legally insane, that you could do a -- an actual -- make a successful case to say, not guilty by reason of insanity. otherwise some people might argue that all the people who have already been convicted of crimes in january 6th could be considered not guilty. so, how do you make that differentiation? when you're an investigator, which you have been in a case like this, how do you make that differentiation? >> you have to gather every piece of available information and that will include his police record. don't be surprised if he's had run-ins before, especially at this level of conspiracy lunacy. it's likely that the local police have encountered him before or even federal authorities. someone just doesn't do this for the

harry lipman joins us, a former u.s. attorney and former deputy assistant attorney general. let me just not go the down the rabbit holes of alex jones but the families had pain and suffering from the massacre being described as a hoax and the nearly billion dollars in damages does nothing, nothing to deal with their grief but it was as signal, it seems harry, that the jury felt that it was represent henceible. >> even his defense attorney said in close, nicole. this is a despicable human being and, of course, he's the vilest vermin out there on the landscape. yes. it doesn't compensate them for their suffering but, man, does it wallop jones. there's going to be maybe some post-appeal skirmish -- post-trial skirmish ed, but he'll be dodging this now for the rest of his life trying to declare bankruptcy. already his parent company, the second of three trials, declared bankruptcy after the -- the last one. this was one of those cases where the jury comes back and says can we give more than the plaintiffs want? >> wow. >> he was shown to be -- in 14 days of testimony to be so de

it exacts a political cost for him. >> harry lipman, so good to see you.ricka. >>> all right. and then there's this, this ongoing mystery in california's silicon valley. a cardis covered buried in the backyard of a mansion is being checked for possible human remains now. a former homicide detective joins us to discuss next. ♪ for over 100 years, lincoln's s been exploring new ways to deliver sanctuary in its vehehicles. comfort for body and mind. that's ambitious. but the future of sanctuary, well that's downright audacious. ♪ i shop with the rakuten app to get cash back anytime, anywhere. i even get cha-ching when i ♪ sing ♪ ♪ home decor ♪ ♪ clothes ♪ ♪ electronics ♪ and mirrors. [ding] i can shop at over 3,500 stores, including travel sites. ♪ cha-ching! ♪ i found a cheaper price for my meds, with singlecare. ( ♪ ) whether you have insurance or you pay cash for your prescriptions, you can still save with singlecare. insured, uninsured, cash pay, or copay. it doesn't matter. singlecare is accepted at major pharmacies nationwide. just look up your prescrip

harry lipman, thank you for talking us through the developments all week long. great to see both of you. eddie sticks around. >>> when he come back we learned a lot yesterday about who was really calling the shots on january 6th. at least we learned who was trying to take control of the growing danger unfolding at the u.s. capitol on january 6th. one of the most compelling things that happened in the hearing is never-before-seen footage. now there is more of it and we have it. incredible behind-the-scenes footage of a fired up and very much in command and control house speaker nancy pelosi from that day. we'll show you some more of that video we have obtained. >>> later, more on that escalation from the january 6th committee and we will speak with a committee member, zoe lofgren and someone who knows firsthand what it is like to go up against donald trump, trial attorney barry burke, all those stories and more when "deadline white house" continues after a quick break. house" continues after aui qck break. ♪ what will you do? ♪ what will you change? ♪ will you ma

scott jennings, harry lipman, natasha, thank you. >> thank you. >>> another prime minister comes and goes. liz truss announces her resignation after 45 days on the job. what now? that's next. >>> and the pentagon now confirmed that iranians have been on the ground in ukraine to assist russia with drone operations. what these developments could mean for the future of the war. g at amazon, she was ready for those... uninvited guests. [g[growling] shop legendary deals at amazon.n. it's the subway series menu! 12 irresistible subs... like #6 the boss. pepperoni kicks off. with meatballs smothered in rich marinara. don't forget the fres. don't you forget who the real boss is around here. it's subway's biggest refresh yet. (vo) you can be well-dressed. (man) wahoooo! (vo) you can be well-groomed. or even well-spoken. (man) ooooooo. (vo) but there's just something about being well-adventured. (man) wahoooooo! (vo) adventure on a deeper level. discover more in the subaru forester wilderness. love. it's what makes subaru, subaru. subaru is the national park foundation's largest corporate dono

joining me now, kelly o'donnell, harry lipman, who was once a supreme court law clerk himself.ouse, former "new york times" reporter. the paperback version of the book, justice on the brink, is out tomorrow. kelly, first to you. the court taking up some really consequential cases this term. members of the public are allowed inside the court for the first time since the pandemic in 2020 and the big fence came down. so what was it like inside there today? >> reporter: there was definitely members of the public. some spacing in the seating allotted for him. justices kagan and sotomayor wore masks. others did not. what was certainly notable in this first case today, justice brown jackson engaged right away. she was asking many questions of the lawyers who were here for a case that deals with water rights and the epa and could there be more federal regulation of property rights when it comes to water and it was certainly interesting to see how she engaged quickly and other judges referenced her questions so she was right in the mix on her fers day on the court. of course, today's ca

i saw harry lipman tweeting about this and it was sort of a calm you down tweet.it sure is suspicious looking for clarence thomas to be the one to rescue lindsey graham from having to testify. talk me down. is this something i should be concerned about? >> joy, i can only talk you down in part because it seems like the supreme court is willing to embrace the stench of illegitimacy. i don't understand why they continue to dig themselves deeper and deeper into the hole of illegitimacy. their reputation, their credibility is being damaged every day, i believe, in the eyes of the american people. and there are ways to avoid it. you know, the word recusal doesn't seem to be in clarence thomas' lexicon. he's wading in to the same territory in which he has a conflict. he's the one who voted to withhold his own wife's deeply damaging and potentially incriminating text messages to mark meadows, urging him to overturn the results of a presidential election. but here we go again. now, we can perhaps talk each other down a little bit because it looks like this is a temporary

attorney and former deputy assistant attorney general harry lipman. in terms of the subpoena of the former president, is the clock going to run out on the committee in terms of the timing for that? what is the possibility that he would come forward and even say anything? >> yes and nil, basically. jonathan is exactly right. look, the normal playbook here would be he would turn it down and then they would have to vote contempt and the entire house would have to vote contempt and they would go to court. there's no possible -- you know, it doesn't fit with the time line. we already know from trump from that remarkable sort of 14-page scree that he responded to the subpoena with, that he'll use every excuse or put any kind of impossible conditions even as he professes to say oh, i would love to testify. you will never see his right hand raised in front of the committee and it would be a disaster for him. if it were a year ago, maybe the committee would play out this high-stakes court battle, but i don't see their having time or stomach for it, and i don't

harry lipman, former u.s. attorney, deputy attorney general as well as the host of the talking feds podcast, i start with you, this news, that cipollone and philbin may go farther than they did with what we saw as a public in the january 6th select committee's questioning of them. >> yeah. farther really all the way to the absolute sort of holly grail. cipollone and philbin repeatedly told trump what he was planning was unlawful. what did he say when you told him that and the response to date has been, i can't talk because of executive privilege. but that executive privilege claim is dubious, and the holding that judge howell made about the vice president's staff indicates it. it might be different for the president, but the argument from the department of justice is, first, biden has waived and that would normally suffice but there is one kavanaugh opinion that suggests maybe that's not enough, but two, and this is basically what south carolina court said about meadows in georgia, they need the evidence and t

and harry lipman, and u.s. former deputy attorney, mike schmidt, joins us. mike, take us through the reporting first. >> i mean, you laid out the reporting. the question is that what does the justice department do now? so, the justice department believes there are more documents out there. and do they want to take the aggressive move, similar to what they did in august, and execute another search warrant. and deal with everything that comes with that. and how are they going to approach that? you know, are they going to go to that level and have another, you know, raid, as trump describes them, and rile things back up all over again. as we point out in the story, there's another option for the justice department. at least two other options. one is, they could try subpoenaing the documents again, but we know that subpoenas in this investigation have not worked that effectively. the attestation coming in response to the subpoena that was misleading to the justice department earlier. or what they could do, possibly, what we laid out earlier in the story, is they