that, is the haystack. and then from there they've got this monumental task still of finding the remains of the wreckage of that plane, that needle inside that haystack. that haystack, by the way, some 5 kilometers deep perhaps. >> and andrew, it is now, what, 10 past 1 in the afternoon in perth on tuesday afternoon. we're assuming this search weather permitting will get under way maybe wednesday, maybe thursday. i'm curious, if that satellite information is that having impact on the such area? >> it doesn't narrow it, john, as far as we understand. the was in that the malaysian minister -- prime minister released does tally with the information used for this operation. if you look at the original fields area of interest, if you like and where the two latest objects are discovered, they are slightly to the south of that area. so that is where they're concentrating on at the moment. it hasn't added specifically to pinpointing where the debris might be but certainly what it has done, john, is reinforce the fa

and the problem is the first two phases it was the wrong haystack and looking for the needle. the final phase right haystack, right tool, right team and we found the plane within almost about a week. so it all happened very quickly then. but you know, we thought that was the toughest of all searches, but this one is certainly turning out to be one incredible mystery. >> certainly is. david gallo, thanks very much. still ahead, more the breaking news and the stunning possibility being raised that the missing plane may have landed. and a very emotional interview with the wife of a passenger on that missing airliner. the heartbreaking gifts he left behind. >> the most amazing husband and the most amazing father. so our business can be on at&t's network for $175 a month? yup. all 5 of you for $175. our clients need a lot of attention. there's unlimited talk and text. we're working deals all day. you get 10 gigabytes of data to share. what about expansion potential? add a line, anytime, for $15 a month. low dues, great terms. let's close! new at&t mobile share value plans our best

locate that haystack. and the progress that's been made, a lot of people slamming inmarsat or the malaysians for not getting it quicker. if they're going through this process of trying to work through the doppler shift and correlating mapping with other aircraft, if they're actually doing that, that's good news for us. we have to give them time. if you're the malaysian prime minister and want to say something decisive, it's going to take time. >> and andrea has a good question for jim. could there have been an amount of dangerous material onboard? investigators are still looking what happened onboard. is there a possible explanation for how the plane ended up the way it did? jim tillman? we're having problems with jim. we'll get back to him and the rest of our panel. >> coming up, it's a huge search area. on top and under the water. that's coming up next. benefiber is clear, taste-free and dissolves completely. and unlike other fibers, you'll only know you're taking fiber by the way good digestive health m

to figure out where the haystack is. but they don't even definitively have plane debris. so can you even use the tpl without plane debris? >> no, you can't. we have to really pin down where we want to deploy the tpl before we even put it in the water. this system is designed to be flown to a location, like we have right now. we've flown it to perth. it's waiting there with all the systems that it needs to be utilized, which would be the cable and the crane that would put on the ship, and allow you to tow it behind any ship of opportunity. and i understand they already have a ship designated that they would place it on. and then that ship needs to go from perth out to the search area, which will take a little bit of time to get out to where we want it to. so we need to still find the debris and then backtrack that debris to where we think the aircraft has entered the water before we ever put this tpl in the water, because as you said, you tow this twice at very slow speeds, about one to five knots. and you also have to to

. >> we're not searching for a needle in a haystack, we're still trying to define where the haystack is, so that's just to put it in context. >> reporter: now, a needle in a haystack. they don't know where the haystack is. what they mean by that, they won't know where that haystack is until they can make a positive i.d. on the piece of wreckage. then they can work back there and find what will be still quite a big body of water where that plane may have gone down, where most of the wreckage is lying. but there is a lot of work still before they get to that point, and the weather, deb, certainly not helping one little bit. we're 100 miles away. i hope you can get a sense of just how windy it is here. we've got a sort of awning here. we've got people actually holding it down, and that's 1,500 miles away. the weather system down there is considerably worse. >> and are they quickly suggesting that the orange item might be some sort of life preserver or life vest or something like that? is that the suggestion? >> reporter: that is the suggestion. but be careful, this is not an official su

searching for this, a needle in a haystack, first you have to find the haystack.ut the depth and challenges all these teams will have trying to find that haystack. >> it's a huge area we're talking about, even though on the map it may look small. we're talking 1500 square miles, average of 13 to 15 or more,000 feet. you're talking about an enormous amount of volume you have to look through. weather patterns are part of the problem. if you can't get close to it, you can't send anything down into that water column. >> what they might send down, russian mir. what is that. >> a manned submersible, capable of going down to 13,000 feet operational depth, which, of course, limits the range in that area. if it's anywhere deeper than that, you have to send something else. it is a manned submersible, you do have eyes in the water column as opposed to rov or arv. >> toad pinger locater coming from the u.s., supposed to arrive in australia tomorrow. what's that supposed to do? >> think of a torpedo towed behind a boat. it's trying to listen and hear for the pinger of the blac

we're not trying to find a needle in the haystack, we're trying to find the haystack. we're trying to find the arm that the haystack is on right now. >> they are in reserved for when the field gets narrowed down? >> that's right. the gear will land in perth, australia, in about an hour and a half. there's ten people going with it. technicians and experts that know how to use it, mount it on an australian ship when ready. it will stay in perth until we have a better search area. it's important to note, it's going to take a few days to get from perth to the search area, probably four to five days. with the weather the way it's been, it could take longer than that. >> you've got a lot of countries generously providing support there, countries that don't necessarily work together. they've not had to work a lot together in the past. there's been frustrations with some of the cooperation up to this point, sharing of the radar data, that kind of thing. from your perspective, did that hamper the search for this plane early on? >> not from a u.s. military perspective. i've talk

andrew, you heard from the air marshal a short time ago basically saying that they don't have a haystack, they're still looking for that to search in. >> reporter: yeah, john. it was quite a sobering judgment from someone who definitely knows. before i get on to that, interesting listening to saima talking about the families who are looking for some facts, for something they can hold on to, the truth about the flight and why the malaysian prime minister made this call that the plane did go down in -- somewhere in the southern indian ocean yesterday. that question was pretty much put to the australian defense minister today, just how confident are you that the plane did, indeed, come down here and he said i'm confident based on the information we have available. so there is still very much a slither, a tiny, tiny percentage of doubt. there has to be because it's still based on technical data, on information until they get a positive i.d., a firm sighting on a piece of debris that links it to the flight they can't be 100% sure, obviously. so it is a question which is being asked not only i

right now, we don't even know where the haystack is at this point. given what you know in your days of flying in this area of the world that we're talking about. the southern indian ocean, you've flown that area, and is that something that makes all of the sense to you? >> tony, it really does, and i haven't heard all of the details about the sea state in that region in the recently. and that's enormous. they have taken the surface vessels out of that area as well because of the storm conditions that exist in exactly that search area, so it makes it so much more difficult. and i would say so much less likely that they're going to findinfind significant debris. >> you know what's interesting to me, we did hear from the defense minister, talking about how difficult that area is, and now there's a weather system that has effectively ended the search for today. tell me why you think it's going to be difficult to find debris that can positively be identified as belonging to a flight, this particular malaysia airline flight? >> well, it almost looks like a

i heard people say that it's like a needle in the haystack, but how do you find the haystack. >> that'sortant. the way you do it is start with the evidence, the last known position derived from radar or transponder. i thought we had a good last known position. importantly not. >> ultimately you want to find the x on the sea service where the plane hit the water. the trick is to find whatever bits of the plane floating on the water to backtrack and find the x. that gives you the center of the haystack. in this case it's a huge search area. you have no evidence at all. there was not a threat of evidence to say that the plane landed anywhere on the ocean. it has to be in the room or command center, a lot of emotions boiling over, wondering if they did the right thing. the pressures on the outside are building. families, friends and loved ones, what a horrible situation. those emotions are not something we deal with. having been that that situation, when it builds, it has a real impact on you. >> whether or not they did the right thing, what you are talking about is whether or not they chos

the haystack is. that is to put it in context. >> a vast span of ferocious ocean scattered in the hide sees, the approaching -- high seas, the approaching ships delayed. announcement was made without any physical evidence and there is a sense of things in limbo. for the families of those on board, who need to see wreckage you for they can remove their glimmer of hope, and for the investigators trying to pinpoint a flight recorder to solve the core of this mystery, what caused this flight to crash deep in the southern indian ocean? >> we are still trying to find the haystack. illusion authorities have defended the dated they used to conclude the airplane crashed. there are many questions. here is anymore to explain what we do know and what we don't know. >> it has been more than two vanishedce flight 370 into thin air. what we know for certain is that 41 airplane left on march 8, minutes past midnight. wereystems in the cockpit switched off. the boeing triple seven turned back across mainland. the plan

we knew where the haystack was and it took two years to find the black boxes. and unfortunately, the families need to gear themselves for that long haul and set their expectations there. because this is a huge area. what i would be wanting to do in this situation is really try and get some cooperation of the search area, don. we're putting all our eggs in this expectation hope basket of hopefully the search area will give us something. but i would like to go back to the indonesians. i still find it -- i still find it odd the thai radar and the malaysian radar had something on the trace, yet indonesia didn't. >> i want to stick with the vessel we'll get out there, and we'll get the other things, including the radar. i want to get to colleen now. what does it tell you that several days of work, as you look at this new ship that is going out, no new research, no new search there is a new search area. nothing has turned up right now. they're using this ocean shield to get there with the pinger. and we have those live exclusive pictures of that. and we've got will r

. >> we're not searching for a needle in a haystack. we're trying to find the haystack. >> another kind of storm taking over beijing this morning. the malaysian embassy overrun. >> they are holding signs saying they want their sons and daughters back. >> frustrated and furious over the country's handling of the accident. >> they said no one is survive. no evidence. >> calls for the airline ceo to step down. >> families this morning demand proof, evidence of the crash. special edition of "newsroom" starts now. >>> good morning. i'm carol costello. thank you for joining me this morning. grief and an her boil over in china's capital. >> family members march on malaysia's embassy in beijing, the intended designation of doomed flight 370. they're demanding answers on the search. challenging malaysian's announcement the plane crashed killing all on board, outraged relatives ask how can all hope be lost when not a single piece of debris has been found? >> if something found, we'll go to australia. if nothing found we'll stay here and go to mal

bits of the needle in the haystack. and in this case, the haystack is huge because we just don't have the clues. >> reporter: the u.s. has two navy ships, a plane and helicopter helping with the search effort. crews are using sophisticated surface radar and the chinese military has redirected ten of its satellites. >> time is not on our side. so anything we can do to expand this search will be the better if there's any survivors. >> reporter: families of the passengers are pressing authorities to speed up efforts to find the plane. craig boswell for cbs news, washington. >> and if the black boxes are recovered it could be years before investigators know what happened. stay with us for continuing coverage on this story. we'll have the latest online at kpix.com and and update at 5:00. >>> we're following some breaking news out of san leandro right now. chopper 5 is on its way to the scene of a major crash northbound 880 at davis. no word of any injuries at this time. but there are multiple vehicles involved. the right thr

this search has been described as looking for a needle in a haystack. but officials say they haven't even found the haystack as of yet. what's next? >> reporter: that's right. they said they haven't even found that haystack, that quote coming from a senior defense official at a briefing this morning out of the pierce air force base, which is the hub of this operation. he also said everything is speculation until they do actually find something, which is identified as a piece of debris from flight 370. just to underline the difficulty, today it was suspended, no aircraft flew today, that was because of appalling weather conditions out in the search area. gale force winds, 20 foot swells, heavy rain, very, very poor visibility. the authorities here, the maritime authorities are coordinating the search, decided it was too dangerous to send any ships out there. they hope tomorrow they can send 12 aircraft into the search zone. that will be a number we haven't seen before and will include japanese, chinese ships. they'll be armed with -- the planes rather, a

we're trial trying to define where the haystack is. >> don't even yet know where the haystack is, and making matters harder, the choppy seas could stir up any debris from the plane or cause floethe pieces to stop floating. we have live coverage. lea is here and let's start with janice dean and the weather complicating the search. >> we had a cyclone, equivalent to a category 4 hurricane last night. now down to what we call a tropical storm, but bringing very cloudy and rainy conditions along the west coast of australia and that could hinder search crews, as well as a frontal package move -- we're going to see another system move in on thursday. the good news is, as we head do into the weekend, we have high pressure building in, which is almost unheard of for this time of year, across the southern indian ocean, and several days for search crews to get in there. so, right now we're dealing with water temperatures in the 40s, air temperatures in the 40s, but the rough weather will continue. a quick period of clearing and then, shep, another system moves in. but by the weekend we'll have

and we haven't even found the haystack yet.strating for the families. 153 of the 239 on board chinese nationals. clearly they are very upset, as you can understand. passengers marching there. chinese relatives of the passengers marching on the malaysian embassy, chanting liars. chinese government is demanding that malaysia tell exactly how it reached the conclusion that plane crashed. and to add frustration, they can't search for maybe another two days. stay with abc news and abcnews.com. our next live updates on "america this morning" and good morning america." >>> the death toll in washington state's landslide disaster is now at least at 14 and the number of missing has ballooned to 176. using hovercraft and helicopters, rescuers have been searching the area for any signs of life. adding to the tension, the rain-soaked hills surrounding the area may pose a new risk to search teams. >> there is still some movement on the landslide and so that is something that we are trying to get a better handle on. like i said, there are sev

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before they could find a needle, they need to find the haystack. and before they can find the haystack they have to find the farm. are they searching in the right place? let's get the latest from admiral kirby. those were your comments the other day. you suggested that it's not just looking for a needle in the haystack, you've got to find a farm first. >> yes. >> here's the question, admiral. the investigators, have they found the farm at least? >> we don't know. certainly we hope so, wolf. that's everybody's hope, that they've gotten closer. as you have pointed out, the area is to the north and roughly the size of new mexico and it's in air france when we used navy gimt to find that black box, that search area was about 40 square miles. this is about 123,000 square miles. it's still a large volume of space on the water surface that we're looking for. >> so basically, correct me if i'm wrong, this is the best estimate now where, if there is wreckage, the wreckage exists someplace in this huge area but it's just an estimate, not a certainty. >> that

. >> it's interesting because we don't even know where the haystack is. it could be here, it could be here, it could be here. >> reporter: this is what spare time looks like for jenny peterson these days. >> makes it seem like a game, almost. and being a former gamer, it's almost like you're on a quest. >> reporter: she is on a quest to find that missing malaysian airliner without ever leaving her home in the washington dc area. >> people have also found whales. i found a whale. so, it's actually pretty-- i don't want to sait's fun, but it is kind of fun to get new pictures everyday and to uncover things. because you don't know what will be there. and so you just want to keep going and uncover the whole picture. >> reporter: she is one of more than three million people who have volunteered their time to pore over satellite imagery of the search areas to see if there is anything unusual, any sign of the missing boeing 777. >> you want to be able to do something, but you can't because you're not in the line of work, you're across the world, you have family

in the haystack. and what it's going to take to find this haystack is eyes-on, visual identification of a piece of debris from that plane. once they've got that, they can start working back using these very sophisticated drift models to establish in a rough area where that plane actually may have hit the water, and then they've got the task of finding it ain, perhaps, three miles of ocean. so, frustrating at the moment. expecting planes to be taking off early tomorrow to resume the search. the koreans are joining, bringing two flights down, two planes down tomorrow. they join another five nations. it's ramping up. the australian naval vessel is epected to be back on station tomorrow. three chinese naval vessels are also expected to be there tomorrow. there is an icebreaker from china also making its way there. it's all continuing to build, but at this moment, the only return we're getting is frustration on more frustration. >> there's no question, it's one step forward, two steps back, and obviously,

find the haystack. we're trying to find the farm the haystack's on right now. >> that search is erased with the pingers only good for about another 13 days and the weather changing daily. there is a window of time, an opportunity for getting the job done, a window of time that is closing. there are limits as well of human endurance and patience. relatives and friend of the 150 chinese nationals aboard flight 370 went to the malaysian embassy last night in beijing demanding answers. this is incredibly rather to have a public demonstration like this on the streets of beijing. david mckenzie is there on the streets there tonight. kyung lah is in perth. kyung, what kind of aircraft are up in the air right now and how are conditions in the search area? >> reporter: we can actually hear the turbo props of a p 3 orion right behind me. it is going to take off shortly. the australian military says that representing a number of other countries all zooming to this area right now. it's a variety of planes, some mil

we're still looking for the haystack. >> reporter: and the haystack keeps moving due to strong ocean currents. >> this is also what you'd call the world's largest current. >> reporter: oceanographer charita pattiaratchi built this computer model tracing the possible debris sightings from these satellite photos back where they might have drifted from. a huge distance. the current moving 30 to 60 miles per day. >> you've heard of the gulf stream? this is ten-times the size of the gulf stream, the antarctic current, because it's much wider and deeper. >> reporter: the ocean can be a superhighway. one year after the japanese tsunami, debris traveled more than 3,000 miles. this harley davidson washed up on a beach in canada. now, it's in the harley davidson museum. these plastic chinese bath toys washed overboard in the pacific during a storm in 1992. they have since drifted 17,000 miles to places as far flung as alaska, england and maine. the power of these ocean currents is one reason the search crews are racing to recover and identify some debris. the sooner do, the simpler it will be

we're not searching for a needle in a haystack, we're still trying to define where the haystack is. that's how australia's defense minister describes the search for flight 370 in the remote indian ocean. want to bring you cnn's saima mohsin from kuala lumpur and will riply in perth where planes are getting ready to take off, we hope. saima, first to you. what can you tell us about this so-called international working group, a group that the malaysian government is now forming to help narrow the search area? what's involved here? >> reporter: well, wolf, that still remains a mystery. that's all they've told us so far. as you know, we get very little information in these press conferences, which is amounting to a lot of frustration for a lot of people, including us trying to report this story. and, of course, more importantly, the families that are involved in this. now, what we know is that this working group will be heavily reliant on the data that particularly countries like the united states and the united kingdom can offer. we know that they relied on the united kingdom's inmarsa

in the haystack. in this case, the haystack is huge because we just don't have the clues. >> there are dozens of planes and ships from several countries searching for the malaysia airlines flight but so far the only discoveries have turned out to be false alarms. the frustration is boiling over with some families who had relatives aboard the flight. amateur video shows bottles being thrown at malaysia airlines executives during a meeting in beijing. others shouted insults. people cried, angrily demanding answers. officials say the water west of malaysia is shallow making it easier theoretically to recover not only the plane but the black boxes. those black boxes could hold the answer as to what really happened. was it mechanical? was it terrorism? was it suicide? pilot error? nobody knows. they don't know where the plane is. reporting from the newsroom, i'm ken bastida, kpix 5. >>> pictures are raising questions about the copilot on the missing flight and his past behavior. an australian woman says sh

motor vehicle, and almost everybody owns a motor vehicle, it's almost like finding a needle in a haystack. t my sinus. it's time for advil cold and sinus. [ male announcer ] truth is that won't relieve all your symptoms. new alka seltzer plus-d relieves more symptoms than any other behind the counter liquid gel. oh what a relief it is. >>> hundreds of people turned out for rafael garcia's funeral. he was remembered as an athlete who put his studies before sports. >> when it came to rafael, his education came first, even before football. i remember there was one time where he didn't go to practice because he had a late assignment. >> he was a good person, and there's a lot of people here, a lot, and we're just going to miss him. >> we want to know that the person who did this is facing the consequences for that and not able to just get away with, you know, taking a life. >> the autopsy revealed that rafael suffered a fractured skull and other blunt force trauma to the head. this suggested that he was facing the oncoming traffic when he was hit. the medical examiner also found large, bar-sh

finding flight 370 is already like looking for a needle in a haystack, and today the haystack out a lot bigger. >> new information is not necessarily conclusive, but it may be in the indian ocean. >> a u.s. naval destroyer is heading far west of the current search area. u.s. investigators reportedly relayed a satellite think the plane may have stayed in the air 45 hours after its last confirmed contact, but malaysian officials deny this information. >> those are inaccurate. was att transmission 0157, which indicated everything was normal. >> it is a beard on its way to beijing. so far every lead is a dead-end, including chinese satellite images. >> we found nothing. 27,000search area covers not a cult square miles, a distance greater than chicago to atlanta. for the families of the 23 nine on board, this is an increasingly desperate way. upset. i amt, very really hoping they will find this lane. >> this has been a public relations nightmare for the malaysian government. now agencies are getting involved and hope for more accurate information and progress in the search for the issing fli

but it's the proverbial needle in a haystack. they are searching 23,000 kilometers and this piece of wreckage may have drifted hundreds of miles in the last few days. it's difficult to say if they will be able to find it in the next couple days. it could carry on for weeks. >> reporter: we've appreciate the update. roger maynard, grn reporter. bill: fire up and we'll share some of your thoughts over the next few hours. in the meantime there is breaking news from moscow. vladimir putin made it official, signing a law completing the annexation of crimea. russian troops building up along the ukrainian border raising questions about putin's intentions. >> reporter: moscow confirming what for all intents and purposes is the ground reality in crimea. russia have much in control, backed up by something like 20,000 troops that moved into crimea. a couple weeks ago this area was ukraine. no word on the bases of the ukraine military being overrun. there are 10,000 or more ukrainian troops on that peninsula. they are telling me an evacuatio

now we seem to have found the haystack. if this holds up, we'll have a lot of tough searching and we have to find the black boxes. the pingers are the key. >> they could give off symbols, the black boxes. >> this is day 13, as erica said, and they are supposed to be guaranteed for 30 days. we have maybe 17 days, sometimes they last longer, but you have to be fairly close to them in general. they guarantee two mile radius, the manufacturer, but that means you have to have a lot much p3s out there. it's a big area of the open. i'd like to see a lot of new equipment, and the p8, the poseiden, a 737, faster than the p3s, but the p3s are the aircraft that are available in large numbers. we have 150 of them, the australians have about 12, if i remember, and the japanese have 100. we may see an ahmada of p3s converging. >> i want to tap into your knowledge working with the navy, what can we expect in the next several hours here as far as the search? >> clearly they'll be out there - there's three p3s, and a c130 initially on the s

and i heard people say that it's like a needle in the haystack, but how do you find the haystack? >> yeah, that's important. and normally the way you would do it is start with the evidence, which is typically the last known position derived from radar or transponder, and i thought that we had a last good known position, but apparently not. because you want to find the x on the sea surface where the plane hit the water, and then the trick is to find the bits of plane you find floating on the water, and that gives you the center of that haystack. in this case, it's a huge search area because you have no evidence, and in fact, there's no shred of evidence to say that the plane landed anywhere on the ocean. but in that room, in that command center, there have to be an awfuan awful lot of emotionsg over, wondering if they did the right thing, and the passengers' families, what a horrible situation. those are not emotion that's we deal with in science, but when those start to build, it has a real impact on you. >> so when you say, whether or not they did the right thing, what you're tal

just not a needle in the haystack.t's a needle in thousands of fields of haystacks. >> reporter: lisa stark, al jazeera america washington. >> for the latest information on that missing malaysian airlines plane, and the rest of the day's headlines follow us on twitter, @a jam. toyota being told to settle games with the federal government. cooling a four-year criminal investigation whether toyota misled the public. what did they find. >> reporter: even though the criminal investigation began four years ago what federal investigators found is that toyota really knew about the problems seven years ago back in 2007. they knew that some of their models had a problem with sticky accelerators, sticky gas pedals that could cause sudden acceleration. they did not inform the public when the investigation began by authorities. they misled them and really nothing was done until 2009 when people died. today the u.s. attorney general holder said the conduct was shameful. >> put simply, toyota's conduct was shameful. it showed a blat

we hear this analogy of finding the needle in the haystack. we have not found the haystack yet. and these robots will be key. once we find the haystack, which is this potential debris field. >> pinpoint the coordinates. >> get a good idea of where the debris is, all these robots can then go in and start looking for the debris on the surface. remember, if we go back to air france 447, we knew where it crashed, the transponder was on, the acars was on, but the black box wasn't found for two years. remember, we have the gps on the black boxes that last for about 30 days. the way these were found was by robots. >> how many square miles last time, very small? >> far smaller than 600,000 square miles. they found the debris field, and it led them to the black boxes. that will be key once we find the haystack, but we have to find it. that's what we're trying to do. >> great report. really appreciate it. >> more breaking news. we heard from chuck hagel who said once again the u.s. still cannot rule out that terrorism is in fact responsibility for some of the disappearance. we welcome in

so essentially, until you find that haystack, we've been using the need until the haystack term, this is the needle finder, but they have to find the haystack first, and we're not close to doing that. >> even though it's been delayed, tell us where you. as i understand, this is from the hms sterling. it's the largest naval base in southwest australia. it is the fremantle sound that you're in? >> correct, correct. so we are just -- this is garden island behind me. and fremantle behind me as well. as you mentioned, a very large naval base. we're actually just outside what they call the exclusion zone here in the sound. the reason that we can't get much closer than that is this is a military operation. and so if you're photographing, you know, the operations here too close, it could potentially be a security risk. so the australian navy, we actually had the water police, the western australia water police come by and visit us as well. very nice. the country has been very nice us to. but they asked us to move back just a bit. but you can still get a good shot of the ocean shield. and it r

we're still searching for the haystack. so trying in many ways to dampen expectations that they are about to find something. but for many of the families, i think they won't accept that their loved ones are lost irrespective of the technical evidence from satellites. they won't accept it until something is fished out of the waters here. and just to emphasize how difficult the task is of searching, today the search was suspended because of bad weather. there is a lot of assets now sitting here in perth, more than ten aircraft. there are ships out there at sea, a small fleet of them. but they weren't able to get into the search area today because of monster waves, wind, terrible weather, cloud. and the authorities here just decided it was too dangerous to try and send out planes in these conditions. an australian military supply ship that had been looking to try and find the debris that was identified yesterday or objects which were seen yesterday by an australian aircraft was forced to leave the area and won't return until t

. >> we are not searching for a needle in a haystack, we are trying to define where the haystack is. >> with australian authorities sticking to a safe, it gives families hope for confirmation. they are sticking to a holding pattern, and the heavy is not helping, there's gale force winds, heavy rain, and tuesday was a wash in terms of the australian maritime authority. the hope is that teams can go out and resume their search. >> difficult for the family, because you are talking about speculation. you can't forget the black box. it's vital, critical in the investigation. >> we know it has a timetable. it's day 18 and the audio pings are good for up to 30 days, there's a clock ticking. the u.s. fleet is sending a high tech black box locator. aviation experts say they have to find a piece of debris to locate a serial number to track the frequency of the black box. >> you mentioned weather conditions. i want to talk about the current conditions of the south indian o. it's vital. >> it's gown be one of the most interesting water current systems. you have a current and countercurrent worki

although the haystack, if you like is smaller, it's a needle in a smaller haystack that is being looked for. on friday five aircraft will depart on location from australia searching the area 2,500km away. there's a commercial ship on site. that is looking at the water close up, and an australian naval vessel is on its way. that will arrive on saturday, if it can find the objects or a plane can direct it to where they are, and if it has anything to do with flight mh370. it's that boat that will bring them on shore. >> 17 people that took part in a demonstration in cairo have been sentence. they'll spent 14 years behind bars. the group, supports of deposed president mohamed morsi were demonstrating in the university in may and demanded on investigation into a mass food poisoning at the campus. it is 83 days since three al jazeera journalists had been held in a cairo prison. correspondent peter greste, mohamed fadel fahmy, and mohammed badr are accused of having links with a terrorist organization and spreading false news. the next court appearance is on 24 march. abdullah al-shami, from t

. >> it's not even a needle in a haystack. it's a needle in thousands of fields of haystacks. >> reporter: abc's bob woodruff tracked down some malaysian fishermen who claim they saw the plane the night it disappeared in almost the exact spot the plane was thought to have made a left turn off course. >> they said they were here when they suddenly saw a jet barreling by them flying low and bigger than any plane they had ever seen in the sky. >> reporter: thailand's military announced their radar picked up an unidentified plane on the night of the disappearance, in a strait west of malaysia, which roughly fits the current search area. earlier today at the kuala lumpur airport the flight took off from, people came to a viewing gallery to write messages showing their support and hope for the 239 people on board. the u.s. navy's high-tech p-8 poseidon has landed here in perth, australia, and with its 1200-mile nautical range, it's able to reach and search the southern portions of the indian ocean. nikki battiste, abc news, perth, a

what we're looking at was a haystack about a third of the globe. so to some extent you are looking to find the haystack before he could even start the search for the needle and now we're at the point where we know where the haystack is you were starting to pull the hair part and honestly it is a tremendous advance in the search. you know it as was mentioned earlier we we now have a longer battery life in inboxes. this gives us another two weeks or so depending on the conditions of the equipment to conduct a search and there's been fairly good statistical work done on on where you find the wreckage relevant to the last known point. and it's a fairly narrow area and that will really need the search going for him once the weather improves and some physical conditions improve to make us rich impossible i want are moving on from the eyes but the politics of it all just remind you is last year china's president visited malaysia was hailed as a new beginning for bilateral ties. van gogh in january chinese patrol ships showing up in the james troll but the

, not just looking for a haystack, he says, we haven't even found the harm yet where a haystack mightxist. is that your sense, that you're looking but you really don't have any great clues? >> yes, i would agree with that. and the way i think of it is, let's say you think you have a piece of debris. even if it's a big chunk. well, we're 17 days out from the beginning of this. so even if that chunk only moves half a knot an hour, so .05 nautical miles per hour, that's 150, 200 miles. so -- and these pingers don't have a huge range. these black boxes. it's only a couple thousand meters. so if you don't have a good starting position, it will be extremely difficult to find the thing. >> has that toad pinger locator arrived in perth? >> the last communication i had was that it was in the air en route. it either should have landed a couple of hours ago or it's landing as we speak. once it lands, we have to move it to a location where it can be loaded on to an australian vessel so it's not something that we can put on our p-8 or something and fly out there three hours. it does take a little

the satellite says -- listen, this has been a needle in the haystack.e kind of had the haystack since saturday. someplace off southwest australia. now a satellite says, i see a needle, maybe you should go look at it, take the pictures from the aircraft, help identify whether or not that is something you want to go look at, then send a naval vessel there. as i say, with the prime minister of australia telling the parliament, i think they're serious, they think they've got something here that is certainly worthy of some serious looking at. >> yeah, particularly when you're talking about an item that could be 78 feet long or so. so it is fair to say, then, that this development feels different than anything we've had up to this point? >> it absolutely has. we've had all these missteps with the malaysians, the misinformation, the slow information, the contradictory information. when this moved down to australia, we're talking about the u.s. and australia working this southern part of the search area, we're working with the pros now who are out there doing t

. >> we know we're only looking in one haystack rather than multiple haystacks. >> reporter: this former navy oceanographer's firm developed search maps that helped locate air france flight 447 in the atlantic ocean. he took us through the sophisticated mode dells that used. first, a grid that showed where the air france plane likely it this surface. two calculations for that, how far the plane could have flown between the last position update it gave and when the transponder failed and where the debris would have fallen if the plane had a catastrophic failure at cruisi cruising altitude. >> so you get a heat map and this meet map says where it's red that's likely where the plane is. where it's green it's a medium chance. >> reporter: but managing the search zones has huge obstacles. why can aircrafts spot so many promising leads and surface vessels can't find them? bobby skoelly was on the neighbor vi dive team that recovered wreckage of twa flight 800. >> the item could have sunk, it could have been blown completely off on a different course or pushed some place else and the ship will

we must keep remembering we have not found the haystack yet. what these things are brilliant at, once it's found by the search area, debris on the surface, they find the needle. it's hard. we know from air france 447 the haystack found straightaway through transponder and acars, needle in terms of black boxes it took two years to find those. there are serious constraints with technology. this ping in the area, down to 20,000 feet and potentially depths of 23,000 feet. so there's discrepancies there. these things will be key. these are whether or not found debris field 447. >> many more hurdles to get through here. we have to wrap it up there. as always, thanks for your expertise. >>> atf coming under political fire after storming a california gun parts store. now at least two california lawmakers are demanding answers after atf raided the store even after the store received a court ordered injunction to stop it. atf not only seized so-called illegal parts they were looking for but also reportedly took the store's confidential client list. congr

it's not even a needle in a haystack. it's a needle in thousands of fields of haystacks. >> reporter: as we reported, they're both a north search area and a south search area. they believe much more likely the plane went to the south and possibly ended up in the ocean. malaysian officials have been able to refine that area a little bit more based on the data from the ntsb, which looked at fuel reserves on the plane and how fast it would be used up. so they have narrowed the search a little bit off the coast of australia a little closer to perth. del, still expected to take weeks to search that one area, and they're looking at a lot of areas. >> lisa stark in washington, d.c. you can see the frustrations are growing. a reminder for the latest details on that missing malaysian airlines flight, the events coming of ukraine and the rest of the headlines you can follow us on twitter. >>> toyota will pay the largest criminal penalty of a car company in american history. toy yet is set to pay $1 billion to settle claims with the

we're not looking for a needle in a haystack, we're looking for the haystack, we're still trying to find the haystack, and working on sorts of triangulations and assumptions, and as new information comes out about the speed and the altitude of the airplane we're finding this area where the airplane may be. and they say they have new credible information. they're not making us privy to that at this stage. but they certainly hurled a lot of resources out there. all of them are tasked to race out to the area, and as mentioned earlier more time over the search area will also add more capability to find this airplane. >> right, what do you make, jeffry of the fact that they're so confident about this. they have completely abandoned this previous search area. those green dots there on the screen. and put everything into this new spot. what does it say about this data that they have gotten about the plane's speed and the assumptions that you mentioned? >> well, originally they're working on very rudimentary data. originally we have an airplane that turned the transponder off that became invisib

needle in a haystack. this is -- this is a huge task, and, you know, basically the search zone has been identified by a means that never intended to be used that way. it was very clever. we just don't know how accurate it might be. so couple that with mother nature and the fall is upon us and the sea state is a difficult thing. you know, we're starting to stack up the odds here. aren't we? >> yeah. we certainly are. les, the type of debris they find obviously depends on the impact. >> true. i mean, the higher speed the impact, the more fragments there will be. slower speed, as in air france, the more bigger pieces you're going to find. >> yeah. it's so interesting that, you know, for three weeks we've been talking about the unknown. there are just so many different possibilities here. different possibilities. there's a lot of manpower going into this. a lot of money as well. most people are not concerned about the money. obviously the families aren't concerned about it. this is more than money. what if the