moving along, the emails that miss herrick identified are presumptively public records. and so mr. st. croix has to identify any particular exemption that you may now be attempting to rely on. there is nothing in the charter as miss herrick admits that exempts those emails. they are emails. they are not part of the investigative file. second, the non-internal emails, which miss herrick wrongly claims are confidential under section f1.110b are not, in fact, covered by that section. although she underlined the operative description of the confidential documents, the word "communications" or any word that would describe an email is missing. under the constitutional requirements for public access, these statutes must be read narrowly. thus, the description of what is confidential can't be expanded to cover communications; which are a completely animal in the investigative file, which was the subject of my complaint. those should also be disclosable, unless otherwise exempt and once an investigation is closed i maintain it becomes a public record and the entire file needs to be released

but to recap procedurally what happened, the miss herrick reviewed and determined that the redacted portion was privileged. that was covered by state law and/or local ordinances that protect the disclosure of this information, including c3.699-13a. her proposal i believe is to produce the information as redacted. >> not having that section at my fingertips, or in mind, and i don't -- but it's hard for me to make a judgment on this without knowing what that privilege -- knowing more about the nature of that privilege that would require that certain information be redacted. >> i am going back to her memo as well. this is the longer one. >> thanks. >> following up on commissioner studley's question, is the privileged standard that we're looking at the one we're talking about all notes, preliminary reports? controller's benchmark studies, audits, investigations and other reports shall be confidential? >> that is -- >> that is the first part of it. >> first part. >> and the second quarter part of the standards is records of any investigation shall be considered confidential information to the ex

to release the documents as redacted by miss herrick. >> second. >> all in favor? >> aye. >> opposed? hearing none, that motion passes and the record should be produced as redacted. as a result of having produced -- agreed to produces the record as redacted, i think we should address the issue of whether the failure to release these documents was a willful violation of the sunshine ordinance. i think i have given my view that in light of the effort we made to review all of these documents, the discussion we had and arguments we heard with respect to this file and these records, that i certainly don't see willfulness here myself. i will open it up to my fellow commissioners to share whatever views that they have on the matter and we'll take public comment and go from there. >> i agree, i don't find a willful violation given the amount of time we had to spend in analyzing the issue ourselves. it was borderline, i think. >> i would be interested in hearing public comment first. >> public comment on this item. >> commissioner hur, i know you just want me to go away qui

>> i think the motion would be to release the document as redacted by miss herrick. before we do that, this was calendared as a single agenda item. i do take mr. menat shaw's point that they are separately enumerated within item no. 4. but i do think we can take them together. is that right, mr. givner? >> yes. >> okay. although it is sort of difficult to not take them in order. let's make the motion on whether or not to release the three pages as redacted by miss herrick. is there such a motion? >> so moved. to release the documents as redacted by miss herrick. >> second. >> all in favor? >> aye. >> opposed? hearing none, that motion passes and the record should be produced as redacted. as a result of having produced -- agreed to produces the record as redacted, i think we should address the issue of whether the failure to release these documents was a willful violation of the sunshine ordinance. i think i have given my view that in light of the effort we made to review all of these documents, the discussion we had and arguments we heard with respect to this file an

during that hearing, we asked miss herrick to review a number of determination if they should be disclosed. she subsequently conducted the review and identified set of emails that she believes should be produced in redacted form. so this item agenda is then to discuss whether those emails should be produced as redacted, and if so, whether that has resulted in a willful violation of the sunshine ordinance by the executive director? any comments from the commissioners on this matter? >> do i not get a five-minute rebuttal on this? through the discretion of the chair? >> mr. met shah i will give you a little bit of extra time during public comment, but i would like to hear from the commissioners. >> thank you. >> as i recall, this relates tangentially to the subject matter of the two complaints, which i recused myself for reasons stated. the issue being raised in this particular instance does not appear to involve the same or doesn't go to the merits of the two underlying complaints. but i would propose that i not participate in the disposition of this question. >> i have no objection to that

because miss herrick conducted this investigation for us, because i didn't find the information that was not redacted to be privileged, i think in this instance, production is appropriate. but i certainly do not fault the commission for not producing a document in this form, which the public can evaluate it once they see it, but i think they will find it to be not particularly useful as a publicly disclosed document. thank you, mr. st. croix. >> is there a motion with respect to whether we should find the failure to release these three documents in redacted form to be a willful violation of the sunshine ordinance? >> i move that we find that the failure to release these documents was not a willful failure -- a willful violation of the sunshine ordinance. >> is there a second? >> second. >> all in favor? >> aye. >> opposed? motion passed. i also want to say in response it to a number of the members of the public that i understand the frustration with not being able to see what we get to see, what the controller's office sees, and what the commissioner itself sees. these investigations