howard thurmond and dr.lfred fisk, who believed that if people came together and had deep religious experiences, that they would emerge -- there would emerge a sense of unity among them that would undercut b barriers among which people live. racial barriers and gender b barriers. going on for 74 years. going on 75. >> that's wonderful. so you're talking about different religious backgrounds and races people and creeds. >> many people are former whatever but we have jewish folks in the congregation. buddhists in the congregation. communists in the congregation. people who had religious background. but they have found this -- and dr. thurmond attracted many of them. in fact, inherited said is this what this church is about? well, i want poob to be a part of it. so it was a powerful book. probably his most we well-recognized book and was very influential. and dr. howard and dr. king. many other people. >> meeting with gandhi had tremendous influence. >> he met with gandhi in 1936. he was part of a pilgrimage wi