isn't that implie imimplies im-- implies it's in the laws of counsel? you can hire lawyers any time you want. >> whistle blowers don't know. i can tell you from my experience. >> commissioner kopp: i have every respect for you, but i wouldn't add that. and then to contact the media. to crack the media. doesn't every employee know that? >> no. >> commissioner kopp: sorry. i can't join you on this -- these suggestions. >> but in response to your query, many whistle blowers come to the ethics commissioner and they feel, wow this is the place to get this resolve. they believe this is the place to get it fixed and it isn't. so the staff -- i don't think this should be written down but the staff when they consult and advice whistle blowers and they say, listen you have an option to get your own attorney. and the other option is to contact the media. for justice. >> commissioner kopp: yeah, but they don't come to the ethics commission, do they is this sin that one of the problem, that they go to the controllers office. on page 3 of the report that, last paragr