center for strategic and international studies, says the first term of the bush administration in and national security council as senior director for asian affairs. we are talking about the north korean peninsula and the tensions. i just want to ask you, since we have you at the table, depend an opinion piece for "the wall street journal" with the headline -- why we are always fooled by north korea. what is your point in the peace? guest: the main point my colleague and i were making, willl toby, for a good 10 years of intelligence agencies and the u.s. have said with some accuracy this is the escalation ladder they are moving toward. they are moving toward nuclear weapons capability, the missiles to deliver, and not much that we have done have not them off of that and we engaged in negotiations in good faith. i have been with many of them, to halt -- coax them away from nuclear weapons. they will sign agreements. they agreed to a dozen different frameworks and violated everyone. the point we are making is this crisis we should go into eyes wide open. there is not a deal to be had with this regime right now. we need to work at containing of putting pressure on them to create conditio