we made a lot of progress on the political process, we transitioned a we've set up a an embassy, an iraqi government. the politics were kind of working, but the violence was not getting any better. there was a debate as well a monk officials in baghdad, i witnessed as a young person, that was 32 years old at the time, about the debate that doug talked about. and the idea that politics would drive security gains, and those of us working the politics, were saying that no based on security, there is no politics. security problem is a security problem. in any event, meghan became a senior director at the nsc, asked me to join her staff, i joined the white house in 2005. and i think it's safe to say, in our office we all spent a lot of time in iraq, that and we believe that there was this disconnect between security and politics. but they're always always is a hope, that there's going to be a constitutional referendum, that this will turn the corner, so there was enough to not really force a fundamental reassessment. i was also as a young guy as a director at the time, and i was always wonderi