israeli relations will be. the palestinians are in a very similar situation with the division within palestinian society and unless as as you mentioned they have a truly representative leadership they will not be able to come to a an agreement with the israelis or achieve their own national liberation and certainly this is a feeling that is apparent not only among palestinians but throughout the arab world now particularly since the successful revolution in tunisia so people throughout the arab world including in the occupied palestinian territories are thinking about who represents them and if the people who represent them currently are acting in the best interests of the people professor troy if i go back to you i mean did don't you think israel is kind of in an awkward position where even egypt's got great ally the united states the president of united states is saying transition needs to be done now and then you look at the israeli meet israeli media saying you know do you know stop being so hard on mubarak

it is not the israelis. it is the religious element. israelis were used to it for so many years. it declined. now it came again. uc four very negative changes in the perceptions of the israelis concerning the conflict. therefore, what is the solution? the majority school will say security comes before everything else, and so israel should look at their military dimension more than any other dimension. israel should strengthen its military position. israel should put more layers on the war, between us and the arab world, more barbwire. go back to the iron law protection. or using a modern term, israel is a mansion in the jungle. you have to be more ready to die. that is the majority, if you write all the think tanks in israel. many of the journalists to talk to individuals, this is what you hear. the prime minister asked cabinet ministers -- ministers not to talk too much about the issues. but this is what you read. the other school of thought says the opposite. it says when the revolution started in tahrir square, it was a domestic egyptian problem. and so are the problems in oth

what do you feel about israeli children? >> it is the israelis during the blockade. they want rights for the children, but they do not want palestinian children to have rights. >> if you had israeli children here and palestinian children here, do you think you could talk to them? and then maybe one day, one of them will grow up and become a government minister and lift the blockade. maybe one of them will feel sorry for us. >> is there any other way of achieving freedom, other than fighting for it? then there are people who pressure us. they want to take what we have by force, so we must try as hard as we can to get back our land by blood. >> no room for wishful thinking or sentimentality here. >> my auntie, uncle, and cousin were murdered. they lay there for five hours in the street. michael was not dead. he lay bleeding, he was shouting for help. my other auto is a doctor. he went down to help and was hit by a robber -- hit by a rocket. >> it is difficult to know how to respond because i cannot imagine what he has seen. there is deep resentment and anger. but i sen

israeli academics who are in their personal lives today, most israeli are doing well, the economy isbooming, the israel of tel-aviv is driven by this high-tech industry, you know, people are well educated. they are doing well in their personal lives, but when you ask them about the long term future and viability of the state, they, you know, they sometimes give you shocking answers about, well, i don't know or whether my grandchildren can live here because of the demographic problem, you know, i'm astonished today. today in israel among israeli citizens, 25% of all first graders come from orthodox or natural orthodox family, and many of them, of course, are living in jerusalem, but yet another 25% of all israeli citizen first graders, we're not taking about the west bank or gaza, 25% of israelis, are christian, muslim palestinians. the next generation we see is heading towards a demographic cliff that is very dangerous politically, so now is the time for a two-state solution and i think benny is right that even people like this see this theoretically and barack recently made a statem

conflict and then israeli prime minister menachem begin stonewalled and nothing happened and essentially nothing has happened until now well despite the failed all slow process ok if i go to you in washington i mean do you see you a rocky road ahead for these two countries because a lot of people have called their relationship of the last three decades as a cold peace. the true peace treaty is not popular among egyptians but is joel's pointed out or maybe if i can imply what he was saying i mean it doesn't necessarily mean they could heat up i mean it could be still genuinely dissatisfied with it and maybe maybe at some point in time there could be some kind of renegotiation of it i mean it also will do depend on if the u.s. will still be giving this hopefully new government in egypt aid. you know first let me just say one thing about the statement you read from prime minister netanyahu it's rather ironic i think at this point that this particular israeli government is calling on other governments to maintain previous agreements despite. the international community calling on them for se

it is an entirely rational policy of the israeli government to want to have to move as few jewish israelis as possible. the magic of 4% is 80% of the jewish israelis who find themselves on the eastern or outside of the 1967 line will find themselves with and recognized borders of israel. there needs to be the most explicit security arrangements between the u.s. and israel to make them comfortable with what would be in about to occur. there are anti-missile defenses being tested as we speak. there needs to be an international force, whether it be in nato or what ever the compilation will be with a significant american role. that needs to be coupled with prime minister netanyahu's demand that there be an israeli command. that needs to be married together by able diplomats so the israelis had enough presence but not so much that president? abbas feels his -- not so much --t president abbas else's going a bit further, the jewish neighborhood of jerusalem will need to be under israeli sovereignty. and a special arrangement made for the holy sites in the holy part of this city. we can go further

it is an entirely rational policy of the israeli government to want to have to move as few jewish israelis as possible. the magic of 4% is 80% of the jewish israelis who find themselves on the eastern or outside of the 1967 line will find themselves with and recognized borders of israel. there needs to be the most explicit security arrangements between the u.s. and israel to make them comfortable with what would be in about to occur. there are anti-missile defenses being tested as we speak. ere needs to be an international force, whether it be in nato or what ever the compilation will be with a significant american role. that needs to be coupled with prime minister netanyahu's demand that there be an israeli command. that needs to be married together by able diplomats so the israelis had enough presence but not so much that president? abbas feels his -- not so much --t president abbas else's going a bit further, the jewish neighborhood of jerusalem will need to be under israeli sovereignty. and a special arrangement made for the holy sites in the holy rt of this city. we can go further in

well look the israelis have legitimate cause for concern anytime there's instability with an ally or with a neighboring country i should say they've had reasonably good relations with and a cold peace there is cause to be concerned when there's a change in governments or a change in regime so so i don't discount the israelis concern having said that though the israelis long term strategic interests are best served by democratizing egypt mubarak is eighty two years old he has cancer he's not going to live forever his regime is due to end in any case very soon so the question is how do we make a transition and how do we do it in a way that's peaceful and results in a more representative and democratic government i want to step back and just analyze briefly how we got here we got here in large part because we live in a world of the internet google twitter facebook instantaneous communication repressive autocratic regimes can't sustain their oppression autocracy when you have the whole world watching them with a close magnifying glass so to speak the organizers of the egyptian revolution

that's, until this day, we identify the arab-israeli conflict as the israeli people wanting to be free versus the palestine problem. at best, it's a problem to be solved, but not real people to care about and identify with. i think if you ask people to think of israel, they can think of people. think of palestinians, they can't think of people or people like us. >> host: they have not been sufficiently marketed in this country. >> guest: no. part is a palestinian problem and an arab problem, but at this point it doesn't matter whose fault it is. we have a job to do. we are too invested in that region, too many lives at stake in that reason, too much at stake, and we extended too much political capital. we have to now, if the arabs are not going to sell, we have to go over and do the learning ourselves. >> host: taking a break in a minute, so i won't get too deep into u.s. policy. we'll get into that soon. tell me briefly how you became who you are. you're a professional arab. you're a christian. you were born in this country. why this? how did this become your mission? life? >> you kno

in doing so, saddam hussein, a shield for the israelis and the israeli security, or permanently compromisedfrom the moment the u.s.-led invasion of iraq began. moreover, this is not a fixable situation. because a potentially -- the cause a potential iraq regime ambivalent towards israel exists only in the minds of pro-israel u.s. citizens, these are the men and women who at the day's end our israel's most lethal enemies. the cost of the unqualified u.s. support for israel long has been measured only in dollars and political capital. and as such has been largely ignored by americans and ignored to washington's wasteful. but we are now in a situation where the cost of support for israel is or soon will be measured in the lives of american parents children. that cost i think will quickly become obvious, abhorrent, and utterly unacceptable to those parents. fourth, finally, and i think most importantly, the u.s. government and its european allies must stop trying to spread democracy abroad by military, financial, humanitarian or political intervention. no young american man or woman should die

>> there will be a rough road ahead for the israelis. a new government, any new government, will not be such a staunch, unconditional friend of israel. we will hear more different than it did tons from within a new at egyptian -- more differentiated tones from within a new egyptian government. >> after 30 years in power, president hosni mubarak is under intense pressure to step down. protests are under way throughout egypt, demanding change. it is the eighth day of protests against the regime, and the biggest so far. we will be right back after a short break. >> welcome back. suppose the egyptian president does resign or leave the country? suppose the government collapses? ku will -- who will take political power? many believe it will be the muslim brotherhood. the group has been keeping a relatively low profile since the protests began. our next report looks at what role, if any, the muslim brotherhood could play in a new egypt. >> the new face of the opposition movement. among the demonstrators who have come out to support him are memb

you know expressing some hostility towards israel but at the same time israelis are are are watching closely and they realize that israel's not really the driving force behind this so that helps i mean anything that can help lower israel's fear or or sense of insecurity will ultimately translate into a more cooperative attitude on israel's part but there's not very much israel can do i think at all to influence you know the regime change in egypt not at all in fact i would be probably the worst thing israel could do ok well thank you very much for your comments dalia shamblin international political consultant david tel aviv. well we're giving you updates on what's happening in egypt as well as analysis in-depth analysis what's behind the uprising at what lies ahead for egypt these are explored in the latest edition of crosstalk that's coming up on our program next hour. the future of the mubarak regime is not so much being decided on the streets of egypt but mainly. they are certainly hald talks going on behind the scenes between egypt and indeed the americans and what is staggering

attack on iran if such an attack was going to happen and we have heard in the israeli press a lot of concerns about whether or not israel can indeed if it plans to carry out such an attack carry out such an attack without issuances from egypt that it will not get involved at the same time the army in egypt has promised that it would end here to all international agreements so between from the israeli leadership that at least for the immediate future it's not concerned but it certainly is concerned more long term that they could be some time to be rainy and state some kind of islamic republic much now much closer on those borders than is iraq paula thanks very much indeed for about lloyd from tel aviv our correspondent there paula samir well middle east expert says the u.s. is prepared to support any force in the region be it a dictator or a democratic movement in order to safeguard its own agenda. the united states have been developing a global policy throughout the last decades global policy in which it came into support most of the authoritative governments that you can see actuall

before the israeli doctors that treat these arab children the decision is simple i am doing what i think is right to do and doing rethink youth. in the last fifteen years more than two and a half thousand children have been brought here on third and treated half of them come from gaza the rest come from iraq indonesia and across africa the main goal of this organization is to help developing countries create the medical ability to treat children with heart problems by themselves in order to achieve that we bring children from these developing countries to israel we also bring doctors from these developing countries for training here in israel and it's a vision that's paying off not only is saeed eternally grateful to the israeli doctors the. saved her daughter's life she's now brave enough to tell her neighbors back home to home what on i will tell everyone we were in israel and how they saved my daughter's life i'm no longer afraid to say because my daughter is alive and so while the politicians continue to have a go at each other and israel and the arab neighbors go further apart on th

from many neighboring countries even those israelis had tense relations with. as this report . every our way is touch and go for fourteen month old dollar whose little heart was born with a hole in it for the operation in this hospital my son would have died and in the next ward fourteen year old one yell who was almost did when she was wheeled in one of five iraqi children flown from baghdad to a month and then driven across the border to jerusalem she was almost she was so sick that you could not walk very talk she was very blue these parents face the most difficult decision of their lives bring their children to israel a country at war with this and risk punishment and even death back home or prepare for the alternative possibly losing their child initially it was a very difficult for them because it was their enemy country the parents were very anxious they didn't know what to expect i was very scared to come to israel very frightened. and she had good reason to be her country iraq forbids its citizens from traveling to israel just fire them there is there

minister benjamin netanyahu, israelis had many reasons to want him to. under his regime, egypt's peace treaty with israel has held for three decades. he's been a positive force for peace with the palestinians. mubarak's egypt joined the israelis in undercutting the palestinian fundamentalists of hamas by blockading the gaza strip and it allows the israelis to concentrate their militaries in the north against hezbollah in lebanon and the syrians next door. for now, the egyptian military rulers say they'll honor the camp david accords but egypt's influential muslim brotherhood never supported them and a leading secular poll station, ayman nour... and protests against government in neighboring jordan which also has a peace treaty with israel plus new elections called for in the west bank and you can see why the many people believe the less said the better. >> shut up. the best thing we can do we should have to for the next several weeks. >> reporter: today another rocket landed in israel and it was a reminder that whatever may be dawn in egypt there are som

now israelis and palestinians have been long time enemies but from other sore desperate to save their sick children the conflict takes a back seat and israeli clinic is saving thousands of lives of youngsters from many neighboring countries even those israel has had ten translations with artist paul slayer reports. every our way is touch and go for fourteen months don't know whose little heart was born with a hole in it without the operation in this hospital my son would have died and in the next ward fourteen year old one young who was almost did when she was wheeled in one of five iraqi children flown from baghdad to a month and then driven across the border to jerusalem she was almost dead she was so sick that you could not walk very talk she was very blue these parents face the most difficult decision of their lives bring their children to israel a country at war with these and risk punishment and even death back home or prepare for the altar. senator of possibly losing their child initially it was very difficult for them because i was there in america and the parents were very an

but the scenario of a military council headed by generals of israels is from the israeli point of view given the range of outcome probably the best case scenario. >> the egyptians like this treaty. >> that's opened the door to be the second best military in the middle east. >> if you look at specific issue which is very important to the israelis which is the border between egypt and gaza strip where hamas is in power. egyptian military has been to a greater lesser extent enforcing the power there. that is probably something that regardless of how the political reforms take place in egypt, they will still be able to play and to play it to the satisfaction of the israelis. >> does this movement that we've now seen tunisia now egypt continue to spread and if so where might it go? >> there were reports that in yemen mass crowds had gathered in the capital moving to te egyptian embassy kind of waving the egyptian flag in celebration. the president sala yemen will not go quietly into the night. there were crowds of police and army coming towards the protestors and then the cell phone went de

they also mention that this at present the israeli palestinian settlement do you think that new forces may emerge in the middle east and that i haven't a be able to dominate the region. it is hard to say what is going to happen at the moment so we've seen the statements made by the prime minister of the palestinian authority saying he is ready to form a coalition government with a mass but that is also repercussions and recent events at the same time it helped relieve pressure in the region when the egyptian military which is currently the defacto government announced they would observe all the agreements previously signed including the nine hundred seventy nine treaty with israel. so it's hard to judge the situation right now and i can't give a direct onset i think it will become clearer after time has passed and in any case i think it might force the israeli leadership to give up their policy of maintaining the status quo in the middle east. so far the israeli leadership has been leaning towards preserving the status quo and abandoning the idea of a peaceful settlement and despite nu

leadership to give up their policy of maintaining the status quo in the middle east so far the israeli leadership has been leaning towards preserving status quo and abandoning the idea of a peaceful settlement despite numerous un security council resolutions and president obama's cairo speech israel kept building new settlements in the west bank and east jerusalem sabotaging all attempts at negotiation i think recent events may cause them to reconsider their policy because global trends and not in favor of israel's anik sation policy would in fact they cannot really an x. the west bank or no if they were to annex the west bank israel will cease to be a nation state it will become a state of two nations and they realize that that's why they want the status quo they want to preserve the current state of affairs. when this series of uprising started some comparing them to the color revolutions even though these two things are very different what lesson can we learn from these uprisings in the arab world or lesson we should learn that things a never completely calm they like to see always

for more than four decades, israeli settlement activity in territories occupied in 1967 has undermined israel's security and corroded hopes for peace and stability in the region. >> american ambassadors did it -- susan rice there. barbour, this is standard american diplomatic posture, i guess, to shield israel, but it is really not going to go down well on the arab street, is it? >> no, the timing very bad. americans fought tooth and nail to try to get palestinians to drop the resolution. they offered alternatives to try to avoid this position that they found themselves in a way they felt obliged to veto the resolution here as you say, because traditionally, they protect israel from criticism in the security council, but also, it is a domestic issue. congress has a very strong pro- israel lobby. " republicans and democrats. what some of the assessment here was that the americans ultimately chose to enter the arab street rather than to anger congress, but it is a very tricky thing to do because the americans are already -- their status has already been shaken in the region with these pr

>> there will be a rough road ahead for the israelis. a new government, any new government, will not be such a staunch, unconditional friend of israel. we will hear more different than it did tons from within a new at egyptian -- more differentiated tones from within a new egyptian government. >> after 30 years in power, president hosni mubarak is under intense pressure to step down. protests are under way throughout egypt, demanding change. it is the eighth day of protests against the regime, and the biggest so far. we will be right back after a short break. >> welcome back. suppose the egyptian president does resign or leave the country? suppose the government collapses? ku will -- who will take political power? many believe it will be the muslim brotherhood. the group has been keeping a relatively low profile since the protests began. our next report looks at what role, if any, the muslim brotherhood could play in a new egypt. >> the new face of the opposition movement. among the demonstrators who have come out to support him are memb

and with the israelis' tactics and would very much like to impose upon the israelis some final settlement with the palestinians even if it's one that's more on the palestinians' terms. >> wait a second -- >> after all, europe, europe needs oil. >> uh-huh. >> and guess where a lot of the oil that -- [inaudible] europe has an incentive to tilt toward the arabs, at least on the surface. >> you're a peasant incentive to wish to see a settlement to the arab/israeli conflict. they certainly have no, no reason whatsoever to want to see hamas in power. and this employee till la was directed toward hamas, not the pa. >> [inaudible] >> that point is important to note. i don't think they know the difference, but -- yeah. >> i'm not huge advocate of turkey, but from what i understand turkey have security military forces, yeah? and we have a government which can -- and if i'm not mistaken, there's always can be a coup, military coup -- >> no. >> which can stop -- >> no, i don't think there's going to be a military coup. that's a question people have been asking for a long time, but i think the age is