jamal khashoggi's murder, really in the history of the "post," stands out.ft-spoken man. his voice became very important because he was the single most important dissident writing about the saudi regime. >> jamal, let me start with you. you've compared your crown prince to putin, to iran's supreme leader. you've said he's creating, "an interesting form of dictatorship." how so? >> i still see him as a reformer but he is gathering all power within his hand. as we speak today, there are saudi intellectuals and journalists jailed. >> his murder was so cold blooded. and we, we still don't have the whole story. jamal went to the consulate in istanbul and then he disappeared. >> senior turkish officials have reported that he is in fact in the building and he is still here. his close friends and family are still trying to figure out what this situation is. they're waiting on an official statement. i spoke to his fiancée who was also here o told us that they came here to issue a number of documents so they could marry. >> they dispatched an assassination team that l

offensive to people who knew and loved jamal khashoggi and people who respected his work. >> yeah.vid ignatius speaks about him -- >> exactly. >> -- are just so moving. the thing is, mika, that pompeo was not only secretary of state. >> he was head of -- >> he was cia director. he knew what the intel community found. >> mm-hmm. >> he knew what the intel community concluded out of this. that's why this is so -- not only is it sick, it's dishonest. he knows that what he's writing is not the truth. >> a lot of questions, katty kay, given the fact he is preparing reportedly a run for the presidency himself. you have to wonder who his audience -- who is he appealing to here? >> yeah. there is something in the members of the former trump administration defending russia, defending vladimir putin, for example, over intelligence. mike pompeo now defending saudi arabia over intelligence. i understand the united states has strategic ties with saudi arabia and joe biden visited saudi arabia amid quite a bit of criticism recently over oil production. i understand there are sensitivities there.

it is shocking and disappointing to see mike pompeo's book misrepresent the life of columnist jamal khashoggi. it is shaflful he would spread falsehoods to dishonor a man's life and service. you knew jamal very well. a secretary state when the decision was made by the trump administration not to reveal the conclusion. the de facto leader of saudi arabia was responsible for ordering the murder and burrturing of jamal khashoggi. he was the former cia director. >> the publisher in the statement that you just. and sold mike pompeo stays in the book, i read it this morning to get ready for our conversation, the following. i just would ask viewers to pay attention. mike pompeo writes, this butchery was outrageous, unacceptable, horrific, sad, despicable, and unlawful. so pompeo himself makes the case that the terrible crime was committed here. he says that there's no direct evidence linking saudi arabia to them. not fund thely different from what the cia said. they gave the order for the operation, which is pretty much the same thing. i can't help but think that pompeo wants to pick a fight with th

the very next day, october 2nd 2018, jamal khashoggi walked into the saudi consulate in turkey. he was never seen again. over the next few weeks it was determined that he was murdered and dismembered by agents of the saudi government. as fred, and the public for the washington post pointed, out the cia later concluded that the saudi crown prince muhammad bin salman ordered this assassination. it's mike pompeo is not just some sharp tongue is a light houston will into politics. he is a very smart man who was forced in his class at west point and graduated from harvard law school, where he ran the harvard law review. he was a four term congressman. the fourth being appointed to lead the cia and eventually the state department. criticizing the media as a time honored traditional politicians, and that is fine. but villainizing journalists and justifying the state sanction murder of a journalist, but it severely polar driver. -- former president donald trump. he made an continues to make countless integrating and attacking comments about journalists and publications. he called immedi

you want, federal judge dismissing the lawsuit filed by the fiancÉe of the murdered journalist jamal khashoggi for "the washington post" in the saudi embassy in a simple in turkiye, him throwing out sovereign immunity? >> to date, carolyn maloney and senator elizabeth warren both announced their going to be investigating payments to jared kushner and to steven mnuchin for confit of interest for reasons that are specified. and they're very hopeful about those investigations will now be expanded to payments to the trump organization. clearly, for many, need papers president trump -- many favors president trump greater to mohamed bin salman's extraordinary protection for mohamed bin salman and his role as the murder of jamal khashoggi and result in direct payback for president trump and his son-in-law and treasury secretary -- we don't know. in terms of lawsuits against mohamed bin salman, which was recently dismissed because the biden administration's recognition of sovereign immunity for crown prince mohamed bin salman, i think it ju reflects the favors, protection, all kinds of grants of favor

i mean, what does that say that pompeo has more harsh words for jamal khashoggi, a murder journalisttweeting out a picture with somebody at the agency he used to head saying was responsible for that killing? >> it is incredible. i mean, simply the audacity to talk like that about the man that literally died seeking the truth, and that is what is so outrageous that pompeo cannot see that, and that, once again, is one of the huge dangers of trumpism, we are seeking the truth, it is synonymous with the enemy. anyone that seeks the truth or that speaks truth, anyone that holds people accountable like he did are called activists, and they are called the enemy, the winch hunt, and so it is completely outrageous. we know that if he was -- not challenging oppression and power, he would be alive. he did his job, he is that, it is outrageous. >> meta, in their statement about trump said that they are going to put some guardrails in place for his accountant the event that he puts of qanon related material, but he has been regularly posting and sharing qanon mean is on his truth social account.

bookstores now he appears unable to bury the hat chet with a man buried, down playing the murder of jamal khashoggidia made him out to be a bob woodward martyred bravely criticizing the saudi royal family through his opinion articles in the "washington post." he was an activist who supported the losing team in a recent fight for the throne. major, do you think pompeo can capture the republican vote by attacking khashoggi or should he go after someone else beloved like jennifer coolidge? >> secretary pompeo is doing what republicans who fancy themselves as a potential successor to former president trump feel may must do, which is find ways to be outrageous and strident and trumpian that even trump hasn't tried. >> as we all know, mike pompeo's book is a cultural phenomenon on the scale of the harry potter series generated record breaking crowds, let's call a bookstore now to see how they're handling pompeo fever. [ phone ringing ] >> barnes & noble -- >> it's crazy there. thank you for taking the time to take the call. obviously, you know what book i'm looking for, mike pompeo, please just can you t

the issues that came up about jamal khashoggi, about president macron, the system was not used on thoseeu member state? >> we have terminated a contract with eu member states, but to get into, again, the exact numbers... >> that's fine, thank you-- next question. if a country does not give you a permission to audit, is that a reason for you to terminate a contract? yes or no? >> as statedefore, if they do not allow us to do the audit and do not participate and provide us with information needed in our investigation, yes, that is a reason to terminate a contrac i can state that we've terminated eight customers over the past several years. >> have the united arab emirates and saudi arabia ever gone through your due diligence check and have they passed it? (person coughs) >> as i said, i'm not going to respond to questions regarding specific potential customers. >> given that uae and saudi arabia have been using pegasus software, who are legitimate actors to issue warrants in these countries according to your checks? >> again, i repeat it again, i'm not going to respond to questions regard

we were very clear the murder of jamal khashoggi was heinous. we sanctioned 13 saudis for what they did there. we also knew that the life of mr. khashoggi or nor of any individual is more important than saving lots of american lives that includes our soldiers, sailors airmen and marines hard decision to make. someone was murdered. no, no one is going to say that's okay. we didn't say that was okay. we were never naive about the reality of the world. it is, indeed, a nasty, brutal place. it was far -- this is a man who praised usama bin laden when he passed away. it's just -- we can spend a lot of time going into the details. most of them are public. but, suffice it to say, this wasn't somebody working for the wichita eagles covering soccer games. this was -- he was a multifaceted person. but none of that, none of that is intended to diminish the fact that he was murdered just simply to say that this is a complicated problem set in a complicated part of the world and america's function in that is that we weren't responsible for killing him. our re

had their cameras smashed and burned, that this idea it is a very close link from that to this jamal khashoggi, isa troublemaker. i mean you know how you feel about the media, maybe there's people in saudi who feel that way too. like that is the subject of this whole. >> saying yeah and we are only an opinion journalist, as of the trump administration had so much respect for other kinds of journalists. they have been hostile to press freedom across the board. so for pompeo to say that he is somehow equivalent to mike pompeo because his press secretary wrote him an op-ed every now and, that is just ridiculous. >> what do you think this says about what this primary will look like on foreign policy? >> in the republican party? >> i think what this primary will look like for the republican foreign policy is mccarthyism on china, with a very thinly veiled attacks on chinese and other asian americans as of this column of the kind that we have not probably seen since the 1950s. >> it is a great point because one of the other parts of the book, is pompeo bragging that he was criticizing china and dona

you saw it in many ways in the saudi plot to assassinate jamal khashoggi. similar thing. journalist in the united states but also an activist and dissenter and of course tragically killed in turkey. >> and important to raise his name when we're talking about something like this for sure. thank you for coming on. >>> coming up next, an exclusive on supreme court leak investigation. what we're now learning about undisclosed ties between the justices and the person brought in to review the probe. we'll be right back. dic uses our one-of-a-kind,, incredibly adaptive tempur® material... to relieve p pressure points and support your body, in a way no other mattress s can. molecucule by molecule, and millimeter by millimeter. all night. every night. now is the perfect time to experience the mattress ranked #1 in customer satisfaction by j.d. power, four years in a row. learn more at tempurpedic.com. ♪ my relationship with my credit cards wasn't good. i got into debt in college and, no matter how much i paid, it followed me everywhere. between the high interest, the fees... i fel

saudi desperate to move on critics say from the murder of "washington post" commentator jamal khashoggitar, saudi arabia ran commercials for its surging red sea tourism industry. now there are rumors it may self-bid to host the world cup in 2030. and it isn't only soccer and golf, here in the swiss alps we're thousands of miles from the saudi arabian desert, or are we? saudi arabia's presence at the influential world economic form rum in davos is unmissable. this week the kingdom bought three separate sites, then it can afford it, while the world worries about recession, oil producer saudi aramco saw profits rides by 90% during last year. we are invited to meet the minister of economy, one of many who have flown in. >> we have nine members including seven ministers. >> seven ministers. >> yes. that's impactful. >> that's a substantial part of the saudi government. >> yes. >> reporter: he insists saudi arabia is in the process of changing completely with women now working, its many young people allowed to go to live music concerts. >> this amounts to you want to change the image of saudi

i mean notably do mention jamal notably they do mention jamal khashoggi killed the khashoggi who was saudi government and the consulate in istanbul . and so, consulate in istanbul. and so, yeah, he was he was murdered there, was recorded and really back to mohammed bin salman to believe if you listen to the guy having his fingers cut off and stuff like that. so and i saw this this, this is really group that made this this spyware . that made this this spyware. yeah they're culpable in the yeah there's never been the excuse of they're trying to use a never used to get round a court appearance before so yeah yeahi court appearance before so yeah yeah i think they should be even though even though the government's there are prosecuting them of probably use this software as well. yeah i think , i messed the khashoggi think, i messed up the khashoggi points made it sound the other points i made it sound the other way around it's other things like was an investigation like there was an investigation islamic were islamic state and they said were using stuff and you know using this stuff and

i mean notably do mention jamal notably they do mention jamal khashoggi killed the khashoggi who was saudi government and the consulate in istanbul . and so, consulate in istanbul. and so, yeah, he was he was murdered there, was recorded and really back to mohammed bin salman to believe if you listen to the guy having his fingers cut off and stuff like that. so and i saw this this, this is really group that made this this spyware . that made this this spyware. yeah they're culpable in the yeah there's never been the excuse of they're trying to use a never used to get round a court appearance before so yeah yeahi court appearance before so yeah yeah i think they should be even though even though the government's there are prosecuting them of probably use this software as well. yeah i think , i messed the khashoggi think, i messed up the khashoggi points made it sound the other points i made it sound the other way around it's other things like was an investigation like there was an investigation islamic were islamic state and they said were using stuff and you know using this stuff and

reveling in the sort of performative jerkitude, minimalizing, rationalizing the brutal murder of jamal khashoggie. that weird triangulation you heard there where he refuses to condemn the actual attack on january 6th, but then at the end, you know, describes the day of glory being the certification of joe biden's election -- election as president, which obviously will not play well down in mar-a-lago. so he is distancing himself from the trump in the sense he said donald trump lost that election, joe biden won that election, it was good that they went along with all of that. so in some ways he is trying to distance himself, but at the same time not distancing himself from the attack. i just don't know how -- how really tenable that position is. and a lot of republicans like including mike pence, you know, want to go halfway, but they refuse to go the whole way and say this was in fact an attack on american democracy, it was incited by donald trump which ought to disqualify donald trump from any office of trust in the united states. you don't get that from mike pence, and you don't get that from

i can tell you, for instance, when jamal khashoggi was murdered allegedly at the behest of saudi leadershipd said, well, you know, you've got to see it the saudis' way. they live in a very dangerous neighborhood. and he intimated that he'd been messaging with the crown prince on whatsapp. so here you have the whole u.s. federal government saying the saudis might be complicit in the murder of a u.s. person, working to develop policy options for the president to hold them accountable, and his son is conducting a parallel track side diplomacy with the crown prince and defending his actions. that was extremely worrisome. i have no doubt it affected the trajectory of u.s. foreign policy in that time period in addition to potentially benefitting people financially after the fact. but because we don't have transparency about what happened then, we don't know whether these financial transactions have any tie to official actions that were taken in that time. >> my last question for you, why is this coming out now? why are kelly's experiences something that you're able to report out now that maybe ea

no one makes light of the fact that jamal khashoggi was murdered i signed the documents to sanction thempariah nation president biden comes in and says this is a price and he ends up going on their knees to beg them for energy. we had a deep security relationship in the kingdom of saudi arabia that matters to the american people and we were unabashed and not apologizing for our country. it doesn't mean you have to forgive, it doesn't mean you have to condone, but make no mistake about "the washington post" who went after me viciously for me after this. "the washington post" didn't say the same thing when they captured americans they didn't run full page ads when 13 americans were killed in afghanistan. this is a complicated world, one needs to be thought about about how they do it if there's trouble today in the middle east, the saudis will be with us, the iranians will be against us and the chinese and russians will be on the side of the iranians you should never forget that you have to do the right thing for our country. >> what does that mean in terms of how we deal with china? >> we'

saudi desperate to move on, krit ticks say from the murder of jamal khashoggi or saudi arabia's connectionof the world cup in neighboring qatar, saudi arabia ran commercials for its surging red sea tourism industry. now there are rumors it may itself be able to host the world cup in 2030. and it isn't only soccer and golf in the swiss alps, thousands of miles away. this week, the kingdom bought three separate sites. then it can afford it. while the world worries about recession, oil producer saudi aramco saw profits rise by 90% last year. we were invited to meet the minister of economy, one of many who were flown in. >> we have nine members, including seven ministers. >> that's a substantial part of the saudi government. >> yes. >> he insists saudi arabia is in the process of changing completely. with women now working, many young people allowed to go to live music concerts. >> you want to change the image of saudi arabia. >> it's not about the image. it's about the work, the results. >> but you want to change how people perceive saudi arabia. >> obviously that's a by-product. we want it t

fred ryan, the publisher of the washington post work khashoggi was a columnist released a statement saying, in part, quote, jamali crown prince, mohammed bin salman. his onlyfans was exposing corruption and oppression among those in power, work that good journalists around the world to do every day. i'm joined by peter barnhart, author of the notebook on substack focus on american foreign policy. we should note that mike pompeo, i think, wanted to pick fights to get attention for his book, and i look forward to him getting one or 2%, if he lasts until new hampshire, which i think is unlikely. this is all coming from that. it's really despicable. >> yeah, and it is, and it really is telling about pompeo because one of the things you have to remember about pompeo as he was one of the biggest anti-muslim begets in congress. into any 13, after the boston marathon bombing, he basically accused muslim leaders across the country of being complicit, lied and said they hadn't had disavowed it. what does that have to do with this? could he say, he says about jacoby, i know enough about the middle east to know that this ki