attorney jay sekulow. as chief counsel at the american center for the law and justice, he is representing tea party organizations. he also hosts a conservative talk radio program. gentlemen, welcome to you both. jay sekulow, let me start with you. let's go back to the application that these groups made for tax-exempt status. what sort of tax treatment exactly were they asking for? >> most of them were asking for, our clients were asking for c-4 status which allows for the money given is not taxable. it's not tax deductible by the donor but it's not a tax event to the organization. so it was a 501c-4 legal status. the application actually is very straightforward. the first series of questions were not terribly imreus i have. it was the second round of questions that were very imreus i have and has caused the problem here. >> why if they were seeking this status, which is tax exempt as we just heard him say, why then are they eligible for tax exemption? >> well, there are a number of organizations that are e

help explain the lawsuit being filed that jay sekulow is leading? tremendous amount of information if the case goes forward. the exposure is tremendous. not an issue of we have wrongs committed against us and we have been damaged. the damage is going to be declare torreatory relieve. a number of the groups haven't received the status yet they have been seeking. it is 25 groups against the irs. the important thing that came out today was he has proof that the targeting did not stop in 2012 like was previously stated. so we are just being right now being able to see kind of the information coming forward, the unraveling of the stories that have been told. what appears to be inconsistent statements made before and contradictery evidence coming forward now. >> every time they say something declarative it turns out not to be true you two days later. what do they need to do to stop that? >> i would stop by reading the letters. i would say this there was and i believe there is collusion among some of the tea party groups and the republican party and they t

with us is kimberly guilfoyle and jay sekulow. the aolbermanngy not accept ised. >> you can say you are sorry all you want. not only was it wrong and inappropriate but unconstitutional and illegal. jay carney trying to argue that the internal revenue service is not part of the executive branch of government is absaturday. the commission irof internal revenue service is appointed by the president and the chief counsel of the internal revenue service is also appointed by the president of the united states with advice and consent. all this i'm sorry it shouldn't have happened it was wrong. remember what they were all saying just a year ago. there is no way this was partisan and even today the irs says we did pick them up based on their name and put through more scrutiny including membership lists and donor data. things they are not entitled to under the law but they say it is not partisan. this is absurd. needs to be an investigation by the oversight committees. but somebody has to be held accountable here, sean. this is outrageous. >

25 groups filing a lawsuit against the irs today and the chief attorney represent hing them is jay sekulow. >> i have been advised by my counsel to assert my constitutional right not to testify or answer questions related to the subject matter of this hearing. >> i don't know what the department of treasury or what irs or what the white house is thinking. we have the documents because is we have been in dialogues with the irs for a year and a half. >> greta: and a former irs commissioner calling the irs failures catastrophic. mike everson ran the irs under president bush. he joins us. nice to see you, sir. >> thanks for having me, greta. >> greta: what we have been talking about all day long is the number of visits that mr. shulman as head of the irs made to the white house, a number of visits. how many visits did you make to the white house when you were commissioner? >> i don't have an exact figure in mind. last year when i testified before the same house committee chaired by mr. issa was that to my recollection i only went over there once to discuss policy matters on an interagency basi

bill: jay sekulow has the lawsuit. what at the moment an can you achieve. >> three things we're looking for, bill. the slaut was filed in federal court in washington district court in d.c. what we're asking is three things. number one an injunction. you just heard, these amization still hasn't been granted. we're three years out. we have 10 of these cases applications need to be granted. they are in a state of basically nonresponse by the irs for many months. we need the applications granted. number two, kevin just mentioned and others there are real damages here. loss of grants. some of these organizations had accounting fees. we came into the case to litigate it. we're not charging them. if they incurred fees going through this process. so you have got that kind of damages. there is also a fundamental violation of constitutional rights here. kevin just mentioned. this whole idea what curriculum you're teaching, how are you teaching it and to whom you are teaching it to violate first amendment free speech and freedom

. >> reporter: attorney jay sekulow confirms to cbs news that irs targeting the tea party groups began in 2011. >> when we saw the letters that the irs had sent to our clients i was outraged. >> reporter: as chief council of the conservative american center for law and justice, sekulow has represented nearly 30 tea party groups investigated by the irs. >> it was from coast to coast. so saying this was, you know, low-level irs employees, these weren't clerks. these were internal revenue service agents trained in tax exempt specialties. >> reporter: the irs insists that then-commissioner douglas shulman was unaware that tea party groups had been singled out when he testified before congress last year. >> there's absolutely no targeting. this is the kind of back exphf-forth that happens when people ally. >> reporter: shulman, who was appointed by president george w. bush. has since retired. lois learner oversees tax-exempt organizations for the irs. yesterday she apologized to tea party groups but said the irs employees involved were not motivate bide political bias. she said they were on

jay sekulow is with us. i'm thinking what if they don't get fox business? >> demand it!have three hours to get it. three hours. start moving. >> i'm eric along with kim kirchen, bob beckel dana perino and greg gutfeld. its the' 5:00 in new york city. this is "the five." we have new developments and all of the big scandals plaguing the obama administration. we will get to the irs and benghazi in a moment. first, attorney general eric holder may have sealed his fate with this one line. >> with regard to the potential prosecution of the press for the disclosure of material that is not something that i have ever been involved in, heard of or would think would be a wise policy. >> you heard it here first, folks. we broke that story

whistling me a former irs commissioner and jay sekulow who represents a number of the tea party groups that were targeted. good evening, gentlemen. >> good evening. >> hi, judge. >> judge jeanine: commissioner, are you aware of this kind of political targeting happening at the irs when you were the commissioner? >> no, not at all. let me just say this. in my experience everybody at the service did their level best to stay clear of politics. in fact, judge, we had an initiative in the '04 and '06 election cycles where we looked at churches and charities that were accused of politicking, those are the charities were c 3s and you may know they can't advocate for or against a specific candidate. we got a lot of complaints and the same tigda took a look at the work we did. russell george who testified yesterday and they he made ducks about being more timely and better guidance. there was none of this. this surprises me. and the work that was done is really atrocious and unbalanced. it is a shame. >> judge jeanine: you would agree he, then, commissioner, that what you are seeing now is somet

if is wasn't for jay sekulow that is what we would have done. >> greta: julie, thank you. >> thank you greta: coming up, what does rnc reince priebus want president obama to do? and move over, are south carolina governor nicki haley and lindsey graham going to be the next "american idol" idol why are twice as many people choosing verizon over any other carrier? many choose us because we have the largest 4glte network. others, because of our reputation for reliability. or maybe it's because we've received jd power and associates' customer service award 4x in a row. in the end, there are countless reasons. but one choi. ♪ ♪ (vo) purina cat chow. 50 years of feeding great relationship that work the way you wish they would. like a front-end loader you can detach from your seat? or a mower deck you just drive over and cut through knee-deep grass no problem? yep. we thought the same thing you did. that's why we build them this way. that's how we run. nothing runs like a deere. visit your dealer or johndeere.com/howwerun to see the new signature series and 1 family tractors. >> greta: is the

let's ask juan williams and jay sekulow.ext week he will be filing lawsuits against the irs on behalf of several tea party organizations alleging what, jordan? welcome, gentlemen. >> thanks, geraldo. >> what are you going to be alleging 12346789. alleg? >> currently 17 of the 27 ready to file lawsuits here likely in washington, d.c. federal suits. the first the clients that have still not gotten an answer from the irs and there is a federal mechanism at law not monetary damages for those. is an issue, too. basically get a declaratory judgment and look at that. >> geraldo: that they are tax exempt, is that it? >> that the irs has either targeted them in the past unfairly for those who may have been already approved but now we know the apollgy the reason why some were waiting two and a half three years for approve trautwig because of the targeted scheme. and then to declare that the irs arenac countied inappropriately. it moats by the court that you have been treated unfairly. targeted. viewpoint discrimination has occurred. t

if is wasn't for jay sekulow that is what we would have done. >> greta: julie, thank you. >> thank you greta: coming up, what does rnc reince priebus want president obama to do? and move over, are south carolina governor nicki haley and lindsey graham going to be the next "american idol" idol judges? why do we ask that. in you will see for yourself, coming up. two one two. rify and lock. command is locked. five seconds. three, two, one. anng by for capture. the most innovative software on the planet... dragon is captured. is connecting today's leading companies to places beyond it. siemens. answers. and didn't know where to start. used a contractor before at angie's list, you'll find reviews on everything from home repair to healthcare written by people just like you. no company can pay to be on angie's list, so you can trust what you're reading. angie's list is like having thousands of close neighbors where i can go ask for personal recommendations. that's the idea. before you have any work done, check angie's list. from roofers to plumbers to dentists and more, angie's list -- review

jay sekulow is representing five groups who filed suit. obviously there is a lot in here. we showed a couple of these letters. but the headline is a couple things. that the abuse was widespread. it wasn't just the cincinnati office. there is a lot of other postmarks on these letters. and it's on going. it's still going on as recently as a few weeks ago. >> correct. this is a letter from washington, d.c., the united states department of the treasury internal revenue service from a tax lawyer. this wasn't a low-level agent. this is a tax lawyer at treasury at the irs in washington, d.c. here is the lawsuit it's a significant one about an inch thick representing 25 individual organizations. some of them tea party groups, some of them just conservative groups that got caught up in this dragnet of the irs. this is emreally broad based and the time line and narrative the white house put forward does not hold to the truth. i don't know what the department of the treasury or irs. i don't know what the white house is thinking. but we have the document. we have been in dialogue with

in addition, attorney jay sekulow whose law firm is representing several of the targeted conservative groups claims to have documentation that points to a much higher authority than low level staffers. >> this is extremely broad based and the whole timeline and the whole narrative that the white house has put forward here does not hold to the truth and i don't know what the department of the treasury, i don't know what irs, i don't know what the white house is thinking but, martha, we've got the documents because we've been in dialogue with the irs for a year and a half. >> reporter: in addition to that, we know that the "propublica", the investigative journalism group published confidential irs filings on six conservative groups. somebody within the irs had to have sent them that. former chair of the council of economic advisors, austan goolsbee admitted in a conference call he divulged confidential irs information how koch industries is organized. he represents koch industries. >> we were concerned at a orchestrated campaign starting at the top of the white house to attack and dispa

here's jay sekulow, an attorney who has received some of these white house letters. >> we have a letter that we received in our office on may 6 of this year from the i.r.s. asking for responses to entrue seive -- intrusive questions. we have a series of questions from last year from lois lerner herself, she is now on administrative leave. we've got letters from lawyers in washington, d.c. and, sean, i'm holding in my hand a lawsuit being filed in u.s. district court tomorrow morning representing 25 conservative groups, not all tea party groups. there are other conservative groups in this list. >>steve: that is what he's doing today. the interesting part was at the beginning of that sound bite from hannity last night, he said the letter went out may 6 of this year. this is not something that was happening in 2010 or 2011. it's still going on. >>gretchen: let me clarify. from washington, not necessarily the white house. that remains up for grabs exactly where that information came from. >>brian: it's more than tea party groups. a virginia-based leadership group, they asked for a 501-c-3.

jay seq. could you low will join us now -- sekulow will join us now. he had clients coming to him tell them they felt they were being targeted by the irs. the irs denied it he knew it was true. he kept pushing for months. now he has been vindicated. we will ask him well weather now in his legal opinion she can be dragged back and forced to testify and answer the questions she chose to stay silent on. wait until you hear what allen different wits says on it. -- dish wits says on it are demanding answers in the widening controversy over the targeting of journalists. house judiciary committee chairman bob good lap wanting to know why justice deliberately avoided telling the associated press. required to do. there is an exception to that requirement but it's very, very narrow. secret as they. james rosen we now know. politics editor and host of power play on foxnews.com. eric holder was, before that committee, last week i think it was. and basically said this is very, very rare. we almost never do it. it's one of the top two or three worst leaks i have eve