jeb bush: thank you. support the presidential initiative for that early childhood development in education? a multilateral [indiscernible] jeb bush: if it is effective. it is outcome-based. if it was simple and did not try to impose western-u.s. imposition on countries that were completely different and it could work. >> jeb bush: i would turn all of our aid programs into those kinds of projects, and also, programs with more free market economics, and promoting governments that are productive. great question. yourself -- sider jeb bush: [indiscernible] i kind of like the traditional .onservative approach back then, we had totally different -- we now have a progressive government. now the progressive government has run amok. [indiscernible] ♪ [the national anthem] [applause] [indiscernible chatter] jeb bush: a lot if you will have converted support because it is lean and healthier. the safety is higher. how is the cheeseburger -- you have cheese inside? you have bacon and that too? it? have my name on the

jeb bush: yeah. and faxed, i would turn all of our aid programs into those kinds of projects, and also, programs with more free market economics, and promoting -- instead of promoting governments that are corrupt. great question. do you consider yourself a mckinley republican or a theater roosevelt republican? jeb bush: [indiscernible] i kind of like the traditional conservative approach. hard to be critical of teddy roosevelt the guy was so all in. back then, we had totally different -- we now have a progressive government. now the progressive government has run amok. if you have the same pass in as passion for reform teddy roosevelt, that would it be bad. ♪ [the national anthem] [applause] [indiscernible chatter] >> how are we doing? jeb bush: a lot of people pork because it is lean and healthier. >> the chinese are buying a lot of pork. jeb bush: the safety is higher. how is the cheeseburger -- you have cheese inside? you have bacon in that too? you have egg? you have my name on it? >> you bet. we

jeb bush and george bush both running at the same time. in a month before that election, jeb was supposed to win and george w. was supposed to lose. and if it hadn't been for the upset, jeb's the guy who goes in 2000. and the climate in 2000 was jeb's climate. instead george w. got it. now he's got to answer for george. with w.'s presidency. that's what i mean about the year he's running in is making a lot of these -- >> i think the year in which he's running, i think you're right, that changes the stakes of the way he fails. i am just surprised to see him -- i think he'd be failing in any year, because i think he's a bad candidate. maybe he was a good candidate when he ran -- last ran for office a dozen years ago in florida. maybe he's just rusty. maybe he'll shake it off. and maybe by the time people stop pay attention to donald trump, he'll be great at it. >> one quick thing i would say, about weaknesses in candidates, i look at george w. bush as a communicator, compare him to jeb, and my estimation of george w. as a communicator has gon

jeb bush: incredible.was like going to heaven. >> there are a lot of things you can eat. >> what you supporting other candidates or just mr. bush? >> i'm trying to be a good toast. jeb bush: all 74 of us. >> it looks like you want to support work today. >> you can't beat the iowa state fair and the great pork we have in this state. there are people from all over. jeb bush: why don't you ask him another layout question? [laughter] >> are you competitive person? jeb bush: very competitive. very. >> raspberry cake at nine years old with a blue-ribbon. pretty happy. jeb bush: fresh wild raspberries? >> yes, but the -- they are not wild. jeb bush: the some of you, right? >> yet. jeb bush: governor, i'm worried about that bubble coming out of [indiscernible] progress being made on the right-hand side there. think?h: what do you >> not quite ready. jeb bush: let me know and i will assist you. >> governor bush, who is better on the grill, you, it your brother? >> i don't know. i do this at my son. usually stake re

to georgia, a jeb bush supported. caller: i support jeb bush. our next president. will restore us from this severe depression we have been suffering for too long. from a great man and he is a good spot all the bushes are known as good people. he won't get my vote certainly and i am tired of people slinging mud at him. i can't wait to see him in office. and he definitely is not a prejudiced man against mexicans. he married a mexican woman. i hope that he can turn around isis. host: and another bush supporter is rebecca in florida. support jeb bush. he has been a tremendous governor for the state of florida. many,s done a lot of -- many things to support the citizens of florida. and i think that he would do a very good job as president. of so far as the border mexico, it is not only the mexicans that are coming across the border. isis and who knows who else is coming across the border from whatever countries. everyone was to sling mud at the mexicans. they need to stop and think about all of the other people that are coming in from other countries. think about all th

trump or jeb bush? i'm not a fan of jeb bush. bush is in favor of common core and weak on immigration. those are two bad things. bush the other day didn't want to fund them. he said i don't want to fund women's health issues. he didn't want to fund. that's worst than romney's 47%. when they give a million dollars or $5 million to jeb bush they have total control over him. he will do like a puppet whatever they say. >> jeb bush is a puppet to his donors. he has lobbyists. i know them. >> joining us now michael steel former chair of the republican party and msnbc political analyst, casey hunt, msnbc political correspondent and the host of changing america on shift by msnbc. kasie hunt, you had your choice of events to go to in new hampshire. let me guess. were you by any chance at the trump event? >> maybe. yes. i was. although i did get a chance to catch john kasich earlier in the day but it was not possible, as you said to be at jeb bush's event and donald trump's at the same time. >> this the turnout for trump's event, is there

sununu: i can't speak for jeb bush.hink it is the wrong thing to do this early in this stage to lash out and start going after your fellow candidates. you saw the debate, chris christie and rand paul going at it. i don't think anyone came out better for that. it is early. this early in the race, you have to remember, you are still introducing yourself, whether you are jeb bush are marco rubio bush, or marco rubio or john , kasich. you need to be introducing yourself to the voters here and across the country. you need to do it every day, every week, for the next couple of months. anytime you are not introducing yourself, you risk losing ground. in the case of john kasich, he is governor of ohio, he balanced the budget, cut taxes, created jobs, privatized prison, reformed entitlements. these are important issues for him to get across to voters, to make sure they understand where he come from, how he solves problems. it's not smart to be lashing out at every candidate. mark: if you were to compare john to any previous sena

we are here in devonport because jeb bush did an event today on foreign policy. re on that in a bit. jeb will be on the soapbox tomorrow. john, major week in iowa. no straw poll, but the fair has drawn most everybody to the state. tell me one thing you are looking forward to. john: i think the fact that there is no straw poll makes the fair even bigger. i'm looking on the republican side forward to seeing scott walker at the fair. he is now, according to cnn, slipped back to third place in iowa after having been in first place all year long. he's taken a beating at the hands of donald trump and ben carson. him coming in and trying to pick up ground, reconnect with iowa, i want to see how he does. mark: i think walker does have a big challenge. he was too low key at the debate. breaking through at the fair is hard to do. the thing i'm looking for is trump. mr. trump is going to the fair. john: do you think he will break through? mark: he's bringing his helicopter in order to break through. there's some question whether people are going to get free rides. trump domi

it puts anyone in the center -- hillary clinton, jeb bush -- in a difficult place. rk: hillary clinton talked about china and trade issues in the last campaign very aggressively. i think it can benefit clinton and maybe bush. people who can talk about these issues in a sophisticated, but accessible way actually do better, because most americans recognize we have an economic imbalance with china, but what does it actually mean? i think that is the challenge for all these candidates. john: it raises the bar for those guys. if they do it well, it is a home run, but it is tricky, because you have to explain complex international economics. it is not actually a black-and-white issue, so if you can get the gray right, you're in good shape, but if not, you could be muddled. mark: absolutely. we are going to have a lot more here from our iowa return -- road trip in davenport talking about jeb bush. matt strong is going to join us. coming up, our conversation from earlier with jeb bush after this word from our sponsors. ♪ ♪ mark: welcome back. we are in davenport, iowa, where

jeb bush was also asked about civil liberties, national security, and enhanced interrogation techniquest's listen to that. jeb: i believe that it was a mistake to repeal the metadata provisions of the patriot act, which took place this last year. there's not any evidence that i can find -- i've talked to a lot of people to ensure this is the case -- that civil liberties were violated, that privacy was finally did. i do think in general torture is not appropriate, is not as effective, and the change of policy that my brother did, and then was put into executive order form by the president, was the proper thing to do. i would also say after 9/11, we brother --ed, and my i'm not saying this because i'm a bush, i'm saying this because i'm a person of this country look everyone in this room -- i am proud of what he did to create a secure environment. mark: civil liberties versus national security is a debate in the party, not just chris christie and rand paul. this is another case he is the adult in the room. that is a nuanced, center-right position on how to balance these things. if that is

now it is jeb bush's time. she likes to be on offense. think part of it is to get away from these other discussions, that also she thinks it is a winning argument for her. mark: jeb is so vulnerable this, it could hurt him. obviously every day the e-mails are in the news and she wants to make news on something else. going after jeb bush on iraq makes news. john: and he gave her some grist for the mill as he has been defending policies of his brother. i get why he has to do it. it is going to lead to this kind of thing, not just from hillary clinton, but others. mark: she will be here tonight and tomorrow. she is taking questions from reporters at the fair tomorrow. i think a lot of it will be on e-mail. mark: a big day. all right, coming up, and day at the iowa state fair with the jeb bush as he walks around. first, the conversation with charles grassley about the fair , the republican presidential race, and the concerns that he has over those clinton e-mails. that is next after this word from our sponsor. ♪ back here in clear lake, iowa.

going after jeb bush on iraq makes news. john: and he gave her some grist been -- asl, sc has he has been defending policies of his brother. i get why he has to do it. mark: she will be here tonight and tomorrow. taking questions from reporters. i think a lot of it will be on e-mail. mark: a big day. all right, coming up, and day at the iowa state fair with the jeb bush as he walks around. first, the conversation with charles grassley about the fair and the concerns over those clinton e-mails. that is next after this word from our sponsor. ♪ john: we are back in iowa. we werehe things talking about was hillary clinton's e-mail trouble. grassleyn with charles , asking about new developments to the clinton story and his level of concern. sen. grassley: this is not just a clinton thing. my reputation goes back to overseeing democrat and republican administrations. i'm concerned about the enforcement of the law and the fbi doing a proper investigation and the transparency the president promised, these e-mails should get to the i

on women's issues, jeb bush on common core, jeb bush on act of love. blah blah blah blah blah. he's been saying this now for two months. so i mean, now he's in new hampshire. i am very happy he's there because the questioners there, people show up with well craft, well researched questions and i'm not sure this broken record and entertainment routine, this spectacle, is going to sell when it comes down to town halls. >> jeffrey, i want to ask you. you look at the poll that came out today from cnn, it shows trump very competitive against hillary clinton, but when we look back to 2011 or 2007, they fade. rick perry in 2007, you look further back, when you look, michele bachmann, for instance, is it possible that bush is going to turn donald trump into the bachmann or perry of the 2016s? >> i think the answer is found in the description i heard from cnn a few minutes ago that there are 1500 people at donald trump's town hall and 200 at jeb bush's. right there i think is the essence of the answer being seen in the polls. >> jeffrey, we are watching the two

it's a good thing for jeb bush. because all we have been talking about for the last couple of days and all over the media is this duel between jeb bush and donald trump. there is 15 other people running. nobody is mentioning them. i think jeb, getting testy. getting feisty. fighting back. talking about donald trump's record. which is not conservative. contrasting it with his. which is a very conservative record as a governor. is a very good tactic. it's a smart tactic for jeb bush. >> if i may, quickly. jeffrey will have something sig and a half can't to say. jeb bush has a lot of ground to make up. he should be spending the dollars, defining himself to voters before spending time on trump. >> jeffrey, i should tell you right now. we just got -- >> ana, hang on, we got word donald trump has arrived in the parking lot. elvis is near the building if you will. jeffrey lord. i want to go to you, jeffrey. earlier today i spoke to mitt romney's former deputy campaign manager. the people are going to this event is like goi

hillary clinton beats jeb bush by 15 points among women. he would need to get that down into the probably high single digits at least down to 10% to be competitive. clinton versus bush. a 15-point gender gap. almost twice as high. donald trump loses to women by 28 points among women. no way you win the white house with a gender gap like that. >> katrina pearson, a donald trump supporter and mary lynn garcia, a form he member of the new hampshire state legislature. and a jeb bush report he a friend of marco rubio. how big of a problem is this for jeb bush? his comments today, his campaign basically put out two press releases in short order to try to clear it up. >> well first of all, i was very happy to see them clarify it. for him to say that he misspoke. this is nothing new for jeb and i think there is going to be a stark contrast if he's the nominee between him and hillary clinton. jeb bush has been all his life a pro-lifer. he is against funding of abortions with taxpayer money. he defunded planned parenthood in florida and that is what h

she takes on jeb bush because she knows jeb bush will defeat her and become the next president of thed states. >> does al have a point there? >> she's taken on scott walker and donald trump. jeb bush is giving her ample opportunity by making mistake after mistake after mistake on the campaign trail and just to push back on something al said his unfavorables have not gone down but up. he is seen worse by the public according to the a recent poll than mitt romney in the entire 2012 campaign. jeb bush is less popular than romney after he hit 47% and made error after error. at some point the bush game has to look inside and figure what they are doing wrong and maybe not a question of strategy the fact they have a bad candidate running in the wrong election. >> big question now -- >> listen -- [ overlapping speakers ] >> on thursday, when he is facing off in this debate a good opportunity for him to make some ground up where maybe he well, at least dan thinks he lost. al great to see you. >> he'll do great, kate he'll do great. you'll see. >> we'll be there to watch with you. >> al dan, th

night trumpst was asked if he was getting under jeb bush posh skin -- jeb bush's skin will stop has heone exactly that? al: sure, john. the bush people say this is a have ar us, because we candidate that is accused of being lackluster. it will prove that he is a conservative, and contrast to trump. the problem is everything jeb bush said after his appearance is correct about trump. it will have just as much effect as the john mccain and megyn kelly comments did. this war, which trump relishes, and bush hesitantly goes in to, -- goes into he's fighting with , an uzi and bush with a bow and arrow. and uneven match. john: that is an uneven match. last night, donald trump was on fire at that town hall. the split screen images, i would use a different metaphor, the difference between technicolor and black-and-white or kind of grainy. trump is compelling right now, bush is not. i think the one thing that is true is that not only does bush get to put on what they call the and -- inve uniform respect to trump, but he needs to put it on more generally on the party where more people suspect he's

bring down the big jeb bush hammer? here is how he took it to hillary clinton. mr. sh: when president obama says that quote for too long we have been too blind to the way past injustices shape the present, he is speaking the truth. [applause] but, we should be just as candid about our failures in addressing the injustices of a more recent origin. in our cities, we have so many people who have not known anything but poverty. so many young adults with no vision of a life beyond the life they know. every one of them was promised at least one big break in life in the form of a public school to help them learn who they are and what they could do. mark: so, while jeb bush turned the other cheek, he left the responding to hillary clinton to his spokesman who took to twitter with this response -- "clinton-esque move to pass over a chance to unite in favor of a false cheap shot." john, did secretary clinton execute the play she wanted to execute at the urban league? john: she executed the play she wanted to execute. this signals that she thinks jeb bush is going to be the rep

donald trump and jeb bush are leading the pack. focusing their attacks on each other. >>> the manhunt widening in the bangkok bomb blast. the officials are looking for at least ten involved. >>> chaos in the streets of st. louis. protests erupt after the officer involved shooting. >>> good morning. welcome to "early start." i'm christine romans. it is thursday, august 20th. 5:00 a.m. in the east. john berman has the morning off. let's start off in new hampshire where the two republican contenders had duelling town hall events. donald trump and jeb bush getting their fair share of questions. both getting the chance to take shots at each other. did they do anything to gain support in their republican party? we have cnn's sara murray with more. >> reporter: good morning, christine. donald trump had the first town hall in derry, new hampshire since becoming a candidate. hundreds of others in an overflow room. the questions ran the gamut. from illegal gun use and immigration. on top of donald trump's agenda was slamming his rival jeb bu

>> listen, we shouldn't write him off completely but the reality of jeb bush's relationship with the base of the republican party is playing out. we knew when bush got into the race, he was in different place than the base on common core and what he had to present was this notion of being the big adult in the race that can raise the money that has the presidential name and can sort of quash all the competition out of the gate. that didn't happen. so if jeb bush is not out of the gate looking like the winner and the inevitable nominee, he immediately now is in that dog fight for the next many months now because he wasn't able to sort of clean up the competition early on. >> he's not exciting the base but he's exciting donors. he's got more than $100 million and as you look ahead, can he recover from the drop in support? >> without a doubt. listen thanks money will be put to work real fast. his super back is going up withed with ed ads in september. he had a last lucker debate performance, that with the trump rise has had had him in this flattening out or decline. in our poll, jim, one

but jeb bush has $114 million. what's he going do with it? he will hit me with ads. at some point he has to. he's going down the tubes. there's no energy. when jeb and hillary and all of these other candidates start spending money, remember this, that money was given by people that have total control over them. those people, many of whom i know very well, they don't care about him, they don't care about the color of his hair, they don't care anything about him. they don't care about the country in many cases. they only want whatever they want. they will get plenty. yes, sir. >> many of people who have contributed, we don't flow who they ar they are. >> they should release the names of the donors. we should be more open, talking about campaign finance. if somebody contributes a lot of money, we should know who those people are. >> citizens united, did you think that was a bad decision? >> it's not a great decision for me. they are friends of mine. because i'm putting up my own money. here you have other people putting up money into other campaigns where they will have

they'll shake this off and jeb bush will become a better candidate. by the way, the competition will make him a better candidate. >> does it matter this far out, dan? does he have room here? >> he's not going to end his campaign right now but, like, you will see this clip about cutting women's health in ads if he's the nominee running on women's programming for months. this will hurt him. it may not hurt him a lot in the primary because his record against women's health choices will probably help him there, but in a general election it can be death. romney's statement about defunding planned parenthood ran thousands of times until n television ads in our campaign room. so this will hurt him in the long run if he's the nominee. >> matt see this is as rustiness and you see that in all of these candidates. is that your diagnosis here? >> look, i think he's been out of politics for a long time, politics has changed dramatically in the nearly 15 years since he last ran for office but he has not answered the question of why he's running for president. like

she went after jeb bush. interestingly jeb bush did not return the fire. gwen: he spoke a couple of hours later. >> his speech was very high-minded, very effective. the best speech i've seen from him so far. that's why it's going to do be a matchup to watch if both of them end up surviving this process. gwen: on the other hand, jeb bush pulled out a lot of money. today's the deadline to find out about the super pac money. he's sitting really pretty. >> that's the whole jeb bush play. long-term, build the network, have the 100 million plus ready so you can have the positive ads and the negative ads once this campaign heats up. you don't see bush going after trump or clinton. this is a careful campaign. he's a candidate who's becoming more confident. gwen: you also saw bernie sanders show up andsaake a point. bernie sanders is pretty out there if he wants to be. is he h creeping up at all? is he creeping up? he's certainly -- his trajectory is more like this and hers is like that. >> i think he is creeping up mostly with white liberals. he needs to do better

trump: i'm not a fan of jeb bush. mr. all he does is push people who don't agree with him down to make his side look better. mr. trump: jeb bush is totally controlled by the people who gave him that money. mr. bush: you only empower bullies by ignoring them. you have to stand up to them. mr. trump: you know what's happening to jeb down the street? his crowd is sleeping. mr. bush: when people look at his record, it is not conservative. john: mary, you recognize both of those voices -- jeb bush and donald trump. their battle is pretty hot and hot running. it is the center of action on the republican side. who's winning the fight right now? mary: i've been publicly supportive of the trump candidacy, and there are three ways to deal with him. one was to dismiss or attack, which is what the establishment did. that was wrong because it in turn dismisses the anger and anxiety that's real in america. the second is to pander to him, which some of the candidates are doing, which is also wrong, because americans don't want trump -- t

if they do it is bad news for , jeb bush. has enough problems without having to fight trump basically by himself. john: his situation -- we had this new iowa poll. jeb is down in the mid-single digits. he's slipping in new hampshire. like hillary clinton needs a bernie strategy, he needs a trump strategy and does not seem to have one right now. mark: sad breaking news -- former president jimmy carter said in a statement he has cancer. it was revealed after he had liver surgery. carter says the cancer is in other parts of his body. the former president plans to undergo treatment in atlanta. we are thinking about president carter and the carter family. we wish him well. coming up, we caught up with doctor and republican presidential candidate ben carson in harlem for a chat earlier today. we will have that for you after this word from our sponsors. ♪ mark: ben carson dropped by gotham city today for a visit that included a powwow with business leaders up in harlem. john and i took a taxi uptown to the fabled sylvia's restaurant

jeb bush?on't think so. >> in talking with sean hannity last night, trump went after bush as a mouthpiece for wealthy donors. >> when jeb bush raises $114 million, which he has. when hillary raises $60 million, i know the people that gave them the money. they're not the nicest people in the world. >> the system is corrupt? >> jeb bush is totally controlled by the people that gave him that money. the nice part about me, i don't want anybody's money. >> donald trump is a rich guy. jeb bush is the son of political privilege. they reek of the establishment yet donald trump is drawing this distinction here, my wealth frees me from the political establishment, it allows me to say, i don't need your money. it allows me to throw it in their face. i know wealthy candidates make this argument a lot, i think it resonates. >> the one thing trump brings more than anyone else, he's saying things that people don't say. he's very honest and at times not politically correct, but in this case, the chief critique

jeb bush is really suffering in the earned media phase. >> chris, straight up question, should jeb bush consider skipping iowa all together? >> easy answer, because i've written this before, yes. i think he should -- you know, casey is right, it's sort of about -- jeb bush is never going to say like john mccain did in 2000, i'm ignoring iowa. he's going to probably -- i think he should downplay it, make clear that new hampshire, south carolina and nevada, florida, the states that come after iowa are the ones that he's really putting an emphasis on. it's possible given his money, and again casey is right here, 114 million between the super pack and the candidate. he could overwhelm the iowa airwaves. the last two winners of the iowa caucuses were social conservatives who were underfunded running against better funded social candidates. i don't know if money alone solves the problem. i think it should be a consideration for him. i would guess it probably is. >> you think he should also skip? >> well, no, i think that he probably knows he's not going to place really high in the iowa caucus

it is bad news for jeb bush. he has enough problems. hn: his situation -- we have ll.s new iowa po jeb is in mid-single digits. he need a trump strategy and does not seem to have one right now. mark: sad breaking news from president jimmy carter -- he has cancer. it was revealed after he had liver surgery. it is in other parts of his body. the former president plans to undergo treatment in atlanta. we are thinking about president carter and his family. we wish him well. coming up, we talked up with dr. ben carson in harlem for a chat earlier today. we will have that for you after this word from our sponsors. ♪ mark: ben carson drive-by got them city today -- dropped by gotham city today to meet with carson. it was a place with all the food. dr. carson, your first time to sylvia's. how did it go? dr. carson: it was wonderful. the food was spectacular. i loved it. mark: what are the other landmarks in new york city that you would still like to go to? dr. carson: i have not been to the 9/11 memorial until this morning. that was really eye-o

jeb bush is raising all the money. he was at the top of the pack but scott walker was lead lgd in iowa, second in new hampshire. people thought wait a minute, watch this guy. four years ago another midwestern governor tim pawlenty was viewed is he going to be the guy who gets mitt romney and then he dries up? >> one thing we have to remember about scott walker is even though he's been leading a lot of these polls and he's had good showings in iowa, new hampshire, he is still relatively unknown nationally. if people know anything about him, they know about the fight against the unions in wisconsin, which is very popular with republicans. but people don't know much else about him. they don't know how he's going to perform on the big stage. they don't know a lot about his other policy positions, particularly on foreign policy. so i think he perhaps more than any other candidate has the most to gain, and also the most to lose in this first debate. >> jeb bush has been off the bike for a dozen years. it will be interesting

them s once the front-runner jeb bush, and donald j. trump, trump has been burning bush since he blazed on the campaign trail, and the final toorching seems to have finally lit a fire until the former governor. even if the joyful tortoise has turned into a snapping turtle, he's still losing to trump in his own state. it's trump's face, not his on the cover of "time" magazine. yes, that's a bald eagle perched on donald trump's arm. in that interview with "time," he floated the idea of holding cnn hostage over the next debate. if i go to cnn and say, look, i'm going to have a massive audience and i say, i want $10 million for charity, nothing for myself, what happens? i'm not showing up, right? will he show up? you'll have to watch on september 16th and find out. i promise jake tapper, the guy usually here, will be there. he is one of the motte raters. i want to get to athena jones, in keane, new hampshire, where it's very exciting, full contact, and again even harder today. >> reporter: hi, john. that's right, up until just a few days ago

an asymmetric threat. >> he is trying to wage his campaign on issues of substance. >> i watched jeb bush give the worst answer the other day. jeb's answer on women's health issues is a disaster for him. >> when you focus on trump you get involved in the clown car. >> i can only go by the polls. >> a suffolk university survey indicates he's still ahead in iowa. this is the campaign that is not a campaign. >> because someone can stand up and say you are stupid and ugly does not equate with a vision for the country. >> i'm the most fabulous whiner. i do whine because i want to win. >> trump on top aft the debate. >> there should have been 2 million people watching, there were 24 million people. >> i was fantastic. the ratings were huge. >> the best reality show on television. >> who do you think they are watching with, jeb bush? i don't think so. ♪ >> tonight, at the reagan library in california and major foreign policy speech jeb bush confronted the biggest weakness of his presidential campaign, his brotherly connection to what even jeb bush acknowledges is the war that never should have h

jeb bush now following trump's footsteps to the texas border. the businessman took a swipe at bush on friday. says his immigration prols is weak and the mimicry is transparent. >> jeb bush whose totally in favor of common core, week on immigration. right? very weak on immigration. wants to let people come in. he is using anchor baby. he put out a memo you cannot use anchor baby. now because i used it he's using it. >> he believes it will underscore a flawed policy. >> i think it is great. i think he'll now find out it is an not an act of love. he said people crossing are crossing as an act of love. i was down there. it is, rough, tough, stuff. >> joining me now is my panel. susan, let me begin with you. the bush campaign tried to ignore trump for a long time. do candidates need to play follow the leader now? they feel compelled to mimic trumpl. >> this trip to the location was planned. it was a fundraiser planned weeks in advance by governor bush. but you raise a good point. now the candidates realize trump is in the race and staying. and bush st

despite jeb bush not doing well in the polls. >> not surprising.the two of them in most polls are number one and number two. clearly donald trump sees jeb bush as his biggest factor right now in getting the nomination. so not surprising that they're going to talk about their differences somewhat. >> but in such a personal way here, we know what donald trump has said in the past and ian tweeted out about this issue regarding immigration and why this is perceived to hit close to jeb bush's home. >> that is mr. trump's style. it's what has, gets him lots of attention, it's certainly what gets him lots of news coverage which helps keep him right now at the top of the polls, but tamron, let's keep in mind, polls right now are not particularly indicative of who the nominee is going to be. rudy giuliani and fred thompson led in 2007 at this point, and let me also add that president obama was down 22 points to hillary at this point. so while polls are interesting to watch and polls are interesting to report on, they're not good indicators of who the nomine

you are not backing jeb bush. : the good news is the campaigns don't pick candidates as much as they make candidates. i think jeb has shaken off some of the rust. he grew when he stood his ground against the press. i think he is getting better at it. internet,now, the campaigns have changed since jeb bush last ran. we were talking and in today's world, it is a communications campaign. we share stuff of the time. stuff has to be big and important to demand all of our attention. you cannot be in old-school candidate otherwise the media will not work for you. that is something that has changed. john: barack obama has changed our conception of the presidency. he is glamorous, he is a celebrity, he is ubiquitous. in some weird way obama has paved the way for trump. alex: what is big enough that we can all share in this? will need our constant attention. if it does not have some bigness and substance, we are not going to do that. that has been a big change. john: thank you. we will be right back to find out how it is han

worse than him is jeb bush. jeb bush is a disaster in so many different ways. >> carly fiorina. >> i don't know her i never met her. she looks very nice. but she got fired viciously. i don't mean like a little bit. business is my game. >> would that be smart in this debate andrea? >> i think it would be very foolish for donald trump to change who he is at this point because it's not believable. he's winning because he's authentic and doesn't spit out talking points. for any pundit to sit and say that he should change or will change, i think is naive. >> trump being trump, which i think is smart and being -- don't -- doesn't the american people want to see him be presidential? isn't that going to be an important component. >> we saw other candidate like mitt romney go out of his way to be presidential. for some reason that meant stiff. i want to point out why donald trump is winning. the gop base wants someone who is fight and win. remember when mccain suspended his campaign and mitt romney wouldn't take on obama

jeb bush low energy. what does that mean? >> there is actually a strategy behind the attack on bush's low energy. trump's people tell me that in 2008 and 2012, the one thing that really irritated conservatives is they didn't feel senator mccain or mitt romney went hard enough after president obama. they didn't think the aggression was there in the general election on some certain key issues. what trump is signaling to conservative activists is i will bring it to the democratic nominee in a different way. i will be high energy. in a way the other nominees as you see it from been low energy. >> gotcha. very good piece by the way in the "the washington post." thank you very much, mr. kosta. >> thank you. >> the candidates who aren't donald trump via -- via for the spotlight. donald trump isn't even in the race. clinton on the ropes? we hope you stick around for those reports. doers. they don't worry if something's possible. they just do it. at sears optical, we're committed to bringing them eyewear that works as hard as they do.

and jeb bush is seeing this right now. i think he's tried ignoring him, tried keeping him out of the fray, but reporters keep asking him about it. i think he's becoming increasingly frustrated. i'm not entirely sure that's the best practice for him, though. there is no line for trumpl where there has to be a line for other candidates. the voters and the people out there don't necessarily expect donald trump to have the same kind of commentary or politically correct words as other candidates in this race, tamron. >> let me bring in our political panel for you this morning. former chief of the u.s. office of citizenship under george w. bush also joining us, nbc political analyst david coren. thank you both for joining us. there is no line for donald trump. his campaign is based on being politically incorrect, so he can, in his mind, tweet out or retweet something offensive as he did about not speaking mexican, directed at jeb bush, his family as well. as he pointed out, my children are hispanic, my wife is hispanic, and peop

jeb bush so far a little rusty? >> oh, no. look. talk to even republican strategists and say rust on him. one i talked to was looking at the forum in hampnew hampshire and said she is surprised that jeb bush is not much more polished at this stage of the game. >> it is early in the stage of the game. >> that is true. >>> sparking outrage in the republican ranks is becomeing a major talking point for the race for the white house. let's get more from senior washington correspondent joe johns. >> reporter: call this the latest sign this controversy over use of fetal tissues and research is going to stick around for a while. some congressional republicans are talking about linking the fight over planned parenthood to a possible government shutdown battle this fall. and the release of another controversial video is adding fuel to the fire. it's like the other productions. edited undercover video with a planned parenthood official identified as a research director in texas. apparently, unaware she is being recorded, talking about extracti