jefferson. latour was convinced that if the spanish don't put up a wall, they don't put up a wall, americans are going to flood into texas. in fact, he said, should spain not do something, the time will come and unfortunately is not far off when the americans will pour myriads into mexico. so they won't even just go to texas, but they'll make it all the way to mexico. the reason, he says, because the americans have strength of character. they have courage. they have skill in the use of guns, and their eyes are fixed on texas and mexico like the jews on the promised land. well, he insisted they would join any expedition, like they had done with the gutierrez de lara/magee expedition. they would join any expedition even if it had little prospect of success because they had everything to gain and nothing to lose. well, what latour is telling them, you guys got to do something here. you know, americans are already gathering in arkansas, and they're beginning to trickle over into texas. it's only a m

supported this or jefferson supported that. well, yeah, he did support this and that. and you figure he lived to be 80-plus years old. so over the course of a long life, he did have a lot of different attitudes. and his ideas and belief were always evolving and changing. well, in 1786, jefferson would write to a friend, he said, our continent must be viewed as the nest from which all america, north and south, is to be people. well, in 1791, the summer of 1791, the spanish governor of florida, quesada -- you said there was a pointer on this thing. pointer, pointer, pointer. is it -- okay. you take -- fortunately, you guys know where florida is. but the spanish governor of florida, governor quesada extended an invitation for americans to move into florida. all they would need to do is spanish government. they would profess to be catholics, and they could acquire all the land they wanted. wealth, jefferson thought this was a great idea. in fact, he said he wished 100,000 americans would move there because it would give us peaceabl

for jefferson convenience should not be confused with necessity. there was nothing in the constitution, authorizing a federal bank. he buttressed his claim by citing the unratified tenth amendment, observing to restate any power not clearly ee unanimous rated in the constitution, shaken by the force of such arguments, washington invited hamilton to refute his detractors. using ridicule where logic did not suffice, the secretary of treasury pointed out the inconsistences of strict constructionism. a government empowered to build lighthouses to promote commerce could hardly balk at a bank to collect its taxes or pay its salaries or service its deb salaries or service its debt. hamilton's plea for the bank did not convert washington, it reinforced his nationalistic outlook, all the same, it did not endear hamilton or washington to jefferson and his followers. by this time, the secretary of the state was imploring a poet named phillip chernotto make war on the government for which he reportedly worked as a state department translator. it is astonishing

and jefferson stood on the church-state and what is your take on the evolution of the problem? >> it's a big question. i think they were all -- they all believed in the separation of the two. i think one of the things that comes all of this story is how each in their way more feria eclectic religious thinkers in their time and it would be very hard for franklin are jefferson to run for president today with an open expression of their religious beliefs. franklin -- one of the things he says about franklin after he died, he wrote in his journal he said he was a wonderful man one of my great friends it's too bad he was in on the lever. and you have to love priestley because she may be the most optimistic man who ever lived and was seeing the best in people as he was causing the controversies of franklin, he said i think his problem was the reason he never really saw the wisdom of being religious was that he just didn't have enough time to read the books i recommended. you should read my volume on this. and jefferson called himself one so they were unusual and what they brought to

jefferson thought this was a great idea. he said he wished 100,000 americans would move there ca might otherwise cost us a war. what jefferson is telling us there is this is his vision for how americans would incorporate territory. they would be invited in. they would profess loyalty to that government. they would embrace that government's christian faith and then in due time, their american loyalties and emotions would bubble to the top. and at that point, they wouldrt the constellation of stars and stripes. keep that in mind. that's a framework. modus opera jefferson envisioned for america. in 1801, jefferson mentioned in his first the united states was a chosen country with enough room for our descendants to the 100th and 1,000th generation. now, jefferson was someone who was very precise about his wording. he was very precise about his use of language. 100th/1,000th generation. do you think how long jefferson considered a generation? 30 years. the 100th generation, 3,000 the 1,000th generation, 30,000 years. he's saying

the man, jefferson the slave owner, jefferson the patriot, jefferson the variety of roles he playedrtant this wall of remembrance is a testament to them as well as to helping us to really see and understand who jefferson was. >> right one thing you wanted the point out, was the difference of using the word enslaved and slave. can you talk about that. >> slave represents what we think is sort of an impersonal way of saying these are people, individuals involved in a system and that system was slavery but they were enslaved people who were a part of that so we think it honors them it honors the sort of role that they had to take and it in some way penalizes it that is why we add not only enslaved community at monticello, because it is a specific community that had a three dimensional life that in some way we want people to understand and get to know whenever possible we try to make sure that we mention the names, of george or the names of joseph or the names of editor the names of fanny -- edith or the names of fanny so we penalize those involved in a system rather than slaves themsel

all to jefferson he said when he was talking about equality. he felt this connection that i think we continue to feel. people ask me questions like, you know, what would george washington think of the invasion of iraq? i mean, people don't -- other countries don't that. >> what would char he main say? >> yeah. william pitt, they don't have that kind of connection to the past. the brits don't have that kind of connection. so i have a lot of sympathy for the tea party people. i know they distort the past, but i understand the emotional need because i think it's there for everyone in some sense. because there's no other basis for our americanism. except these ideals that they created. >> and one of the points you make in your book is that this sense of our ideals was very early on accompanied by a sense that we were an example to the world because of those ideals. luis mentioned that the show here right now is on the american and the haitian and the french revolutions which happened in a contained time span. shall we talk about how we reacted to t

all on jefferson, he said, when he was talking about equality. and he felt this connection that i think we continue to feel. i mean, people ask me questions like, you know, what would george washington think of the invasion of iraq? no other -- i mean, people don't -- in other countries do that. people don't ask, what would -- >> what would charlemane say. >> they don't ask that question. they don't have that kind of connection with the past. as history-minded as they might be, the brits don't have that kind of connection. so i have a lot of sympathy for the tea party. i know they distort the past, but i understand the emotional need because i think it's there for everyone in some sense. because there's no other basis for our americanism. except these ideals that they created. >> and one of the points you

jefferson, he said, has a modicum of principles. >> good enough. we have a had a revival for 15 years or so. you make the pont in one of your essays that our relationship to the founders is similar in some ways to the founders' relationship to the romans. to the classical world, primarily the romans. and what does that mean? what is our relationship? what was theirs to their predecessor? >> well, i first would say, that may be an exaggeration. i think they looked back to the roman hero, cicero. john adams was fascinated by cicero. they had models of leadership, of examples of disinterested virtuous behavior. they held up the roman model. but, of course, rome died. and so they're frightened, they don't want to go that way. so that was always a problem. how do you prevent your state from regenerating? the common assumption was that states were like human beings. they were born. they grew up. they matured. and they died. and so how do you hold off that natural process as much as possible? that assessment. but i think our relationship to these founders

and wartime conditions were exactly what madison and jefferson feared. because those are the conditions under which executive authority expands. and that's why they feared war so deeply. >> of course, then there's that wonderful letter of hamilton's when the deadlock in 1800 is before the house, and there's some federalists who are thinking, let's put burr in the presidency. and hamilton was saying no, no, don't do that. but one of his arguments is that based on his judgment of jefferson, i think the phrase is he'll want to come into a good estate. i think that's psychologically shrewd, despite his rhetoric, he'll enjoy those powers once he gets them. >> jefferson had -- burr had no principles whatsoever. jefferson, he said, has a modicum of principles. >> good enough. close enough. we have been in a founders revival for 15 years or so. you make the pont in one of your essays that our relationship to the founders is similar in some ways to the founders' relationship to the romans. to the classical world, primarily the romans. and what does that mean? wha

, which turns jefferson's historic home into a reminder that over the course of his life, jefferson owned but that is conveniently ignoring the fact that thanks to jefferson, those slaves were living in a free country. fortunately, some modern paris are defending our founders, and they bring us to tonight's word. ( cheers and applause ). american history x.'d. for a year, one group has waged a counter-offensive against these founding father fact attacks. >> some members of the tea party say what's in your child's textbooks may be giving them a negative opinion about our nation's history. >> the tea party is telling state politicians we need to tone down talk of slavery and stop making it about race. ( laughter ). >> stephen: yes, please, stop making slavery about race. everybody knows it was about economics. black people just happened to be a great investment. now, a spokesman-- ( laughter ) a spokesman for the tennessee tea party says they just want to address "made-up criticism about the founders intruding on the indians or having slaves or being hypocrites." yes, that is totally made-u

he needs to win jefferson and win it big.his tiny county, piton came in, 0.3% of the population. they came in as we speak. governor romney won pitcon, a lot of the small, rural areas what we saw it happened right here, senator santorum has been winning. he made up -- he was 1,000 when we began the conversation, now 688 votes because of this county right here coming in for senator santorum. so wolf, what we have now is a county by county. we're going to have to do the arithmetic the old fashioned way. you have about an abacus at home or calculator. >> pitcon, that's aspen county. >> more of the romney vote, the strength is those above $200,000 there. a tiny vote. he wins that county with 83 votes. not exactly a resounding mathematical victory. you have to assume based on the trends that senator santorum is going to win most of these. maybe not all of them, but most of these. he's winning the small, rural areas. he's winning here. this is a population center, grand junction. what is key to the state for senator santorumer. we h

that's one story about thomas jefferson. it is not the story about thomas jefferson. and the problem that i have is that hollywood is so eager -- and i'm using using hollywood as sort of the catch phrase for maybe pop culture, but in this country, we're so excited by the scandalous, at least they would have us believe that, if it titillating if it's salacious, it gets the story. thomas jefferyson is the man who wrote the declaration of independence. this is a man who feels very much out of his league in the continental congress. he feels very inadequate to the task, not only that but he writes this document with john adams and benjamin franklin looking over his shoulder. he is not the sole author of the declaration of independence as you may have learned in school. it was edited heavily and there was quite a bit of input. the fact that this man, that he writes the final draft of this, one of the reasons they pick him, number one he's not as exalted as these old guys, and two number, he's got beautiful handwriting. that to me is an interesting story. it's not the only

initially jefferson davis said we'll not give up a single inch of our soil. well, that's impractical. and it didn't work out that way either. so, you allow the enemy to penetrate, but then you -- in circumstance of your choosing when the enemy is lost or has made a mistake or can be numbered or you can attack the enemy's fractions with your mast, you attack, the offense. go on the offense. davis believed in that strategy i think, and this is gravely oversimplified, davis said we will outwill the united states. we will exist. every day we exist we're winning. the united states is losing every day we survive. and the longer we exist, the more regular we will seem to the rest of the world and even to our enemies. and if all else fails, we will just abandon conventional modern war, take to the hills, and be guerrillas. davis is anticipating post-modern warfare. imagine. good old boys as vietcong or i.r.a. or other post-modern forms of warfare. and this is what davis anticipates as a last resort at least. meanwhile, he believes he can outlast the union will. lee i

initially jefferson davis said we'll not give up a single inch of our soil. well, that's impractical. and it didn't work out that way either. so, you allow the enemy to penetrate, but then you -- in circumstance of your choosing when the enemy is lost or has made a mistake or can be numbered or you can attack the enemy's fractions with your mast, you attack, the offense. go on the offense.

that supremely democratic act did not occur until thomas jefferson showed up. of course, jefferson was not above answering the door of the white house himself in his carpet slippers when the british ambassador appeared. every thursday afternoon there was a state dinner, washington had a dining room and table for 16. and unfortunately the best account we have left by the senator mcclay, who detected lobbying for the presidential program when washington urged him to have a second helping of pudding, he never quite understood virginia hospitality. could you imagine? washington waited five minutes for tardy guests and then everyone went in and sat down. if you arrived afterward, if you had the nerve to walk in, washington had an unvarying line. sir, we are too punctual for you. i have a cook, said, washington, who never asked whether the company has come but whether the hour has come. presuming at that point you would slink down the table to your position. he is generally sedate and serious recalled one of washington's guests. only after have two or three glasses o

i thought they hung it next at jefferson's portrait to poke fun at his close friend. you see other features of the room that impressed visitors. the bust, these are notable people of american history from george washington to the lafayette. this room really made a powerful impression. it was a functional room and served tea and welcomed their guests. i said they had many visitors. while every visitor had access to this room and would be welcomed by madison or dolly or another member of the family, madison also used this room to control all of that public interest and to give himself some privacy. because unless you knew him or had a letter of introduction, you wouldn't see any more of the house than this room. you would be welcomed here grar grar graciously, served punch and then on your way. you only went into the other rooms of the house and the family or a friend. now let's go ith apartments of madison's mother. we pass through the entry hall of the house and really understand how this function, this big wide space with doors either side, throw them open for a cool

there is the experience as you walk down jefferson street.chair chu: do you have slides. >> no, we do not. chair chu: in the future, if you were able to distribute these in advance, that would be helpful, because we cannot see the screen. >> thank you. this is the first two blocks. jones and high street. it would allow us to have some traffic diversions strategies, so the key part of the plan is really to reduce this to the greatest extent possible, so that it is a call, say, and enjoyable experience. again, some background, in fiscal year 2010, the area received about 9 million visitors and generated through various rents and taxes about $65 million revenue towards the city, said just doing a very basic sensitivity analysis, what would happen with a 5%, 10% or more increase based other cities across, going to new york and denver and portland in between, and you can see just even a modest increase results in a long-term benefit to the city on an annual basis. and with that, i am going to hand the microphone over for douglas for the budget. th

madison came i think, to appreciate the court bletetter n his colleague, jefferson. >> jefferson said if john marshall, whom he hated. >> yes. >> if john marshall asked if the sun was shining, he'd say, i don't know, si, i can't tell. whatever you say you get marbury out of madison. >> such a shrewd -- one of great minds. without great education. i mean he didn't have a lot of college education. he had a great mind, however. >> sir? >> alvin, before the question, the federalist had a comment on judicial review. the idea of reviewing by the courts let the constitutionality of state laws, which was not passed. my question has to do with john adams and the election and his term after george washington. he went home. and the question is how important that going home alone with his family, after his family, in the wagon, sneaking out of washington, as it were, how important that was in establishing a firm anti-men nor cal in the united states. >> one party of such planting another was an extraordinary moment in the history of western politics, and adams' willingness to surrender and the fe

and below him should be the next three presidents, john adams ii, thomas jefferson, third, but where his picture should be hung as the fourth president, madison hangs the picture of the fifth president, james monroe. and visitors note that. why doesn't he put his own portrait here? and then as they look around the room, they discover that madison has hung his own portrait as one visitor said in the corner behind the door showing his modesty, but he's also hung his portrait next to his bloeloved dolley. again, he's telling you a lot about himself, the important thing in his life. now, over this portrait of himself, he hung a picture of his best friend, thomas jefferson, and next to it a portrait of mary magdalene. now, family tradition in the madison family is that that portrait was a gift to madison from thomas jefferson. i long thought that madison hung it next to jefferson's portrait to poke a little fun at his chose friend. but you also see some other features of this room that impressed visitors. the bust. these are the notable people of american history from george washington to

we have jefferson's account of one at which the president threw his hat on the floor. i don't know why he was wearing his hat at the cabinet meeting, but in any event -- but we know that washington sacrificed in many ways during the presidency and part of it was, in my view, part of this much larger realization that it was -- it was vital that both hamilton and jefferson, in the immortal worlds of lyndon johnson about j. edgar hoover were kept insite the tent pissing out rather than inside the tent pissing in. and that's not a plug for the movie. >> in your first lecture you described a washington who was seeking self-aggrandizement and power and prestige and money and status. and today you basically talked about a washington who had no ego and was doing everything for the benefit of the country. that's a complete turnaround in where he was coming from. what do you attribute the significant change in his outlook and his sense of accomplishment? >> yeah. i accept the broad description. i would take issue -- i think he had an ego, he had -- i don't think it's as drastic

jefferson was always seeking the hobgoblin of monarchy. and it planted the seeds of an awkward and eventually more than awkward relationship with washington, who believed that those fears were exaggerated. and in any event, frankly, he was the alternative. so the relationship never really recovered in terms of the mason-washington relationship. it was unfortunate. but both men of principle. mason i think in some ways has been rediscovered in recent years. and i say that not just as someone who teaches at his namesake university. which even before it had a great basketball team was a great university. and i think of the spirit of george mason. there is a statue of mason, bronze, life-sized, stout, vigorous, making his point, you know, insisting that he be heard, questioning the received wisdom of the day, which is probably not bad concept to put on every college campus. maybe one more. yeah? >> one more. >> give me just one second, please. >> not perfect. >> washington's only trip out of the continental united states i believe was to barbad

did you know that thomas jefferson's tombstone of monticello makes no mention of visit him ever being president of the united states instead it reads here was buried thomas jefferson author of the declaration of american independence of the state of virginia for religious freedom and father of the university of virginia end of quote nothing about being the two term third president of the united states and that's the way he wanted it jefferson was far more proud of starting the university of virginia which he envisioned as a free public university that he was of being the president of the united states and he wanted his tombstone which he designed himself before he died to reflect that in a very real way thomas jefferson was the father of free public education in our country since then public education has sued serve two main purposes in america it's been the great equalizer in our economy and american no matter how rich or poor they were born could have access to the same quality public education be given the same opportunities to learn about the world and be given the same preparatio

street. -- and joining -- in joining -- enjoying a better jefferson street. supervisor chu: thank you. next speaker, please. >> ♪ i am just trying to be friendly budget committee glad we did meet and i hope you get all the money all the money you seek hey, hey, you are the budget, never know where you will be found and i know you are going to help this roadwork in this city taliban -- city town ♪ supervisor chu: thank you. next speaker. >> good afternoon, supervisors. my name is douglas ya. listening to the discussion on this item, it seems like we are spending close to $1 million or two city blocks. seems a bit rich, given the current conditions. the supervisor makes a good point that other parts of san francisco had been neglected, financially. just by the fact that they even considered granite, why not go for gold? why just settle for granite? let's go for gold. especially when we have read china to support us. what is a few million dollars? they can just give it to us. it is kind of like chump change for them. number two, if this project were so important

his tombstone which he designed himself before he died to reflect that in a very real way thomas jefferson was the father of free public education in our country since then public education has soon served two main purposes in america it's been the great equalizer in our economy and american no matter how rich or poor they were born could have access to the same quality public education be given the same opportunities to learn about the world and be given the same preparation for a good job. that at its core is what the american dream is all about and a quality public education is essential to making sure it doesn't disappear but there's another purpose of education one that thomas jefferson touched on in a letter to one of his mentors george wife back in seventeen eighty six he wrote i think by far the most important bill in our whole code is that for the diffusion of knowledge among the people no other sure foundation can be devised for the preservation of freedom and happiness preach my dear sir a crusade against ignorance established improve the law for educating the common people let

worst imaginable person, thomas jefferson. jefferson had opposed washington and opposed adams on the, on the navy. jefferson's support, obviously, was not in new england. and jefferson tried to have a small a navy as possible given the fact he had to fight the war with tripoli. ask he succeeded in keep -- and he succeeded in keeping it very small. madison was his successor, madison went along with him, and that's why we had such a small navy going into 1812. the federalists all, during jefferson's administration, all during madison's administration were screaming for a larger navy. they, they supported a navy. and so if you want to know, to answer your question specifically to what degree were the federalists responsible for what an excellent small navy we had, a lot. is the answer. i should say, also, that the officers in the navy were nonpolitical. they kept out of politics. they agreed with washington and adams that the officers in uniform had no business in politics, so it was not a political navy, but the federalists cert

jefferson's views would undergo considerable change over time. as he grew cautious with age, washington became uncharacteristically radical. but then, virginians like jefferson formed their opinion of the african-american on the plantation. after 1775 in particular, washington had his transformed on the battlefield. some battles were waged over tea cups in the parlor. phyllis wheatley was the african poetess whose work had won praise from voltaire and censure from jefferson. named for the slave ship that transported her from africa to boston, wheatley entered washington's life in october 1775 when she sent to the american commander a folsom tribute in verse which ended with a flattering, if inaccurate, prediction. a crown, a mansion and a throne that shines, with gold unfading, washington divine. ms. wheatley's salute coincided with a ban on free negroes in continental ranks. one can readily discern washington the southern slave holder in the seclusionary order issued under his name. quote, neither negroes, boys unable to bear arms, nor old men u

so lincoln crafted this careful, well-plotted strategy to throw the ball into the court of jefferson davis and compel him to make the first move. i think there is a lot to be said for that, but i want to also harken back to what some of us have said earlier about how lincoln was picking his way through a political mine field in his first several months in the presidency, and that is that lincoln wasn't sure how any of this was going to turn out yet. he was still harboring a hope there was latent nationalism somewhere in the south, certainly not south carolina, but elsewhere in the south, bring about tempers to cool so that if you could postpone and delay the confrontation, you might, in fact, convince some of those states to recant and come back into the union peacefully. if that didn't happen and confrontation was necessary, then yes, i'll create the circumstances where you bear the responsibility. but i kind of suspect that he hoped that the relief expedition would be allowed to go into fort sumter, that that would prolong the period of uncertainty, keep eight instead of only four

>> what thomas jackson thought of jefferson davis in 1862. jackson had a low opinion of davis. there are a number of episodes that make that abundantly clear. jackson's world view was that thing were supposed to run according to the manual. and davis not only had accepted way out of channels complaints about jackson during the romney campaign, that not only did not go through jackson which is the way the about book's supposed to be but he might have forgiven that, they went right straight to the secretary of war, the secular leader of the war effort. and snacks also is said to have been -- this is not quite so well documented -- disgusted with davis' unwilling to pur soof after first pa nasa. but there is a documented episode in the aftermath of the seven days when jefferson davis rode down past the battlefields to malverne hill hill on the morning of july 2 and came into the room where lee was for a conference with the leading commanders, jackson was present. he immediately stood up, stiffly at attention and then promptly left the room and there were evidences that he just did

madison came to appreciate the court better than his colleague jefferson. >> jefferson said that if john marshall, whom he hated, if john marshall asked him if the sun was shining, he would say, i don't know, sir, i can't tell. he figured whatever you would say you would get marbury -- >> he was a great mind. he didn't have a lot of education. he had a great mind, however. >> sir? >>al vin hellersteen. before the question, the federalist had a comment on judicial review, the idea of reviewing by the courts, let the constitutionality of state laudz, which was not passed. my question has to do with john adams, his election and term after george washington. he went home. and the question is how important that going home alone with his family, after his family in a wagon, sneaking out of washington, as it were. how important that was in establishing a firm antiminorical. >> that was important in the history of western politics. and adams' willingness to surrender. the federalists' willingness to surrender power to this new party. they didn't think of these parties as we think of them. they n

these are those -- that kind of agreement, of course, jefferson thought would be a way whereby as ellis puts it that they would not abandon the new government of the united states, but they would capture it, like the new capital, it would become an extension of virginia. which was virginia -- both virginia and massachusetts' ambitions for the beginning of this country. well, irony may not be the most popular mood for a political rhetoric, but it seems to me we will find a lot of it in history if we believe it. next to last, it seems to me we need a lot more respect in this country for compromise. and especially the difference between the compromisable and the uncompromisable. i think you can write a great deal of political history of this country on the themes of the conflict and the connections of liberty, justice, and peace. very often, when some kind of conflict happens in the rhetoric and in the legislation of this country, it's the justice versus the partisans of liberty. my teacher at the yale list on pope used to say that when you look at the history of the supreme court, you won

and reaffirm jefferson's ideals. are ties conversations of great minds i'm joined by dr corey robin dr robert is one of america's foremost scholars on contemporary forms of conservatism in american society has writings appear in the new york times harper's the london review and a variety of other publications he's widely recognized for his work his blog has been awarded the the char charm quirk or the third place award by three quarks daily best writing in politics and social science in two thousand and eight he was named a lawrence as rockefeller a visiting fellow and a fellow in the program an ethics and public affairs at princeton university currently he's an associate professor of political science at brooklyn college in the city university of new york graduate center and the author of multiple books including his most recent the reactionary mind conservatism from edmund burke to sir pale an actor corey robin thanks for joining us from our new york city studios tonight. thanks for having me shit what is what is c