let's go to jeffery cramer, former u.s. assistant turn. big picture, what does this tell you?n infer a few things. mr. gates has gone through attorneys beforehand. looks like there's a seed change here with a handful of lawyers leaving and more coming in and perhaps he's trying to reach an agreement with mr. mueller. >> shepard: remind us what the beef is with gates. >> sure. in a nutshell, with gates and manafort, it's money laundering. mr. manafort was active overseas along with collecting money in the ukraine and other parts of the caucus states. set up companies overseas. the money was deposited in the companies and brought to the u.s. in the forms of property transactions and buying luxury items: there's a tax allegation that he didn't declare it. >> it's interesting the investigators have hired a number of prosecutors who specialize in money laundering. >> that's not a coincidence certainly. these guys have been down this road before. if you look at this case, the mueller team moved very quickly, this is a somewhat complicated case to put together. you have to get record

let's go to jeffery cramer and former u.s. assistant attorney general. what do these indictments say to you? >> a few things. first, i think it's safe to say that you can put the phrase "russian hoax" to the side. that's been established. the other thing that struck me after a couple readings of the indictment is how well-coordinated they were. >> shepard: incredible. >> it's been years. they set up what they needed to set up with respect to servers. they figure out how to get the money in. mueller did a good job of tieing that individual up with a bow and a plea agreement. and they played the lawn game. if this wasn't disrespected, this would have continued going forward. if you have to look at it stepping back for a second, as any sort of conspiracy, very well constructed, very well-funded and very well-executed. >> shepard: and out of moscow. the bot farm is in st. petersburg but the money is coming from vlad. >> it's safe to say. there's some things that looks like they had russian corporate records which usually in this case, a mutual lateral assist

jeffery cramer is here, a former federal prosecutor. managing director at berkeley research group. good to see you. >> good afternoon. >> shepard: what is at stake here? you know rick gates -- you don't cop a plea if you don't have something to give. they don't give that out. where are we? >> that's right. you can plead guilty and just basically throw yourself at the mercy of a judge as far as sentencing. clearly there's a door left open here for the prosecution to come back and give at least a concession, if you will, based upon cooperation. so there's a flurry of activity the last 24 hours. the most recent indictments put pressure on gates. >> shepard: and i'm reading reports. looks like you made money overseas. you don't have to pay taxes on monday on that. whoa! if you make money and you're an american, you have to report it. if you put it in off-shore accounts and you pretend you're getting a loan and you weren't and you have a conspirator, which is what was alleged here, you go to prison bigly. unless they have something big to give, that's what the government will do. but yo