jennifer rubin, stuart stevens, thank you very much for coming to the last word. >>> coming up, on the day trump took his hannibal lector stick to the national convention stage, vice president, harris was campaigning in north carolina. the chair of the north carolina democratic party, anderson clayton, joins us next. >> north carolina, i think it is clear. if donald trump were to win in november, he will continue to sell out working families. he will continue to attack reproductive freedom, and he will continue to undermine our democracy. look at that! the heavy duty cloths are extra thick, for amazing trap & lock. even for his hair. wow. you'll love swiffer or your money back. can you do this? as early as your 40s you may lose muscle and strength. protein supports muscle health. ensure max protein has a 30 gram blend of high quality protein to feed muscles for up to seven hours. so take the challenge. ensure, nutrition for strength and energy. always dry scoop before you run. listen to me, the hot dog diet got me shredded. it's time we listen to science. one a day is formulated with k

let's bring into the conversation the washington post opinion writer and msnbc political analyst jennifer rubins. tom and jennifer, i've been reading everything you published in the last week and despite the fact you don't have the same position on this, i think you would both agree and i will start with you tom, that the character is the issue to both think that we should think different things about whether joe biden should stay in the race but tom, you make clear, that character is the issue and everything needs to be done to ensure that donald trump is not the next president of the united states. >> yes. i think a lot of this debate has gotten off the rails with people not falling into an argument that because of, i think, legitimate concerns about whether joe biden can get through this campaign, i think he can do the job, but i think the campaign is different winning a campaign is different than doing the job, that somehow that means we are really having a debate about whether joe biden is better than donald trump. there is no question about it. joe biden is vastly better than donald trump

let's bring into the conversation jennifer rubin plus staff writer for the atlantic tom nichols. l staying with us as well. look. tom and jennifer, i've been reading everything you published in the last week and despite the fact that you don't have the same position on this, i think you would both agree, i will start with you, tom, that the character is the issue. you both think we should think different things about whether joe biden should stay in the race but tom, you made clear that character is the issue and everything needs to be done to ensure donald trump is not the next president of the united states. >> right. i think a lot of this debate has gotten off the rails with people now going into an argument that because of i think legitimate concerns about whether joe biden can get through this campaign, i think he can do the job but i think the campaign is different and winning a campaign is different than doing the job that somehow that means we are really having a debate about whether joe biden is better than donald trump. there's no question about it. joe biden is vastly b

and jennifer rubin, an opinion columnist at the washington post. she is the host of the podcast jen rubens greenroom, and is an msnbc political analyst. thank you for being here. it stuart, i am just going to put this image of the trump marquee last night. and say your thoughts? >> look, i watched that last night and i saw a party that i used to work in applaud a wife beater introducing a man who has down found liable of sexual assault, and it turned my stomach. it is an extraordinarily low moment in american politics. i have zero respect for anyone who stood and applauded while a wife beater introduced a man found guilty or liable of sexual assault. just think about that. that's the same convention that applauded it jd vance, who was endorsed, this is the first time in american history, by a kremlin official, with genocide hanging all over him. endorsed a presidential, vice presidential candidate. i mean, this is just stuff that is unimaginable. and it's not funny, it's not cute. i have no desire to meet these people halfway. the only way you can

jonathan: let's go to the opinion side of the washington post where we will find columnist jennifer rubin and contributing colonists. welcome to this live e dish a first look. -- live edition of first look. the day before the press conference, peter welch wrote an op-ed calling on president biden to end his reelection campaign. he wrote i understand why president biden wants to run. he saved us from donald trump once and wants to do it again but needs to reassess if he is the best candidate to do so. in my view he is not. we have asked president biden to do so much for so many for so long, it has required unmatched selflessness. we need him to put us first. last night, two minutes after president biden's press conference, a democrat in connecticut called on president biden to drop out of the race. your thoughts on what democrats are doing and whether the press conference will stabilize things. >> there are two sides that are both sincere and scared stiff the donald trump would come back to office but do not agree on whether it is biden or biden? , biden successor. it is not perfect knowle