us now, msnbc legal correspondent lisa rubin, "new york times" reporter and msnbc contributor jeremy peters, staff writer at the new yorker, usan glasser and cornell belcher. jeremy, pam bondi has been on the trump scene now for a while. we watched her defend him in the impeachment hearings, after the 2020 election crisscrossing states like pennsylvania, trying to prove that there was fraud alongside rudy giuliani and, you know, it goes back even to 2013, donald trump made a $25,000 donation to an association having to do with her governorship, and she didn't -- she declined to prosecute the trump university case. that was a big scandal back then. how was she not the first choice for ag? given how close she is, she's a floridian, donald trump is surrounding himself with floridians, why are we hearing about her now? first time we heard about her is when he announced she would be ag for him. >> it is always potentially a mistake to attribute any type of motives and strategory to trump's machinations. nominating matt gaetz was always going to be difficult, that they never really thought it was

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joining me is the reporter on that story, jeremy peters, with "the new york times" as well as being anibutor. one activist said as painful as mr. trump's election may be for transgender people, their movement should see the benefit in treating skeptic less like enemies and more like future allies. tell us more. >> there is always tension in any civil rights movement about how far to go, how aggressively to push your case, and the gay rights movement was no different. there were a lot of people who were very hard line and thought provocation and confrontation worked. many others who didn't. in the transgender rights community, they're having the same discussion and the truth of the matter is according to the folks i interviewed is they're losing, they're losing quite badly. they're losing in the court of public opinion, more and more people are saying that they do not support transgender rights and, in fact, believe the movement has gone too far in its tactics and losing the legislative level. they have now 26 states, i believe, that have enacted laws restricting transgender care in som

jeremy peters is a reporter and contributor. great to have you all here. hearing about all of this from team trump? >> there are a number of these figures who have identified themselves publicly, but we believe there were others that were named to the cabinet are other senior positions who have also experienced this. tom homan did not say that he had a threat made against him in this instance, but he has experienced that broadly that he was reacting to. the trump transition considers this a serious matter because of course it causes great distress and concern for the assembled team of donald trump, the president elect. the president-elect and vice president elect not included in this so it is really the senior staff level of those expected to be part of the next administration. would officials have told us is these messages were delivered via email and social media direct messages. because of that, there is a way for investigators to try to identify the source. we will have to see how that plays out. it was local law enforcement in a number of communities

jeremy peters, you're writing about democrats here.s to change. is this a party with the will and the ability to take that long look and make some kind of appeal to the voters who are abandoning them? >> i think in order to do that, they need to convince their consulting class that that's not something that is exclusionary or discriminatory or racist to do, to have these questions about why it is that the less focus on identity of race, of gender, of religion, why this is all -- why it's been framed through that lens for so long. voters of color are rejecting that. i mean, i remember reporting a story when kamala harris first got the nomination, where we went out and talked to a lot of black voters, a lot of la latino voters. we asked one about harris' identify and she said, i can see she's black. i don't need her to tell me that. another one who realized that was kamala harris. she didn't talk about that. but i think what the republicans have been able to effectively do, because democrats spent so much time talking about identity, gen

new york times reporter jeremy peters. good to have all of you. vaughn, so what do these choices tell us about donald trump's mindset and how he is moving through this process? >> it tells us he was willing to name his top diplomat as somebody who just years ago was highly critical of him. and the type of leadership that he represented. i'll leave it to jeremy to rehash his march of 2016 interview with marco rubio at the time. one i referred back to on the news he would be the intended pick of secretary of state. at one point it was marco rubio highly critical of donald trump's leadership. we saw the one hawkish senator on iran, chain, cuba take a softer approach. it was more representative of the trump foreign policy agenda the last two years. one that led him from in 2018, being highly critical of the trump administration's decision to remove u.s. troops out of syria. openly critical of the trump administration's decision to hear over the course of the last year, suggesting the way to end russia's war in ukraine is to come up with a settlement a

.>> jeff, thank you, jeremy peters, thank you both so much, really appreciate it. for more on the possibility of rfk junior leading hhs, i'm joined by white house policy director in the obama administration, it is always great to see you, i want to start by playing some of what rfk junior has said in the past.>> there's no vaccine that is safe and effective.>> 25% of americans who believe that they know somebody who was killed by a covid vaccine. 25% of americans.>> are there specific vaccines that you would seek to take off the market?>> i'm not going to take away anybody's vaccines, i have never been anti-vaccine. >> you will not take away any vaccine that is currently on the market? >> if vaccines are working for somebody, i'm not going to take them away.>> you would seek to ban fluoride in the water supply? >> and the faster it goes out, the better, i'm not going to compel anybody to take it out.>> hhs is one of the largest federal agencies, as a $3 trillion budget and 80,000 federal workers, what is your biggest concern about this?>> just the undermining of pu

we begin with kristin welker, vaughn hillyard, and jeremy peters. you spoke with president-elect trump by phone exclusively yesterday about that mass deportation plan, the policy he announced. he made a lot of news. told you he has been on the phone with world leaders who have been burning up the phone lines overseas. >> he said the calls keep coming in. he said he has spoke within netanyahu, not a surprise. the leaders of france, italy, eu. he has spoken to president zelenskyy at the time of the call yesterday. he had not spoken with president putin then. he has said he wants to end the war in ukraine within 24 hours. hasn't told us details. that suggests ukraine would give up territory. highly controversial for some. putin did congratulate him publicly. i did push for details on his mass deportation plan. what would it look like? how much would it cost? as you say, he said, there's no price tag. we have no choice. he did really lean into the idea that he believes he has a mandate and signalled this is something he would start to tackle on day one.

"the new york times" reporter jeremy peters is joining us to talk about this.who were less engaged voters were republican voters and less likely to have college degrees. how does that square what we saw throughout the campaign? >> i think it helps explain, peter, the way that a lot of voters seem to be able to discount the fact that trump has been impeached twice and indicted four times and investigated, god knows how many other times, for various improprieties and illegalities inside and outside of office. i think if you're not following that day in and day out, you are either, you know, the type of person who probably was likely or maybe more likely than most to vote for him. any way. you were sick of hearing all about it, therefore you tune out that type of news altogether. or you just have a lot of other things going on in your life. there are plenty of people out there who don't follow politics as obsessively as we do and those people often get overlooked in the interviews that all of us journalists do when we are trying to find out which way the wind is b