change in america are we moving in the direction of a police state for more on this i'm joined by jim cavanaugh columnist reasoning contributor to hit and run jim welcome. good to be here tom thanks it is part of education so go ahead. they i mean it sorry that's on such under such terrible conditions the story of. in arizona is just absolutely an incredible tragedy if i might correct two point one one point it wasn't sixty rounds in him it was seventy one rounds just discharged only twenty two of which hit him we got some photos yesterday of where the rest of the bullets went they went all over the house including the back bedroom where a four year old was hiding amazing now in this case today the department of education says it was a student loan raid the debt that led to the raid but what can possibly can anyone possibly do to the department of education i mean these are the people who issue student loans that would justify this kind of force and yeah i don't know i mean this is what's going to happen to children who get left behind from now on or something it's it's incredible what could it