i want to bring in jim cavanaugh, he's a former atf special agent. m, there's very little information as to who may have done this but looking at all the pieces that we've put together tonight, what are your first thoughts about the shooting? >> well you know obviously, betty, these officers are going to survive. that seems to be the case. they have serious injuries but they're in the trauma center. like the chief said they're conscious so that's the first thing. secondly is they appear to have an aggressive investigation ongoing, both from the detectives and patrol officers immediate response to try to locate the shooters. no doubt they've gathered some eye witness information, maybe some forensics, even a possibility that they could have recovered some shell casings and got some description. we haven't heard those facts yet, but certainly they went after it. they're trying to find out who the shooter is. you know you had on air the journalist who bradford -- >> bradley rayford, freelance journalist on the scene. >> bradley rayford, right. he gave a

jim cavanaugh, stand by.have much more to come right here on msnbc. ♪ (explosion) ♪ (explosion) ♪ lead your heroes in the hit mobile game! download heroes charge now! >>> we're continuing to follow breaking news out of ferguson missouri, two police officers have been shot, one in the face one in the shoulder. i want to take you to a press conference that happened earlier. this is the st. louis county police chief. >> i have captain nelson from the webster grove police department. at about 8:00 last night maybe sooner than that protesters arrived in front of the ferguson police department on south florisson road. i was able to monitor that and talk to my staff about what was going on. as far as the night goes probably 60, 70 people that were up there. it wasn't all that remarkable compared to some of the things that we have experienced over the last few months but there were quite a few people in the roadway, sidewalks, in front of the station, et cetera. there was a contingent of police officers that were up

. >> now, i want to bring in msnbc law enforcement analyst and former atf special agent jim cavanaughk you for being here jim. >> thanks rev. >> where does this investigation go from here? i mean what are authorities looking for? >> well they're looking specifically for was it a homicide or was it a suicide. you know, i would commend the sheriff in that he did everything right here. he noticed the scene looked suspicious, that there was nothing that mr. byrd had stepped off of. it looked kind of funny to him. he immediately called the mississippi bureau of investigation and the fbi jackson division, but he's got the forensic help with the medical examiner. he's done the right thing. he's not dismissed the history, the ugly history of mississippi. i used to be agent in charge of mississippi, i did a lot of church fires and bombings down there. i'm very familiar with the area. i commend the sheriff for that. the next step is what happened was it murder or was it suicide? that's what they got to find out. >> let's go through the timeline here, jim. on march 2nd, otis byrd was last seen b

. >> as the shootout rages, atf agent jim cavanaugh is already on the phone with the davidians tryingo gain a cease-fire. >> we were taking an awful beating. so many men were hurt and wounded and laying down there. when i called the compound, it was steven snyder. >> steven snyder was koresh's top lieutenant. >> he started screaming through the phone that we had no right to be there, to get off the property immediately. i tried to stay calm. i said, steve, we have to talk. we have to work this out. you and i have to work this out. people are dying. people are hurt. we need to stop the shooting. >> soon cavanaugh is talking directly with david koresh. >> everything's okay. just you and me are talking. that's the main thing. you care for people. you are sincere. >> i had a radio mic in one ear with an agent pleading for his life and i had this guy on the phone who thought he was god. >> checking now our top stories on prime news. in waco, texas, at least four federal agents are dead and 14 are injured in a shoot-out with members of a religious cult. >> it takes negotiators two and a hal

joining me now are jonathan capehart from "the washington post" and jim cavanaugh, msnbc law enforcement analyst. thank you both for being here. >> thanks rev. >> thanks reverend al. >> jim, here's the arsenal police found on gonzalez in the very first traffic stop. rifles, shotguns handguns loaded magazines. the secret service was warned should we be confident he'd be stopped now if something like this happened again? >> well with the latest revelations from "the washington post," reverend al i think we've got to be a little concerned here. i have a lot of faith in the service, but they're not showing us a lot of good operational tactics here surrounding the white house. look, you're right to point out the gonzalez case. here's how that should have went. the virginia state police stop him, he has 11 guns. they call atf they find out he's got a sawed-off shotgun, they notify the service. the service should have asked the u.s. attorney of virginia a warrant on the complaint of a sawed-off shotgun. as condition of release of his bail he shouldn't be near the white house. then if he showed

jim cavanaugh, thank you for your time this evening. >> thanks, rev. >>> coming up, earth to ted cruz bush. the affordable care act is working. a reality check is ahead. >>> plus caught on tape. saying "killed them all." will evidence from a tv show be admitted in the murder trial of robert durst? stay with us. most of the products we all buy are transported on container ships. before a truck delivers it to your store, a container ship delivered it to that truck. here in san diego, we're building the first one ever to run on natural gas. ships this big running this clean will be much better for the environment. we're proud to be a part of that. i have a cold with terrible chest congestion. better take something. theraflu severe cold doesn't treat chest congestion. really? new alka-seltzer plus day powder rushes relief to your worst cold symptoms plus chest congestion. oh, what a relief it is. here we go! ♪ i think about my early 20s and i think that i actually missed an opportunity there to experiment and fail and experiment and fail you know i really admire my mother despite what peo

. >> thank you trymaine lee and jim cavanaugh. >>> when we return hillary clinton's e-mails. republicans in congress want more answers than she's willing to give them. "hardball" returns after this. discover card. hey! so i'm looking at my bill and my fico® credit score's on here. we give you your fico® score each month for free! awesomesauce! wow! the only person i know that says that is...lisa? julie?! at discover, we treat you like you'd treat you. get the it card and see your fico® credit score. >>> hillary clinton yesterday asked the country to trust her. she asked the american people friends and skeptics alike to believe her about only protecting her private mail. not anything related to her service as secretary of state. well, like everything else regarding secretary clinton, the issue is fraught with baggage, history and attitude of course. everyone figures they know something about her, some insight into who she is they think they see something of their own challenges in life a woman of a high-spirited marriage and top office of the land. if it's a challenge to be hi