joining me now is democratic congressman jim himes of connecticut.ou about. we've been talking tonight a bit about the legal and constitutional questions surrounding elon musk. but i wanted to ask you, given some of the headlines i just outlined there about, you've been working in intelligence for ten years now, right? how do people overseas look at this and look at the vulnerabilities that we might be creating? >> you know, it's a great question. >> and i'll tell you, i'm more concerned now. >> than i have been in a. >> very long time. let's let's start with russia and china. >> what are they seeing? >> they're seeing us, you know. >> attack mexico and canada. tariffs attack our allies. >> with steel and aluminum tariffs. china and. russia are saying, my god, the. >> united states is. >> going after. >> their own allies. not they're not coming after us. they're going. >> after terrorists and bad guys. >> right? right. >> now, i know this, they know this. >> the fbi. >> is in. >> turmoil, right? >> firings and purges. >> and, you know, kash patel, wh

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joining us now is congressman jim himes of connecticut.ittee, the top democrat on that committee. congressman himes, i really appreciate you making time tonight. thanks for being here. >> thanks for having me, rachel. >> i confess that i worried a lot about the legality of what it meant to be shutting down usaid. i worried about the false information and lies and the impact of that in terms of the ways they were describing what usaid is. i worried about the material impact of shutting down usaid programs that do good work and keep people alive. i before today had not yet let my brain go there, that we are inviting dictators and tyrannical regimes around the world to arrest and imprison people who are associated with usaid for the crime of working with the united states of america. the guardian reporting today on this scale has put a real chill through me, and i wanted to get your reaction to it. >> yeah, yeah. you know, i. >> mean, in. >> in inside. >> dc. >> circles, there's hard power. that's the military, the battleships, the f-35s, the

last year with the help of my colleague, intelligence committee ranking member jim himes of connecticut, i urged the national archives and records administration to release information that we believed would exonerate ethyl. working with robert and michael miripal, ethyl's sons, we helped shake loose a freedom of information act request for a crucial document written by a senior u.s. army code breaker and analyst, meredith knocks gardner, in 1950. in august, 2024, we finally secured the release of this document. and it confirm what had we suspected and what the miripal brothers have always known. regulatele rosingen -- ethyl rosenburg was not a spy. and not only that, the government knew that she was not a spy and executed her anyway. let me repeat that. this government, the united states government, knew way back then that she was innocent and executed her anyway. in fact, gardner explicitly wrote in his classified memo that ethyl, quote, did not engage in the work, meaning espionage, on behalf of the soafng yet union, herself -- soviet union, herself. end quote. and despite this concr

following yesterday's fbi firings, the top democrat on the house intelligence committee, senator jim himes, said that patel had, quote, misled the senate on his answers regarding the administration's plans for weaponizing the federal government. while there have been reports that some republican senators have privately expressed concerns about patel's fitness to head and head the fbi. no republican senator, unless this has happened in the last ten minutes, not one has publicly opposed his nomination yet. and as such. as of now, patel appears to be on track to be confirmed for the position of director of the fbi. for more on this, i'm joined by joyce vance, former united states attorney for the northern district of alabama. she's also a senior fellow at the brennan center for justice, co-host of the sisters in law podcast, and an msnbc contributor and columnist. tim weiner joins me, too. he's a pulitzer prize winning reporter and the award winning author of the books enemies a history of the fbi and legacy of ashes the history of the cia. he's got a book coming out as well, called the missi

and they should grab it and they should go on offense with it. >> congressman jim himes, i feel like if you. >> had a thought bubble above. >> your head, it would say, i'm trying, but you do have you do have some folks breaking through. stephen a smith over on hannity's show, of all places, saying hegseth is the real die hire. you have an fbi agent, fbi agent making a four minute video saying you want to get the bad guys. here's our top ten list, and here's who we get. real, real, real bad guys. and you have, you know, folks like yourself out there today on the cia story who stitches them all together and makes this argument to the american people. >> well, we. >> do, nicole. and sarah is absolutely right. i mean, you know, we do. >> need to. >> be be careful. we, the opposition, the democrats need to be careful because. >> every. >> day has a dozen things that we could chase. right. >> and that's that's very deliberate. right. in other words. >> if you're chasing everything, you're. >> chasing nothing. >> but national security. >> absolutely. >> people feel that in. >> their bones.

so congressman jim himes, who's the top democrat on the house intelligence committee, raising some of these concerns yesterday after this news broke. take a listen to what he said. >> certainly the ones that are operational, the case officers who are operating in very, very dangerous places around the world, they are living undercover if they are discovered, and especially those that don't have diplomatic immunity. i mentioned them earlier. you know, it can be curtains for them. it's just not that hard to convey classified information from one government department to the other. so we've put a lot of people needlessly at risk here. >> so in addition to the national security concerns that himes is raising there, he also raised concerns about sort of this happening against the backdrop of donald trump's sort of broader efforts to really downsize these agencies. this is something we're seeing at the cia. they've been similarly offered by the so-called buy outs like we've seen at other agencies. so it remains to be seen. but obviously, this move to send an unclassified email, really raisi

take a listen to what jim himes, the top democrat on the house intelligence committee, had to say whenhe was asked about this news just yesterday certainly the ones that are operational, the case officers who are operating in very, very dangerous places around the world, they are living undercover if they are discovered, and especially those that don't have diplomatic immunity. >> i mentioned them earlier. you know, it can be curtains for them. it's just not that hard to convey classified information from one government department to the other. so we've put a lot of people needlessly at risk here. >> so the cia saying it's just doing what trump directed them to do, trying to comply with this executive order. himes and other national security officials said that this was an unnecessary counterintelligence risk. >> zach cohen, thank you for that reporting, john. >> all right. it's impossible to unbreak the egg. new concerns over the privacy of u.s. citizens as elon musk's team gets access to sensitive treasury information. and this morning, new lawsuits after the president signed a new e

but one house democrat told me, jim himes, i asked him how hard they should fight this. what's going on? he said, as tragic as what is happening to usaid and our efforts abroad. i'm not sure that it hits many americans emotionally, certainly not outside the beltway, suggesting that they shouldn't make necessarily make this a red line. usaid funding in this battle to keep the government open. >> i mean, i think democrats have two things to figure out. and one is like, tactically, what what are their moves, right? can they block anything? can they slow it down? what would be the purpose of slowing it down? and then the second is the political argument, which is like, what are the messages that connect with americans? the republicans have figured out a message that connects with americans, which is that the idea that part of the reason why people feel like their taxes are high or things aren't working for them, is that the bureaucracy is bloated. this is a message that resonates with people. you can argue whether it's true. you can argue with whether gutting all this stuff